The Solving Of Racism
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Cops put on paid leave for circulating racist emails about President Obama. For the love of God, STOP.
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In related news, the woman who called police to Henry Gates’ house never said anything to dispatchers about the race of the men on the porch. She also didn’t speak to Sgt. Crowley when he arrived.
However, Crowley’s incident report says the opposite on both of these issues.
I don’t know what to make of it.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/28/us/28gates.html?hp
Why PAID leave?
“Keep the cars coming,” for a 59 year old black man with a cane. You’ve got to wonder what this officer would have done in the face of a real threat. If he can’t deescalate a minor situation, I shudder to think of what he’d do when composure could save lives.
The solving of racism….
CNN: Black officers back up Sgt. Crowley
“…and the President?”
“It’s unfortunate. I supported him, I voted for him. I will not again.”
…..a quite teachable moment.
However, Crowley’s incident report says the opposite on both of these issues.
I don’t know what to make of it.
What you can make of it is that the wingnuts, in their zeal to tear down Obama, couldn’t let this dipshit incident die a normal death, and as a result Sargeant Crowley will end up having an unholy amount of scrutiny on every footstep, piss and sideways glance he has ever taken.
That scrutiny will come not just from left-wing zealots but, far more damagingly, from the major media and from average citizens like the lady who made the 911 call, stirred to interest by the right-wing drumbeat.
In the end, what started out as a relatively minor error in judgment may end up ruining Sargeant Crowley’s career and his life.
Way to go, wingnuts. Maybe you want to stop and think a minute before you coronate your next downtrodden-white-guy hero, and before you pile your Ossa molehill on your Pelion molehill to make your puny-minded attacks on Obama.
a quite teachable moment.
The Blue Wall is not exactly news.
Two black Cambridge cops who voted for Obama and now say Obama screwed up in this case, Repack. And that Crowley is not a racist and was not acting in any way racist against Gates. That is news.
If anyone of either color who was there or involved that wants to come forward and say Crowley was a racist or was, as Gates alleged, being racist, then that would be news too. So far, to my knowledge, no one has.
“And that Crowley is not a racist and was not acting in any way racist against Gates.”
Right, Crowley not being a racist AUTOMATICALLY justifies his arresting Gates. A police officer can never make an error in judgment outside of the context of being racist. Gotcha.
“Right, Crowley not being a racist AUTOMATICALLY justifies his arresting Gates. A police officer can never make an error in judgment outside of the context of being racist. Gotcha.”
Basically
Wank away, Dennis, wank away.
No. Unfortunately the nearly instant cries of racism managed to completely blur the fact that Professor Gates was basically arrested for contempt of cop. What could have been a teaching moment which would have taught the police valuable lessons about the limits of their authority is instead vacated because Professor Gates was just as egotistical as the cop and President Obama doesn’t have the common sense or discretion to know when an issue has absolutely nothing to do with him or the office of the POTUS.
“No.”
Um, yes. Dennis apparently believes that Crowley not being racist=Crowley not being wrong in arresting Gates.
“…President Obama doesn’t have the common sense or discretion to know when an issue has absolutely nothing to do with him or of the office of the POTUS.”
When did Obama say that the Gates/Crowley incident “had anything to do with him or the office of the POTUS?”
“…President Obama doesn’t have the common sense or discretion to know when an issue has absolutely nothing to do with him or of the office of the POTUS.”
So I guess with that standard, you’d also agree that George HW Bush had no common sense or discretion to know when the RODNEY KING had absolutely nothing to do with him or the office of the POTUS.
‘…..a quite teachable moment.’
How do you explain the discrepancy between the 911 caller’s recollection and Crowley’s report Den-Den?
President Bush 43 condemned the “General Betrayus” ad. What did that have to do with him or the office of the POTUS?
‘And that Crowley is not a racist and was not acting in any way racist against Gates. That is news. ‘
So why did Crowley feel it was necessary to falsify his report according to the account by the 911 caller?
‘President Obama doesn’t have the common sense or discretion to know when an issue has absolutely nothing to do with him or the office of the POTUS.’
