Conservative Leader Joe The Plumber Hits Another One Out Of The Park: He’s Afraid Of Gays
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He’s like the Babe Ruth of conservatism
In an interview with Christianity Today, Joe “the Plumber” Wurzelbacher said that calling gay people “queer” “is not like a slur” because homosexuality is “strange and unusual.” He also declared that he would never let his gay “friends” “anywhere near my children”
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He also declared that he would never let his gay “friends” “anywhere near my children”
Just another example of how little he knows. Our gay friends are our best babysitters.
Yeah, read this via TPM. My God, what a complete train-wreck of a human being.
Please conservatives, more Joe, more Palin, more Limbaugh. More more more! The sooner you kill of your own sad political ideology the better.
Cons are intellectual babies with Biblical pacifiers
I’m waiting for right-wingers here to defend this. Maybe they will try and change the subject, but I really want them to try and defend this.
The man is a boil on the ass of—well, anything.
CS, I think I have the standard defense down by now.
“I don’t hate gays, but I wish they wouldn’t force their sexuality in my face. And they want special rights. The way they get special rights completely upends our Constitution. Activist judges. Socialism! Taking away our guns! Birth certificate! Sputter! Spark! DANGER! DANGER WILL ROBINSON! DANGER!”
This guy was a nobody until he dared ask an uncomfortable question of Obama. At that point, his entire life was declared an open book, his right to privacy cast to the winds, and his every flaw declared fodder for the national debate.
This guy isn’t a leader. He’s an example. He’s an example of what your side used to call “the politics of personal destruction.”
He’s an exemplar of what happens who ask awkward questions of Obama and his chosen. Why was this guy elevated from “a nobody from nowhere” (a title I share) into a national laughingstock?
“Pour encourager les autres.”
For the record, his position is asinine. It’s bigotry. And it’s wrong.
In our system, it’s his legal right to be a bigot. And it’s our right to call him on it when he makes it public.
J.
“Why was this guy elevated from “a nobody from nowhere” (a title I share) into a national laughingstock?”
Maybe you need to talk to your presidential nominee, who couldn’t stop mentioning him in the debate.
Jay, it might come as a shock to the system, but I’m not going to disagree with you all that much. I think that the media can’t solely be blamed for Joe’s elevation – the McCain campaign latched onto him like a barnacle, and I suspect that there’s some self-promotion involved as well. I’m not especially interested in whether this is “politics of personal destruction”, since I don’t know if he sped the process along by granting interviews or whatnot. I strongly believe that he’s the only person who’s responsible for his own fame now.
Here’s the big question now, though – why are we still talking about him? Why do people – specifically conservatives – keep giving interviews and do wacky publicity stunts like sending him to war zones and other shenanigans? Why are conservatives still listening to him? He’ asked *an* uncomfortable question – singular – of Obama. That’s it. Never been elected to anything, never done anything of note. Why is he still front and center – all right, off to the right and one row back – in conservative circles?
The McCain campaign latched on to his question, and more importantly, the answer.
The media disregarded that and started doing a full proctological examination of his life. Did you know that “Joe” was really his middle name? Did you know that he didn’t have a plumber’s license? Did you know that he had at least one tax lien? Well, we all did, in very short order.
Hell, the Ohio Director of Social Services ran a check on Joe’s child support status, to see if he was behind, based solely on the “he’s suddenly a public figure now, so we better check” principle. Helen Jones-Kelly (who donated the max to Obama) was eventually suspended and resigned her job over it.
And that was just one state agency that suddenly found Joe’s official records very fascinating. A file clerk for the Toledo Police Department pulled his criminal record for a TV station. A contractor for the state Attorney General’s office also went poking around.
This was all done around the same time as the media was frantically NOT covering the conduct of John Edwards, or the lengthy and substantial connections between Obama and William Ayers. But I’m sure that was just a coincidence.
J.
This guy isn’t a leader. He’s an example. He’s an example of what your side used to call “the politics of personal destruction.”
