Time To Stop Tyranny
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Facebook: 1 Million Strong Against our SOCIALIST Fire Departments
For too long now, fire departments across the United States have been socialist organizations, resulting in taxes on the American people.
FACT: Most Americans never use the socialized services of the fire department. The Obama administration has been very clear about keeping the status quo when it comes to taxpayer-funded fire departments.
It is time to open the fire department up to private industry. We have the best fire departments in the world in the US, but that doesn’t mean that anyone (even non-US citizens) should be able to dial up and have fires put out, etc. There are private companies (Halliburtion, Etc.) who could step in tomorrow and take over every fire department in America and charge the consumer directly.
This is AMERICA. NO FREE FIRE SAFETY.
90 Responses to “Time To Stop Tyranny”
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Not to mention that those who have no houses or property do not benefit at all from fire department services. Sheesh!
Riiiiight,
Hey I don’t use the Police lets pay for play them too.
Caller: Someone has just kidnapped my daughter and stole my car.
Operator: OK sir that will be $4500.00 for the first 30 minutes, will that be Visa, Discover or American Express?
I’ll join the group…..just as soon as I begin a Facebook account. I’m tired of paying for people that shouldn’t have been smoking in bed. It’s time for folks to pull themselves up by their bootstraps and buy a hose and fire extinguisher.
Operator: OK sir that will be $4500.00 for the first 30 minutes, will that be Visa, Discover or American Express?
Sort of like when they wheel you into the emergency room spurting blood from a compound fracture and make you fill out twelve insurance forms before sending you a bill the size of the GNP of Peru.
For-profit healthcare roolz – why not for-profit copcare?
Hilarious. Thanks Odub.
Sweet.
Anybody who’s willing to work hard in this country should easily be able to afford his own fire truck and dalmatian. Trouble is some people would rather suck on the fire-hydrant tit of the nanny state than work hard.
You know what burns me? Roads. Fucking Obamahitler government intruding into our lives and building roads so I can get to work and to the store. (Actually, since I’m a conservative blogger, I don’t have a job.)
Fucking intrusive government. I just finished “Atlas Shrugs” and my mom just brought a grilled cheese sandwich down to the basement and I’m going to blog about Obamahitler Socialist roads!
Suicida| just proved he can’t even buy a clue.
Sort of like when they wheel you into the emergency room spurting blood from a compound fracture and make you fill out twelve insurance forms before sending you a bill the size of the GNP of Peru.
Hysterical much?
If you’re spurting blood from a compound fracture, they’re NOT gonna have you spurt that blood all over their twelve insurance forms. They’re going to treat you first, no conditions. Later, they’ll be thinking about who’s going to pick up the costs of all the people, supplies, and infrastructure that just saved your life from that compound fracture.
And then they’ll yank your tonsils and amputate your foot just to pad out the bill.
J.
Wow, sounds like Jay doesn’t care for the American health-care system.
Good thing we’re going to get health-care reform, and he’ll eagerly support it!
I have tremendous respect and appreciation for the American health care system. It is the envy of the world.
I would like to see some serious reforms in the American health care FINANCING system.
Sadly, the proposals being tossed around by the Obamoids will, in all likelihood, wreck the health care system.
J.
“It is the envy of the world.”
No, it’s not. Canadians, the English, the French, and other countries with first-world, government subsidized health-care think the American system is a cruel and inhumane joke.
But you keep telling yourself the lies that you take comfort it. Your head would explode if you finally had to face reality.
Jaim, maybe you can’t see it from the other side of the world, but there is a difference between the health care system and the health care financing system. Since you don’t have to deal with either, I can understand your confusing the two, but you really ought to educate yourself just a smidgen before you go around spouting your nonsense.
J.
So you admit the health-care financing system in America needs to be fixed. (I prefer the term “access” myself, but it boils down to the same thing.)
Interesting.
My biggest concern with the American system is that it tries to reconcile a for-profit model with nasty things like car crashes, genetic disorders, and diseases. A private model has no interest in covering a person who’s known to be sick, or who’s even a potential risk to be sick.
The public option would ensure that a person can pay a reasonable amount for access to health-care in a situation where private insurers can only see an economic liability, not a sick person.
But I apologize for interrupting your semantic babble about health care vs. paying for health care. For a family with a sick kid, there’s really no difference.