He was ASKED his opinion on this issue at a press conference about health care; the days of ignoring questions about what goes on in the country are over.
Whether you feel his answer was poorly phrased is one thing, but the outcry had he chosen to ignore the question would certainly have been far greater.
Both Gates and Crowley showed poor judgement, but one man wound up being arrested on a trumped up charge; Crowley has still to explain why he found it necessary to falsify his ‘conversaton’ with the 911 caller, which will likely put his reputation at risk, but he’ll have no one to blame but himself.
Cops put on paid leave for circulating racist emails about President Obama. For the love of God, STOP.
Probably in full compliance with said cop’s union contract.
And I see the Great Gates Walkback is in full motion. Now that it’s pretty clear that race WASN’T a factor here, the usual suspects are back in the full “cops are thuggish pigs” mode.
As far as Obama goes… yes he was ASKED his opinion. He said he didn’t have all the facts, and then the dumbass couldn’t keeep from rendering judgment anyway. All The Smartest Man In The World had to say was something like this:
“I don’t have all the facts, but Skip Gates has been a friend of mine for a very long time, and I sincerely hope that this matter is resolved quickly.” Then SHUT UP and not malign an entire department.
Last week’s news conference was quite an accomplishment, even for Obama. He managed to smear two whole professions without even trying — cops, and doctors who might perform medically unnecessary surgeries just for money.
That’s our president. Boy, we sure dodged a bullet last November, didn’t we?
J.
Now this is being circulated about Gates.
http://moonbatmonitor.blog-city.com/the_real_henry_louis_gates.htm
Yet another radical bigot Obama is pals with.
The mask is slipping. And what’s underneath does not appear to be “post-racial.”
What is it about you that leads you to presume that was a falsification of Crowley’s report, jrfunky? The answer to that question hasn’t been dealt with by Crowley, the police department, or anyone else involved, so neither you nor I can say one way or the other. But you already have declare it to be a falsification, and that it somehow refutes any attestation from his coworkers that Crowley isn’t a racist. Why is that?
Gates is just one, in a long line, of shameless hypocrites that benefit from fanning the flames of race and discrimination. These shameless hypocrites have been making money off the Black community for decades and what have they contributed?
If we had instantaneous race harmony, and racism was erased from our vocabulary, Black charlatans like Gates, Sharpton, Jackson, Waters, Rev. Wright etc etc etc would be out of business.
I guess we should have known: Do ANY of Barack’s friends and associates pay taxes?
I’d say ‘unbelievable’, SaveFarris, but it is quite believable. How could anyone be surprised?
This guy is a character.
This is our teachable moment.
‘What is it about you that leads you to presume that was a falsification of Crowley’s report, jrfunky? ‘
This:
‘The dispatcher asked Ms. Whalen whether the two men were black, white or Hispanic. “There were two larger men,” she said. “One looked kind of Hispanic, but I’m not really sure.” As for the second man, she said, “I didn’t see what he looked like at all,” according to the tape.
Ms. Whalen, who was calling on her cellphone from in front of Professor Gates’s house, stayed at the scene until the police arrived. A report filed by the arresting officer, Sgt. James M. Crowley, said she told him she had seen “what appeared to be two black males with backpacks” on the porch of the home.’
And this:
‘Police officials have stood by the report in interviews, but on Monday, Ms. Whalen’s lawyer said she had never mentioned race to Sergeant Crowley.
“She didn’t speak to Sergeant Crowley at the scene except to say, ‘I’m the one who called,’ ” said the lawyer, Wendy J. Murphy. “And he said, ‘Wait right there,’ and walked into the house. She never used the word black and never said the word backpacks to anyone.”
Cambridge police officials did not return a call seeking comment on the inconsistency.’
Stop fretting, jrfunkenstein, this will all be solved over a couple of beers on Thursday. Right?
junior funky-
I know about that. Again, we don’t know about the inconsistency. My question to you was why do you presume it was a falsification, and why do you presume that this nullifies the other officers who say Crowley is not racist nor was acting in a racist manner toward Gates? You are rushing to a judgment, and I’m simply asking you why you would tend to do that.
