Right, MSM, Don’t Get It

Published December 12, 2005 in Iraq.

There’s a desire by the right and the mainstream media to portray anyone opposed to the Iraq war as a peacenik, but it isn’t true. There’s only a small segment of the population that’s reflexively against any and all military action, the vast majority of us see a need for it — but with that comes the responsibility to not lie your way into it and mismanage the conflict once you’re in it. Bush continues to fail on both counts every day.

21 Responses to “Right, MSM, Don’t Get It”

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1 dugger1
Dec 12th, 2005 at 7:12 pm

I don’t agree with ‘peaceniks’, but there is nothing evil or stupid about being against all conflict. It is unrealistic and could be very dangerous, but it is principled.
And no where, anyplace, any time, has one single lie been documented by Bush. Nor actually any mismanagement. People have certainly disagreed but as of this moment there is a democratic election going on.

Dugger
2 Oliver Willis
Dec 12th, 2005 at 8:12 pm

And no where, anyplace, any time, has one single lie been documented by Bush
LOL. I can’t argue with insane kool-aid drinkers like that.
3 JD
Dec 12th, 2005 at 8:12 pm

I would have to agree with Dugger insofar as the pacifist postion is a principled and consistent position.

What concerned me in that link was the author’s reference in regards to continuing to fight after we’ve lost. The author did not specify which conflict being referred to.

On one hand, the author wants us to believe that their defense position more closely aligns with Republicans, and then on the other hand, throws out the lied us into war, we have lost card.

Fairly difficult to reconcile those two postions, but if it can be done, I am open to understanding.
4 Ryland
Dec 12th, 2005 at 11:12 pm

Wow, if Oliver says it, you guys are reflexively against it. I’d like to see you post “pacifism is a principled and consistent position” on a right-wing blog.
5 Semanticleo
Dec 13th, 2005 at 12:12 am

Nor actually any mismanagement.

Wow
6 dugger1
Dec 13th, 2005 at 8:12 am

Ryland,

Wow, my *ss. Read this site much?? Understand what you read? Truly I disagree with OW a lot, but recently I agreed with him on torture and Wal Mart. There have been other occasions also.

Dugger
7 pionar
Dec 13th, 2005 at 12:12 pm

JD: “On one hand, the author wants us to believe that their defense position more closely aligns with Republicans, and then on the other hand, throws out the lied us into war, we have lost card.”

No, I don’t think they’re mutually exclusive. I agree with the author. I, too, believe in a strong national defense. However, I am against lying or misleading to get us to be in favor of a war.

Are you saying that Republicans are for lying? I hope not.
8 JK
Dec 13th, 2005 at 3:12 pm

>>Nor actually any mismanagement

I am now convinced that Dugger is Anne Coulter. Or Laura Ingraham, or X number of knee-droppers for Bush.

The idiocy of your opening salvo in this post astounds.

JK
9 JK
Dec 13th, 2005 at 3:12 pm

Dugger..just for kicks…go to Google, and type in “Iraq war mismanagement,” and see how many hits you get.

Moron.

JK
10 meade
Dec 13th, 2005 at 3:12 pm

Bush’s approval rating was above 85% about the time we attacked Afghanistan.

Many of us so called “peaceniks” were 100% (maybe not that strong) behind Bush until he went off on the Iraq/911/Saddam mis-information campaign.
11 buma
Dec 13th, 2005 at 3:12 pm

Actually OW, it’s entertainment. Look at this phrase:

And no where, anyplace, any time, has one single lie been documented by Bush.

Not ‘one single’ lie. Documented — by Bush yet!
12 buma
Dec 13th, 2005 at 4:12 pm

Woah, JK. Dugger is much too femme to be Coulter.
13 Dugger
Dec 13th, 2005 at 4:12 pm

So JK, if I can Google something and get hits, its true? Is that how it works? Lets see. Lets Google “assassinate Wellstone”. Why those dastardly Republicans! And JK did you know the CIA framed Ted Kennedy at Chappaquidick. Don’t doubt it!! Just Google.

Dugger, Not One Single Lie Documented, Not One
14 JK
Dec 13th, 2005 at 7:12 pm

Dugger…you don’t get off that easy, simpleton.

You stated in your opening post, above that there is no documentation of “mismanagement” of the Iraq war.

That is why I encouraged you to do a Google search. There are VOLUMES of articles, quotations, policy statements, and essays..that DETAIL this administration’s mismanagement of the Iraq war. Many of them are from members his own party!

Do you say such things just to be provacative? Or, are you really that dumb?

I bet the answer is B.

Dugger…even from a practical standpoint, there is almost certainly “documentation” of mismanagement at your local Burger King.

To boldly declarle that an entire war hasn’t been mismanaged, at least on some level, is the sign of a true cultist.

I think you need to take a serious look at what you believe and why.

JK
15 dugger1
Dec 14th, 2005 at 8:12 am

JK, Get a grip. Grow up. I told you once , being in Google doesn’t mean its true. See the example about the CIA and Ted Kennedy at Chappaquidick. If you want to say there is criticism of Bush for mismanagement. Fine. So what? There is also praise for management. Which do we choose? The ones that agree with you? What definitive source has doceumented mismanagement by Bush in Iraq. BTW, since Iraq is ongoing and the outcome not clear, it would be hard for anybody to be credibly definitvie. And wipe that snot from your nose.

Dugger, These Kids Today!
16 Semanticleo
Dec 14th, 2005 at 9:12 am

Dugger;

since Iraq is ongoing and the outcome not clear,

So, if I drop some eggs on the floor and spill some flour and sugar on the mess: a cake may be the result?
17 Dugger
Dec 14th, 2005 at 11:12 am

The outcome of Iraq is unclear. There have been some major successes: Saddam is gone, there have been elections, people are now arguing about how to create a democratic society (thats good), among others. Concerns certainly remain. There is still insurgency. What will the long term health of the government be? How will the various denominations get along when there is disagreement and the US not there? Are the religious extremists too entrenched and in a position to reasssert influence once we leave. I don’t know and none of you know. There are military strategists who have said we need more troops and ones that have said we are at the right levels. As I said, no hardcore, independent establishment of “mismanagement”. Also no lies ever, ever documented.

Dugger
18 Semanticleo
Dec 14th, 2005 at 11:12 am

no hardcore, independent establishment of mismanagement

It is hard to imagine you amending your position no matter how many instances of documented ‘mismangement’ of the war be listed here.

You are an intelligent, sober individual who has his own laundry list of
civilian command/control incompetence. Methinks they are behind the
dugger firewall semantics of ‘hardcore’ and ‘independent’.
19 Dugger
Dec 14th, 2005 at 1:12 pm

Semant,
I am unaware that I made a, well , semantical distinction. However you wish to phrase it my point is that mismanagement at this point is purely an opinion which will be verified or shot down by future events in Iraq. And no amount of Google opinion, masquerading as fact, can change that . The outcome is still in doubt.

Dugger
20 Semanticleo
Dec 14th, 2005 at 4:12 pm

Dugger;

I am suggesting that you have your list of incompetence or

‘mismanagement’, card- filed in your fleshy hard drive. We don’t have
to wait until the end of the war to document those ‘Keystone Kop’ moments, do we? The semantics I refer to (hardcore and independent) channel the subject into one which only dugger can presume to interpret. Or are you denying you have your own negative assesment of the civilian ‘management’ of the war in Iraq?
21 Dugger
Dec 16th, 2005 at 9:12 am

I have to qualify to an extent because there is for sure accusations of mismanagement against Bush. The existence of accustaions does not equal fact.

Dugger