Only fools say the system doesn’t need fixing. And only bigger fools say the system is so broken, it must be torn down and ANYTHING would be better.
The for-profit model is the one that best guarantees survivability of the system, innovations, improvements, and rewards for the most talented and dedicated people.
It needs tweaking, it needs improving, it needs reform.
The current plan goes far, far beyond that, and would wreck many parts that do work for many Americans.
J.
Well then maybe the conservatives should have reformed the system during there 6 long years of one party rule OR not dismally lost an election where the opposing party’s candidate ran openly on this very issue. Sorry to inform you Jay Tea but you had your chance. And your record of being consistantly wrong over the past several years means that no one is interested in taking your advice in health care reform.
Translated Tea:
Whooahh, slow down there! We’ve only been discussing healthcare reform since 1946! Let’s implement these more reasonable GOP ideas…..as soon as they come up with some!
I’ve been greatly enjoying the robust, earnest debate on health care reform. I particularly appreciated how, when the CEO of Whole Foods (an exceptionally liberal and enlightened fellow, judging by his corporate policies) put forth some ideas, the tolerant, open left started organizing boycotts of his company.
I don’t see what the holdup is for your brilliant ideas. Your side has a sufficient majority in both Houses and the presidency; what’s taking you so long?
Oh, yeah, you need a few Republicans along for the ride to serve as scapegoats
ifwhen it blows up and leaves us all totally fucked.Well, all but the oligarchs in DC who, like so many other wonderful schemes they put forth, exempt themselves.
J.
“OR not dismally lost an election where the opposing party’s candidate ran openly on this very issue.”
That’s not what he ran on in the general election. He ran as a tax-cutting Conservative (“What I’ve proposed is a net spending cut.”)
We need to take this health care reform slowly and not ram it down Americans’ throats. There is a lot of controversy. Surely we need to schedule health care reform for approximately December of 2012 to do it right.
Gorgon, the all-volunteer fire department in my city would say, quite rightly, that they’re a real fire department, with fire stations, fire trucks, training, and equipment. And the communities without doctors would say it’s a very good analogy.
Let’s listen to Jay, he knows what he’s talking about:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_health_care
Jay Tea:
“I have tremendous respect and appreciation for the American health care system. It is the envy of the world.”
In the real world, the US health care system in ranked 37th. Just so you know…
Some communities don’t have fire departments.
But the vast majority do. Even volunteer fire departments have expenses, and very few are maintained solely by voluntary subscription.
Τhe point is when citizens do get together and decide to use common funds to provide a common benefit, such as fire departments and police departments, nobody screams OMG, TEH SOSHALIMSMS!!! But for some reason health care is different. Maybe it has to do with the obscene profits involved in the current system.
The analogy is quite good.
Sadly, the proposals being tossed around by the Obamoids will, in all likelihood, wreck the health care system.
What liberals propose is to move to the sort of health care that works pretty well in other parts of the world, but that for some reason Jay Tea and his ilk think that we Americans are too incompetent and corrupt to pull off.
Meanwhile the proposal that the republicans seems to be devoting the most energy to is “humiliate Obama so we can get back into power and continue the rapid strides toward health care reform that we accomplished during eight years of Reagan, four years of Bush I, twelve years of congressional control from 1994-2006 and eight years of Bush II.”
Pardon us, Jay Tea, if we don’t automatically attribute a lot of wisdom and good faith to your assertions on this issue.
Oh, and as Gorgon pointed out, the major flaw with this comparison is that fire departments are entirely the creature of local governments (with some state regulation thrown in). There is no federal Department of Fire Prevention that sets up fire stations in accordance with congressional mandates, no fire stations filled with federal employees, and no Czar Of Keeping Shit From Burning Up.
As far as the US health care system goes… there’s one nation where people come to more than any other nation for health care, one nation above all others where would-be doctors come for their training and education. And it ain’t Cuba, despite what Michael Moore might try to tell you.
J.
Europeans have to see us as a nation of lunatics. Of course, we don’t HAVE a working class, and the union movement died years ago, but to witness hordes of potential beneficiaries questioning whether a public health care option is the right way to go has got to be BIZARRE. Please, sir, this helping is too large! I demand it be returned to the pot!