From one of the first threads on this incident, jrfunkenstein, you called Ms. Whalen a bitch.
Another rush to judgment on your part. Why was she a bitch exactly?
I was a black liberal until Henry Gates offended me.
What is it about you that leads you to presume that was a falsification of Crowley’s report, jrfunky?
Croowley’s name is on the report.
And your name isn’t jrfunkenstein, Indeed.
I know why you rush to judgment, that’s already been established here. I’m asking jrfunky in this case. I haven’t read in any reputable publication that states that Crowley falsified his report, that this confirms his racism, that this nullifes any of the several people who have come forward that have stated unequivocally that Crowley is not racist nor did he act in a racist manner. If jrfunky read that somewhere I’d like to see it.
someone once said on that “i’m not sure that an entire nation can’t be sociopathic”. that really stuck with me. we have such a blame the victim mentality in this nation. only one person was arrested after just trying to get into his own house. it wasn’t the cop. the cop is not the victim here. he had total control over the situation and his actions. he chose to make this an incident, not Dr. Gates. once gates provided proof of residence, despite whatever else he said to annoy the cop, the cop should have been professional and walked away. he chose to make a point to gates and arrest him and that backfired. had he not made the arrest we wouldn’t even know the situation existed. so because gates chooses to raise noise about his situation as so many others are unable to, people want to blame him for getting arrested. sometimes i think i am living in bizarro world (superman reference for oliver).
As soon as he inserted his foot into his mouth at his press conference, and then followed it up by making a big show about inviting the whole crew down to DC for a couple of beers. Speaking of the presser…
Great. So now, when there is some local, petty dispute which gets media attention, we can look forward to the fucking President of the United States injecting his cult of personality into the situation if he gets asked a question about it? That is a bug, not a feature. There isn’t some happy medium between the perceived indifference of George W. Bush and Barack’s Obama inviting aggrevied parties to the White House?
Let me jump in briefly just to make a point: Weather Oficcer
Crowley is a racist or not is no longer the main issue, if it ever was. What he did, without sufficient justification, is the issue.
We have documented inconsistancies twixt the callers/dispatchers version of events, and that of the arresting officer. These need to be explained and explained by the officer, since it is his version that is not consistant and the witneess and dispatcher have no reason to lie or go to the trouble to synchronize their stories.
We have fellow officers who vouch for Officer Crowley, saying that he is not racist. They are Black. This means nothing. These same Black officers also vouch for Crowleys actions, saying he did nothing wrong in this case, and no matter how it is spun, flipped, twirled, or contorted, Dr Gates, asshole that he might have been, did nothing which warrented arrest. This tells me that the supporting officers, be they Black, Hispanic, Asian, or whatever, are acting just like Police Officers all over the country have been trained to act, ie, supporting thier bretheren dispite the facts. Should they be believed? Not because of their race.
The only crime that was commited in this “meeting of the assholes” was a false arrest.
“So now, when there is some local, petty dispute which gets media attention, we can look forward to the fucking President of the United States injecting his cult of personality into the situation if he gets asked a question about it?”
Why was he asked about it in the first place? Would have have been asked if he was white?
You are rushing to a judgment, and I’m simply asking you why you would tend to do that.
Oh please, Dennis. You’re defending Crowley, not “weighing the evidence” or whatever it is you think we all should be doing.
I haven’t read in any reputable publication that states that Crowley falsified his report, that this confirms his racism, that this nullifes any of the several people who have come forward that have stated unequivocally that Crowley is not racist nor did he act in a racist manner.
Dennis, you have a witness to the scene who contradicts what Crowley put in his report, as reported in the New York Times.
Whether that “nullifies” anything is a judgment call as is the charge of racism. Purely subjective.
Gates believes Crowley was acting in a racially insensitive manner and a witness to the scene contradicts what Crowley put in his report.
Those are the facts to weigh against others.