The politics of personal destruction? The guy looks like he’s doing just fine. Okay, he looks like a moron, too, but that’s hardly our side’s fault. We’re not the ones parading him around asking his advice on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, the economy or gay marriage.
Quaker, what happened to the life he had before he dared ask The Question? Can he possibly go back to it?
I recall a similar argument made about Valerie Plame — she’s undoubtedly far better off financially now than she was before the whole mess about her unfolded. Do you think that that matter should be dropped, simply because she got a great book deal and tons of fawning publicity for her and her husband?
J.
Lesson: If you don’t want your life examined, don’t get a major-party Presidential candidate to trumpet you as the image of hard-working, morally upright, silent-majority Americana. Especially if that image is a load of crap in your specific case.
Did anyone hear of him when he asked the uncomfortable question, or did everyone (like me) only first hear of him when John McCain mentioned 431 times that Joe the Plumber was his ideal American?
This guy was a nobody until he dared ask an uncomfortable question of Obama.
You should go back and watch that video–the whole thing. I didn’t see an uncomfortable Obama. I saw a man who knew what the hell he was talking about (Obama) calmly discussing policy. When I saw that I thought it should have been an ad for Obama. Ever see George Bush, Jr., or John McCain or Dutch Reagan talk policy like that? No, because none are/were very smart. Like JtP, they’re buffoons.
what happened to the life he had before he dared ask The Question? Can he possibly go back to it?
Why don’t you ask Mr. Plumber’s publicist.
Have fun defending more indefensibles!
Wow. It’s called ‘queer’ for a reason. Good lord.
This guy was a nobody until he dared ask an uncomfortable question of Obama.
The question was not uncomfortable in the least, it was a stupid and unnecessary one. He asked him a question for which anybody who’d kept half an ear toward politics already knew the answer – at a yearly income of $250K his taxes would be higher under Obama’s tax plan.
If he hadn’t wanted to waste his question, he might have asked something that would have brought him information that hadn’t been readily available for the past several months.
Coincidentally, I wouldn’t want Joe the Plumber anywhere near my kids.
ed, perhaps I phrased it poorly. The question wasn’t awkward. Neither was Obama. It was the answer that was so uncomfortable — so uncomfortable that every effort had to be expended to bury it and focus the attention on anything but it. So Joe got a public colonoscopy.
Obama’s closing line was this: “I think when you spread the wealth around, it’s good for everybody.” A LOT of us heard it as “when the government takes YOUR wealth and spreads it around for you, in ways WE think is fair, it’s good for everybody who gets it.”
And Obama’s heavy-handed handling of the Chrysler deal is more evidence that that perception was right. How DARE those hedge funds and other investors (the ones not leashed in with TARP money) actually do their fiduciary duty and not write off millions and millions of their customer’s money? How DARE they not accept far less than they would normally be entitled to in a bankruptcy filing? How DARE they meddle with Obama’s plan to turn over Chrysler to the unions that supported him so strongly in the election? Don’t they know HE WON, and to the victor goes the spoils?
Obama is a remarkably generous man — with other people’s money. Good thing he’s so intelligent and graceful and educated that he knows better how to best use other people’s money than they do, and how fortunate that he’s now in a position to take that money and use it for our own good.
J.
I gather Joe got a “public colonoscopy” because he lied…oops sorry Jay “embelished” about himself to frame a question. Aren’t you always railing against Joe Biden for this sort of stuff? He could have asked the question as a hypothetical and not lied about himself. He also could have asked the question and just let that be it, but no…how could he feed that ego if he just shut his mouth. To suggest he has been savaged is hyperbole. He has been critized and analyzed because he puts himself out there constantly.A real case of media savagery is when that man was accused of the bombing in Atlanta Olympics and when he was found to have nothing to do with the incident….the media shrugged. If this is all the evil librul media, why do conservatives keep putting him out in the public forum? The real answer is you don’t care as long as it scores political points with your ever shrinking base.
Thanks, Moby. You proved my point — the most important thing is not the answer, but the question — and the questioner. That is what must get all the attention.