Give more to the banks and corporations, maybe, but help US? We say NO!
In the real world, the US health care system in ranked 37th. Just so you know…
Bullshit! You damn socialist liar. Everyone knows we’re the best in the world (just because we are, SO THERE!)
USA USA USA!!!
Anyone else also sick of Obama’s socialization of the air? You want fresh air, you PAY FOR IT. No free lunch and there’s certainly no right to fresh air in the constitution.
Why stop at fire departments? Privatize the damn army!
Fair’s fair, bozo. A lot of Americans think Europe is a continent of lunatics.
Don’t make me cite evidence…
J.
(OK, here’s one: soccer riots.)
A lot of Americans think Europe is a continent of lunatics
This being mostly your own ilk who think it would be a great thing if we wiped every other country off the planet (“CUZ WE’RE #1 DAMMIT AND PLAN TO STAY THAT WAY!!!!!”)
That’s a sad, sad little world you live in, dura, with your simplistic stereotypes and hateful, bigoted projections…
Try the real world some time. You might even like it.
J.
That’s a sad, sad little world you live in, dura, with your simplistic stereotypes and hateful, bigoted projections…
Try the real world some time. You might even like it.
HAHAHAHAHA
The pot calling the kettle black…gotta love it
The more I think about it, I LIKE the fire department analogy. People at the community level make the decisions, the state offers support, and the federal government stays the fuck out of the whole equation.
Thanks, Oliver. This is a pretty good point you raise.
J.
Jay, for all the vaunted prowess and skill of our health care providers, most of it is inaccessible to millions of Americans because it is too expensive. Not every working person has employer insurance, and many insurance policies are too expensive for individual coverage. Even then, there are many horror stories of insurance companies suddenly deciding not to cover an expensive treatment when you actually need it.
What is being proposed will not hurt doctors, or hospitals, or nurses; their jobs will be fine. It’s the middle men, the insurance companies, who mainly object. They don’t want to compete against a truly public option, so they are rallying every favor they have to push against it.
And that’s bothersome to me. These companies are deliberately distorting a proposal that would benefit the lives of millions, because they want to be profitable without doing anything new. I didn’t vote for those clowns, and I’m sort of pissed that they have chosen this path.
Oh, and as Gorgon pointed out, the major flaw with this comparison is that fire departments are entirely the creature of local governments (with some state regulation thrown in). There is no federal Department of Fire Prevention that sets up fire stations in accordance with congressional mandates, no fire stations filled with federal employees, and no Czar Of Keeping Shit From Burning Up.
That has nothing to do with the fact that fire department tend to be a) funded through general community revenues and b) cover everyone in the community yet c) are not decried as soSShalinaziizim!!1! by the hope-he-fails crowd.
The federal vs. local thing is a total red herring, but even there missed the broadside of the barn by a mile, Jay. First off, local administration of fire prevention works because early on a general consensus developed that if we have the ability to put out fires, it’s kind of obscene to deny that ability to members of the community who can’t pay the full price of it, or to those who build houses out of flammable materials like wood, or to those who have suffered from fires in the past. That kind of consensus has eluded us in health care. Probably because powerful monied interests have come to realize that there are vastly greater opportunities for profit in health care than there are in fire prevention.
Banterer, I don’t disagree with a single complaint of yours. (Well, I don’t quite buy “millions” number, but I’ll let that slide.)
Where I disagree is with the solution.
How did the government manage “cash for clunkers?” Dealers across the nation are on the arm for tons of that cash, and the government is sitting on its thumbs in paying out. At the last minute, they pulled air traffic controllers in to help process the reams and reams of paperwork.
How’s the VA program working out? Tons of horror stories. The latest: employees get big bonus checks, veterans wait for their compensation checks.
How’s the BIA health program? “Don’t get sick in the summer.”
How’s the postal service working out? Seven billion deficit this year, another seven billion projected next year.
Most Americans are, overall, satisfied with their health insurance. Not necessarily thrilled, but satisfied.
I have no faith in the ability of the government to keep that true while trying to “fix” the system. And I don’t understand how anyone else could think that the same bureaucrats who have screwed up so many other things to get this most important one right.
J.
Oh joy, since JT got fired from yet another paid gig, we get more of him. Great.
The more I think about it, I LIKE the fire department analogy. People at the community level make the decisions, the state offers support, and the federal government stays the fuck out of the whole equation.