I understand that, fafaroo, and I told jrfunkenstein that. You call it a contradiction and nutcase Andrew Sullivan calls it a discrepancy. But jrfunky calls it a ‘falsification’. He called Ms. Whalen a bitch; that’s when he presumed she was a white woman.
I’m asking him why, not you. Ms. Whalen was a bitch before to jrfunk, but now when there’s a discrepancy between her statements and Sgt Crowley’s, it means it’s Crowley who is the racist.
Gates also said he didn’t say to Crowley ‘Yeah, I’ll speak with your mamma’, that he must’ve gotten it from watching too much Kid Dyno-mite. Why aren’t you and jrfunky jumping all over that ‘discrepancy/contradiction/falsification?
once gates provided proof of residence, despite whatever else he said to annoy the cop, the cop should have been professional and walked away.
That’s the rub. All reports seem to indicate that Gates got belligerant and uncooperative *before* he provided proof of residence. And since the only reason the cops were there in the first place was because of a reported break-in, Crowley would have been derelict of duty if he had “walked away” at that point.
Because the reporters of the press agencies allowed to ask questions to the President during press conferences are
journalism majorsincompetent hacks.That doesn’t matter since we don’t live on opposite world where President Obama is white. He was asked about it, and rather than defer the question with any number of techniques, which would have allowed the President to remain on topic during his presser, the President happily injects himself into the issue, giving it legs it never would have without his intervention.
Of course here I am expecting that a common politician would have any interest in avoiding a topic which allows them to preach. How dumb am I for hoping that we would have a chief executive who is above such pettiness?
That doesn’t matter since we don’t live on opposite world where President Obama is white. He was asked about it, and rather than defer the question with any number of techniquezzzzzzzzzzzzz…………
Because, you know, the last president never said anything ill-considered or awkward at any of his press appearances.
“…President Obama doesn’t have the common sense or discretion to know when an issue has absolutely nothing to do with him or of the office of the POTUS.”
God forbid someone ASKS him about it at a PRESS conference or anything.
Why aren’t you and jrfunky jumping all over that ‘discrepancy/contradiction/falsification?
Perhaps because I wasn’t aware of it?
Dennis, you go after Oliver and others for being obsessed about race but you yourself seem mighty obsessed with proving something here one way or another.
Having now googled the phrase, i found this from Crowley:
So even after Obama’s admitedly stupid move at the press conference, Crowley still supports the president.
http://www.theroot.com/views/officer-says-he-wont-apologize
A teaching moment, indeed.
All reports seem to indicate that Gates got belligerant and uncooperative *before* he provided proof of residence.
All reports? I think you mean Sgt. Crowley’s report. By the time any other officers arrived (who would later file reports) Gates had already provided his ID.
Look, it’s no surprise that Crowley and Gates both tell stories that omit embarrassing details about themselves. That’s what humans do. But that’s no reason for us bystanders to play make believe as well.
So, again, because someone asks him about it, he must choose what has to be the least useful plausible response? In all of President Obama’s years of public speaking no one ever taught him how to deflect an off-topic question and redirect it back to what he wants to talk about?
I suppose it’s possible (probable?) that he really did want to talk about it and use it an an opportunity to inject himself into an issue which he had no business getting in to and did nothing to help resolve.
I guess a lot of OW.com commenters (and author) could learn a lesson from the good officer’s willingness to support the President even if he doesn’t always agree with what he does.
Because the reporters of the press agencies allowed to ask questions to the President during press conferences are
journalism majorsincompetent hacks.SFC makes a good point. Who asked him about it, anyway?
Good for him, and I mean that. I support him too, fafaroo. I want him to do a good job and make good decisions and do some of the things he said he was going to do. I’d like nothing more than to see race relations improve dramatically, too, but I think Obama blew it big time with this one. Big time.
But yeah, I agree with you, Crowley’s continued support can be a teachable moment. It’s just that jrfunkenstein’s depiction of the discrepancy in the report as a falsification without knowing the reason yet for it, isn’t.
I guess a lot of OW.com commenters (and author) could learn a lesson from the good officer’s willingness to support the President even if he doesn’t always agree with what he does.
Too late for that, SFC. Obama won.
Lynn Sweet of the Chicago Sun-Times, Duros. She’s been covering him for quite a while.
“…President Obama doesn’t have the common sense or discretion to know when an issue has absolutely nothing to do with him or of the office of the POTUS.”
God forbid someone ASKS him about it at a PRESS conference or anything.
(Evil thought time)
So… if someone at his next conference asks about his birth certificate, he’ll be compelled to answer it?
J.
Only if you ask him three times. He’s like a Dr. Evil henchman.
We have documented inconsistancies twixt the callers/dispatchers version of events, and that of the arresting officer. These need to be explained and explained by the officer, since it is his version that is not consistant and the witneess and dispatcher have no reason to lie or go to the trouble to synchronize their stories.
Doesn’t seem that difficult.
‘Stop fretting, jrfunkenstein, this will all be solved over a couple of beers on Thursday. Right?’
How can you solve anything that doesn’t exist? There’s no racism in America, is there? Haven’t you Crowley defenders been arguing that Gates was rightfully arrested and Obama didn’t know what he was talking about, whereas all of you did?
Now at least you all can get back to the real issue of Obama’s citizenship.
‘I know about that. Again, we don’t know about the inconsistency. My question to you was why do you presume it was a falsification, and why do you presume that this nullifies the other officers who say Crowley is not racist nor was acting in a racist manner toward Gates? You are rushing to a judgment, and I’m simply asking you why you would tend to do that.
First of all, I never nullified anything the other officers said; it’s becoming more and more evident that the facts of the case have never been fully verified, which hasn’t stopped you or others from holding your positions based on the same lack of information everyone else, including myself, have been exposed to. The difference is that what has been reported is that the 9/11 caller did not identify the men she saw as Black, although Crowley in his report claims she did in a conversation with him in which she maintains she never said they were Black.
How does that not constitute a falsehood to you? What is now certain is that both men acted in haste and with poor judgment, but one ended up in jail, which doesn’t seem to bother those who have defended Crowley from the beginning. If those of us who thought race was the predominant factor in this case can back away from that hasty judgment based on what little facts are now known, why is it so hard for those who automatically condoned Crowley’s behavior to question his official report which seems inconsistent with the statements made by the 911 caller?
From one of the first threads on this incident, jrfunkenstein, you called Ms. Whalen a bitch.’
That’s right I did; again I’m not too superior to admit when I’ve been mistaken. Being human means being prone to mistakes.
The difference between an adult and a child is that when adults make mistakes they are expected to admit to them and learn something from them. I’ve admitted that I was among those who rushed to judge the incident as indicative of racism, because I’ve seen and been subjected to such acts myself. Does that justify my pre-judgment in this case? No, but is should sure as Hell help to explain it to people who have NEVER been in that position, though based on the comments supporting Crowley and criticizing Gates, that’s not at all the case.
Those who automatically defended Sgt. Crowley are still maintaining that he did NOTHING wrong, which is not supported by his own police department, which promptly dropped the charges against Gates, nor are they at all critical of the fact his report on the incident contains some factual discrepancies.
Don’t be so quick to point out that other people make mistakes, particularly as you yourself haven’t left the impression, overtly or otherwise, that you may exhibit the same human tendencies, or go the further step of actually admitting or apologizing for them.
‘Great. So now, when there is some local, petty dispute which gets media attention, we can look forward to the fucking President of the United States injecting his cult of personality into the situation if he gets asked a question about it?’
Unlike Bush, President Obama is not above admitting when he is wrong, nor is he above trying to rectify a situation that has clearly captured the interest of the nation.
Maybe you would prefer he take an extended vacation and just clear some brush?
‘These shameless hypocrites have been making money off the Black community for decades and what have they contributed?’
The guy is a Harvard professor, not a shock jock.
What is he SUPPOSED to contribute in your opinion?
Umm, a falsification is quite different than a falsehood. As I stated, other people here have termed it an inconsistency, a discrepancy. You called it a falsification. Do you know something no one else at this point seems to know?