Well done, Jay, you’re coming along! If community based health care could operate on the same contract as most fire departments: community funded, affordably priced, available to all, no exclusions or rescissions, no costly overhead for marketing and actuarial chicanery, then I agree with you – that would be the way to go. Unfortunately, the way the system has developed only the state and, increasingly, the federal government has anywhere near the power needed to swim against the tide of the for-profit health care behemoth.
The local/federal is NOT a red herring, Wilbur. If my selectman screws over the fire department (or does anything else I disapprove of), I can tell him so at the store, on the phone, at church, or anywhere else our paths cross. My congressman (Paul Hodes) is holding precisely one public meeting, in the nice, cozy, controlled environment of a union hall.
It’s about public accountability. The higher the level of government, the less accountability there is.
J.
I don’t understand how anyone else could think that the same bureaucrats who have screwed up so many other things to get this most important one right.
The country that planned the Normandy Invasion and put men on the moon is completely incompetent? Your lack of patriotism is apparent.
Good thing you didn’t have a vote in those events, with your “We CAAAAN’T do it” attitude. You would have pointed to the cost and complexity of WW II and bailed out, and Germany would own Europe to this day.
What kind of job do you have that permits you to be afraid of a challenge? Would you consider health care for everyone a positive development or not?
Okay, Jay, if I hear you correctly it would be fine with you if individual communities, as opposed to the federal government, adopted a (soSShalinazizzmistiKKK!!!) healthcare system along the lines of their fire companies: ones where health care is a) funded from general revenue b) provided to all regardless of income level or past history c) reasonably priced.
Now suppose your community got together and decided they were going to do that. How would they bring it about? c) is the toughest one of course, since few local communities have the bargaining or enforcement power to effect prices much, yet without c), a) and b) are going to be impossible.
Come on, seriously, what are your ideas for making that happen? Because if it could happen all over the country without federal intervention I would be a very happy camper.
One of the best things about electing Obama is it has finally forced the right wingers to get off their asses and start thinking creatively about some important issues.
No, Wilbur, you’re not hearing me correctly. I’m pointing out how the fire department analogy is flawed — and having a laugh or two in the process.
As far as Obama getting credit for it… well, as Samuel Johnson once said, “nothing focuses the attention quite like the walk to the gallows,” and Sir Winston famously observed “nothing in life is quite so exhilarating as to be shot at without effect.” I guess you could call it a “scared straight” phenomenon…
J.
The analogy only works to a point, but in the real world, the one where unemployed cheetoh-munchers like Jay Tea don’t live, we employers pay both for the houses that have fire protection and those in which they don’t.
Jay the unemployed Teabagger said
A lot of Americans think Europe is a continent of lunatics.
A lot of Americans think Sarah Palin is qualified to be president.
A lot of Americans think angels exist.
A lot of Americans think the Earth is 6000 years old
A lot of Americans think Obama isn’t a US Citizen.
No wonder you cannot keep any gig as a writer, Teabag. You’re a joke, and you can’t even pen one decently.
Forget the fire department! When are the right-wing losers going to “go Galt” on the highway system? Damn federal program sucking up all our money, and they order all their stuff online and never leave mom’s basement anyways! WOLVERINES!!!!
Oh, zadura, burn… if I had pigtails, you’d be dunking them in the inkwell. You make me positively blush.
I’d be far more impressed if you could turn off the attacks and instead put up some arguments in favor of the side you take.
The more you don’t, the more I am convinced that you can’t rationalize your positions, so you compensate by taking shots at any who might challenge your beliefs.
Now run along, there’s a boycott of Whole Foods that won’t man itself. And it’s not like you likely have productive, private-sector jobs you have to go to anyway…
J.
So who fired you this time Jay Tee?
Why so concerned, Burn? You wanna offer me a job?
If so, no thanks. I deal with enough assholes already; I don’t need to work with someone called “burning sensation.”
J.
You really should ask yourself sometime JT, why is it that I cannot keep a job for very long? Angry paranoid white men who use cliches and ten-cent stereotypes about ‘teh libruz’ are a dime a dozen these days. You’re going to have to try harder if you want to get $60 a column.
Good luck with your next job search.
Thing is easy access to health care improves efficency and helps other nations punch higher than their weight. Much like freeways, subways, public education, customs, etc. There are things we can do as a nation to maintain our world standing in quality of life.
The did-nothing right wingers are upset that their perfect, imaginary version of health care reform isn’t being enacted even though they never even brought it up until Obama made health care reform a key element of his campaign.
Thing is we struggle for analogies for health care because it is so different than any other industry. Other countries that are still strong and capitalist have recognized that the free Market doesn’t behave properly when human life, death and health are involved and have provided systems for their citizens that allow them to have happier, healthier lives.
No, Wilbur, you’re not hearing me correctly. I’m pointing out how the fire department analogy is flawed — and having a laugh or two in the process.
In other words, you have no ideas, you just have fun shooting down the ideas of others. Typical republican.
As far as Obama getting credit for it… well, as Samuel Johnson once said, “nothing focuses the attention quite like the walk to the gallows,”
Well if the threat of the Obamamonster gets you guys thinking seriously about more “conservative” solutions that actually have a chance of working, I say terrific. Unfortunately I see little evidence that that is happening, only energetic and creative obstruction.
Whenever I hear that right wingers are brainstorming, my response is “what with?”
Other countries that are still strong and capitalist have recognized that the free Market doesn’t behave properly when human life, death and health are involved and have provided systems for their citizens that allow them to have happier, healthier lives.
This is really key, really important, and really overlooked. Human mortality is an externality which the Free Market does not account for. Right wiingers are too ideologically blind, stupid, or willfully ignorant (it’s a fine couple of lines) to understand this. But it’s important. I’m a big fan of the Free Market. Except when it doesn’t work because of externalities and the problems from the externalities are so great that non-market intervention is necessary. See also National Defense, Public Education, and Global Warming. See also Paul Krugman.
It is the envy of the WEALTHY PEOPLE IN THE world.
Fixed that for you, herr Tea.
I have no doubt that an extreme superminority of upper-middle-class to rich foreigners will come to the US if they need this or that complicated and extraordinarily expensive procedure. But, in general, your statement is looney tunes. Other systems see access as a key ingredient.
Burn, just passed 11.5 years at the Day Job, thank you for asking.
Good lord, I’ve worked for the same company for over a quarter of my life. Man, that’s depressing.
Parthenon, take your “Herr” and shove it up your ass. I thought better of you. Burn, Indeed, Wilbur — that’s typical of them.
“Trickle-down” is a proven principle in medicine — what’s available today for the ultra-rich is tomorrow’s common procedure. Bypasses, transplants, Lasik, joint replacements, genetic treatments — thousands of others are available first for the wealthy and the truly needy, then get amortized until they’re commonplace.
SOMEONE has to finance the expensive research and trials.
And yeah, people come to the United States for the complicated and expensive procedures — and they get them. How many other countries does that happen?
Well, we’re getting into “medical tourism” now, with some people going to India and other Asian places for procedures not approved or too expensive here in the US, but for cutting-edge stuff — it’s the US.
And to repeat: today’s cutting edge is tomorrow’s commonplace.
J.
JT, what is there to argue? You aren’t making any points. The analogy of the fire department doesn’t work but not for the reasons you’ve stated. It doesn’t work because my insurance premiums are subsidizing unemployed folks like you. If you were more gracious, you’d recognize this and at least be humble. Instead, you choose to be a jerk. It doesn’t stop me from wanting you to be covered but it does cause me to advocate for a better system. Frankly, as an employer, I would rather have single-payer. That’s the way the fire department does it.
I’m unemployed, Zad? When did that happen? Shit, then that means I put in five days at the day job FOR FREE!
Dang it, I’m always the last to know.
And no shit some employers would like single-payer. It’d take a huge burden off them. My employer spends a LOT on our health plan, and they’d love to dump it — if they thought they could.
And yeah, people come to the United States for the complicated and expensive procedures — and they get them. How many other countries does that happen?
A few relatively new “complicated and expensive” procedures and the laissez-faire Galtian paradises in which they were developed (repeating myself from a previous thread)…
in vitro fertilization: england
first CT scanner: england
heart transplant: south africa
cyclosporine: switzerland
face transplant: france
gamma knife: sweden
mri: US and Britain
coronary bypass surgery: argentina
The notion that such procedures would be unavailable and that medical innovation would screech to a halt without the obscene waste and imbalances of the US system, is ludicrous. But don’t let the facts get in the way of your prejudices, Jay.