You claim to be an adult in your second post, but in the first, you resort to the Obama birther throwaway line, when you know no one here has claimed to be an Obama birther. Very adult of you, junior.
What are you talking about. People here have toned down the rhetoric considerably about the racist aspects of this case, but it’s hard to understand how you would characterize the comments of the Gates defenders as having ‘backed away from that hasty judgment’.
And if you ever apologized for calling Lucia Whalen a bitch anytime after and before this thread, I’ll apologize, because I haven’t seen it if you have. That’s central to my question of why you thought she was a bitch before, and now accept her statement if it implicates Crowley and hurts his reputation for filing a falsification.
‘You called it a falsification. Do you know something no one else at this point seems to know?’
Do you?
Have it your way Dennis; Gates is an asshole playing the race card as so many others have, unjustifiably, and Crowley has nothing to answer for.
Oh, and those who thought the issue was race motivated, like myself, are also ignorant whiners complaining about an issue that has long since passed into the realm of historic anachronism.
Racism is dead, and minorities just won’t let it go.
Does that satisfy you?
No one but you seems to understand the issue with the wisdom and clarity you’ve offered; thanks for putting us all in our place.
No, and that’s why I didn’t call it a falsification. I’m also not saying Gates lied when he said he didn’t say anything about Crowley’s mother, that he must’ve got it from JJ on Good Times, because I don’t know that either.
If you want to get some things off your chest for incidents that occurred to you, or what you know about racial profiling in general, fine, I’d be happy to listen. None of those things make Crowley any more or any less guilty in this case, though.
‘If you want to get some things off your chest for incidents that occurred to you, or what you know about racial profiling in general, fine, I’d be happy to listen.
No you won’t; and for someone who appears regularly on a left wing blog to demean and castigate 99% of the posters whose views are diametrically opposed to yours by hurling childish insults and taunts, you’re not in a very strong position to lecture me on maturity.
jrfunky, you’re not being lectured, you’re being exposed for the prejudicial race-baiter you are, and you don’t like it. Pure and simple. Now you’re just whining and using the past sins of whites to justify some of the stupid remarks you made about something you knew nothing about but tried to act like you did because of what you once experienced.
You want a forum where you can vent and say crazy shit without anyone asking what you’re talking about, fine, I’ll leave you to your own devices.
So… if someone at his next conference asks about his birth certificate, he’ll be compelled to answer it?
Go for it. You think he carries it with him?
‘jrfunky, you’re not being lectured, you’re being exposed for the prejudicial race-baiter you are, and you don’t like it.’
That’s right Den-Den; I’m a race-baiter. I falsely accused Whalen of being racist and admitted it and apologized for it, clearly making me anti-White, despite being of mixed race myself, including Caucasian heritage. Your charge is as idiotic as Beck calling Obama a racist.
The facts of this case have dribbled out piecemeal, so people rushed to judgment, including me; the difference between you and I is that I’m willing to admit when I’m wrong, something you will never do, as you have the selfless character trait of never making a mistake.
Must be lonely up there on your pedestal of self righteousness.
You’ve been defending Crowley and castigating Gates since this story broke, as well as suggesting anyone who felt differently than you was unjustifiably persecuting both Crowley and the police in general, and you’re now declaring that I’m a race baiter, which I suppose is code for anti-White racist. Will you be willing to admit that you also haven’t had access to all the facts in this case, and may also be judging it based on what little information is out there? Or will you continue to support your position as though you are the only one with an opinion based on irrefutable facts?
Have a nice day.
‘You want a forum where you can vent and say crazy shit without anyone asking what you’re talking about, fine, I’ll leave you to your own devices.’
Umm…anyone else want to comment on the irony of this statement?
“So… if someone at his next conference asks about his birth certificate, he’ll be compelled to answer it?”
What difference would it make? Even if he said ‘yes, I’m an american citizen’, and then ran behind stage and pulled out the birth certificate that he provided to DOS already, naysayers would continue to say it was a fake an he’s a non-citizen-lying-socialist-muslim-liberal-bastard…..