Japan is also a leader in medical innovation and very capitalist and yet they have a syste. Somewhat similar to the public option proposed by the Democrats.
Parthenon, take your “Herr” and shove it up your ass. I thought better of you.
Not sure what you thought that meant. It was simply a good-natured variation on Quaker’s ‘Mr. Tea.’ Did I miss something? Are German words inherently insulting? WWII’s over, right?
For what it’s worth, however you took it wasn’t how I meant it.
World War II’s over, Parthenon, but accusations of Nazism are still in vogue. Considering that I thought you were Canadian and you have a Greek-origin name, a German term seemed out of character for you.
J.
Well for the record, I’m an American fan of classical history that finds nazi accusations extraordinarily repugnant, without exception. Glad that’s cleared up.
My apologies for my role in the misunderstanding, then, Parthenon.
J.
I have tremendous respect and appreciation for the American health care system. It is the envy of the world.
Well, maybe Slovenia.
As far as the US health care system goes… there’s one nation where people come to more than any other nation for health care, one nation above all others where would-be doctors come for their training and education. And it ain’t Cuba, despite what Michael Moore might try to tell you.
France?
Now run along, there’s a boycott of Whole Foods that won’t man itself.
Because everyone knows that boycotts are un-American.
I’ve been greatly enjoying the robust, earnest debate on health care reform. I particularly appreciated how, when the CEO of Whole Foods (an exceptionally liberal and enlightened fellow, judging by his corporate policies) put forth some ideas,
Just because they’re “ideas” doesn’t make them good.
And it’s not like you likely have productive, private-sector jobs you have to go to anyway…
Yes, it’s a shame that we’re not all being payed to troll internet message boards.
“Why stop at fire departments? Privatize the damn army!”
That’s exactly what Cheney did, and look at the results:
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20090817/scahill
How’s that free market working out for you, blog-less Jay?
Hey, take it easy on J. He thinks that in a single-payer health care system, it’s illegal to get any additional health care. Really. He does. Ask him.
Jay knows a lot about socialized medicine, that’s for sure.
JT, my apologies for suspecting you of joblessness. You spend a significant portion of your time on this site, which leads one to question how you could maintain a regular job. Notwithstanding, I would not be surprised if the “revolt” in favor of health care reform comes from small business. Not all of us are rabid anti-tax nuts. And I suspect that most of us are either paying a ton for health insurance (my family comes in at about $12,000 per year) or have discontinued employer coverage, which is bad social and public policy. Republicans had better watch who butters their bread on this one.
Jay Tea: The for-profit model is the one that best guarantees survivability of the system,
ANd it is the system’s survival which is paramount. Got it.
Jay Tea: The for-profit model is the one that best guarantees survivability of the system,
And it is the system’s survival which is paramount. Got it.
Sean, are you saying that the survival of the health care system is NOT critical?
Don’t tell me you’re going along with the conflating of the entire health care system with the discussion on reforming the health care financing system, Sean.
My biggest concern (and I think it’s shared by a lot of people) is the Obama financing reform plan will result in the old medical joke coming true: “the operation was a success, but the patient died.”
J.
The survival of Big Insurance is not critical.
We need a publc option for the un-insurable and we need single-payer. Let doctors make medical decisions, not lawyers.
The survival of Big Insurance is not critical.
No shit.
We need a publc option for the un-insurable and we need single-payer. Let doctors make medical decisions, not lawyers.
B does not follow A. “Let’s put the government in charge, so bureaucrats will make medical decisions.”
After all, the same bureaucrats did such a stunning job at the VA, the BIA, Cash for Clunkers…
J.
“Let’s put the government in charge, so bureaucrats will make medical decisions.””
That’s not how Medicare works. Doctors are still in charge of making decisions for their patients.
But please, don’t let facts get in the way of your hysterical shrieking.
It might have escaped your notice on the other side of the globe, Jaim, but more and more doctors are opting out of Medicare because they end up spending more in abiding by its regulations and filling out the paperwork than Medicare pays in reimbursement.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/02/business/retirementspecial/02health.html?_r=2&ref=health
Fine model you’re citing there, Jaim.
That’s how Medicare works.
“That’s how Medicare doesn’t work” would be more accurate.
J.
Uh, no.
Dear Mr. Hick:
Item:
Dispatch of one pumper unit to 123 Main St. 8/24/09:
$2500
Reimbursement denied.
Our records indicate you are responsible for any unreimbrsed costs. In order to avoid further action, please make arrangements to resolve this bill.
Yours truly,
Hometown FD
Don’t bother to click on Farris’s link, it isn’t even close enough to the topic to qualify as a red herring. It talks about deaths in a recent heat wave.
Yes, he is that stupid. He confuses proof of global warming with
proof that no one goes to france for medical care.
You can’t teach that, you have to be born that STUPID.
Don’t bother to click on Farris’s link, it isn’t even close enough to the topic to qualify as a red herring.
They’re all like that. S/he’s got nuthin’.
Oh, yes, that heat wave. The one that France was simply not equipped — socially, medically, or technologically — to handle.
It happened during the month when most of their medical establishment was on vacation. Along with most of the country. And while medical personnel were limited, by law, to 35-hour work weeks.
From that article:
The new estimate comes a day after the French Parliament released a harshly worded report blaming the deaths on a complex health system, widespread failure among agencies and health services to coordinate efforts, and chronically insufficient care for the elderly.
And this was “proof” of global warmening?
Thank heavens the incredibly tardy and mild summer we’ve had here in New England has disproven it.
J.
Jay Tea: Sean, are you saying that the survival of the health care system is NOT critical?
I’m saying I’m far less concerened with the survival of the current system than I am of the people it is supposed to serve.
I don’t suppose you were actually advocating for the system uber alles (although certainly not convinced you weren’t, either), but your phrasing was too sweet to pass up. Very much in line with the mindless who believe the state must be protected at all costs without considering for a moment as to why.
Jay Tea: B does not follow A. “Let’s put the government in charge, so bureaucrats will make medical decisions.”
And yet you have your own B which you’re claiming follows directly and inevitably from A.
Under the current system medical decisions are made by insurance company bureaucrats. You’re saying under a reformed system those decisions will be made by gov’t bureaucrats.
Guess it’s a now win?
Jay Tea: It might have escaped your notice on the other side of the globe, Jaim
Why is Jaim’s physical location such a notable issue to you in so many comments? How is it relevant to his ability to understand the current debate? I find it notable that you bring it up so often in place of making a reasonable point.
Under the current system medical decisions are made by insurance company bureaucrats. You’re saying under a reformed system those decisions will be made by gov’t bureaucrats.
Weirdly, that’s what Team Health Care Reform argues as well. Hooray! Bipartisanship. Now if we can only get J. to admit that he made a stinky when he said that under single-payer systems, additional health care is forbidden. If only.
SaveFarris: Uh, no.
Still batting 1000 with the completely irrelevant links, I see.
Keep the streak going, Farris!
Jay Tea: And this was “proof” of global warmening?
I see you’re reading comprehension continues to have an inverse relationship with your ability to completely try to misdirect the point.
Nobody was suggesting “a complex health system, widespread failure among agencies and health services to coordinate efforts, and chronically insufficient care for the elderly” was proof of global warming.
Logic is really a challenge for you, isn’t it?
Not as much as reading comprehension is for you, Sean.
elspi, 12:14: Yes, he is that stupid. He confuses proof of global warming with proof that no one goes to france for medical care.
THAT was what I was responding to, Sean.
So even with that heat wave in 2003, France led the world in fewest deaths preventable by health care in 2002-03?
http://www.reuters.com/article/latestCrisis/idUSN07651650
Wow. Imagine how well they perform in years when there isn’t a once-in-a-lifetime heat wave.
Jay Tea: elspi, 12:14: Yes, he is that stupid. He confuses proof of global warming with proof that no one goes to france for medical care.
THAT was what I was responding to, Sean.
By choosing for yourself what elspi saw as proof of global warming. elspi can really speak for him/herself, but I’d think a reasonable person would assume s/he was referring to the existence of the heat wave and “Environmental experts warn that because of climate change, such heat waves are expected to increase in number in coming years” and not the shortcomings of the healthcare system as “proof” of warming.
Reasoning is really a challenge for you, isn’t it?