And interesting standard there, comparing the sitting Vice-President of the United States to this nobody. Kind of like how so many criticisms of Obama are answered with “at least he’s not as bad as Bush!” Funny how that wasn’t the argument before the election… “Vote Obama! He’ll be at least marginally better!”
J.
Points to CS: you’re right, they changed the subject.
And yes, Jay Tea, poor Joe, forced to pitch book deals and accidentally stumble into “war correspondent” gigs. Why won’t the evil liberal media leave him alone?
No, Spider, I answered the subject. I said he was wrong, and stupid, on this point.
And I see no one wants to refute my Plame/Wilson comparison… their lives are considerably better now. So didn’t Richard Armitage do them a favor when he outed her?
J.
And yes, Jay Tea, poor Joe, forced to pitch book deals and accidentally stumble into “war correspondent” gigs.
You forgot
Polanda Country Music album.JT, When Joe the plumber turned out to be Sam the not-plumber, and when he asked a question that revealed his ignorance, and when McCain cited his bogus act in his campaign, I think it’s natural for people to ask, who is this guy really, and why is he lying?
And then they found out a lot of other things he claimed were not true, and then he hired a publicist and looked for a goddamn RECORDING CONTRACT, it became like the train wreck that was impossible to look away from. And every new thing you learned reinforced the impression that this guy is stupid but very ambitious, and a complete tool.
Joe for not-President in 2012!
“The McCain campaign latched on to his question, and more importantly, the answer.”
No, that is simply not true. The McCain and Palin campaigns latched on to Wurzelbacher like a drowning man latches on to a life jacket. Unfortunately for McCain/Palin the life jacket was lead-lined. McCain and Palin made “Joe” the centerpiece of their campaign appearances. They mentioned him repeatedly as a symbol of their opposition to Obama’s tax plans. But they made him the symbol and they made his average Joe-ness the messsage while doing nothing more substantive than saying the Obama tax plan was bad.
Just one example out of many:
It is more than a bit disengenuous to suggest that the McCain/Palin campain only used Joe as part of their ‘campign of ideas’ when anyone not blinded by dogma must know that their campaign was bereft of ideas. They used Joe the Plumber as an idealization of their average Joe. They put him in the eye of the media storm, they kept using his name, they kept putting him front and center. Suggesting that the media was at fault for looking into the particulars of this McCain/Palin-created ‘American Idol” is ill-conceived and illogical. Dogma does that to all of us sometimes.
“I think when you spread the wealth around, it’s good for everybody.”
WHOSE wealth? Spread around TO whom? Spread around BY whom? Good for EVERYBODY? Does that include those whose wealth is being spread around without their consent? HOW is that good for them?
That is the most important thing from the whole “Joe The Plumber” thing. And that is what gets buried under the desperation to prove that somehow this guy from nowhere had no business daring to ask questions that prompt too-honest answers.
J.
JT,
The fact is, this man thinks it’s ok to use vulgar slurs to describe people. Are you ok with that?
And I see no one wants to refute my Plame/Wilson comparison… their lives are considerably better now.
Perhaps because your example was bullshit. Valerie Plame was an intelligence agent whose cover was blown for political reasons. Her career and her reputation were ruined because the administration was hacked off – not at her, but at her husband.
Joe the would-be plumber inflated his own story when asking a question of a presidential candidate in front of the cameras. Nothing much would have come of it for Joe one way or the other… except that McCain decided to lionize the guy in the next debate. And oops! He wasn’t quite who he claimed to be.
Still, once the brouhaha settled down Joe – unlike Ms. Plame – could have gone back to his job and his quiet life but he has made the decision himself to take his 15 minutes of fame and run with it.
So no, I don’t think your comparison is valid in the least.
prove that somehow this guy from nowhere had no business daring to ask questions that prompt too-honest answers.
Who the hell is arguing this point, JT?? McCain and Palin decided to hold this guy up as the epitome of working class America. And Joe went along with it every step of the way. That’s when he became something of a parody of himself, not when he asked the question.
“could have gone back to his job and his quiet life”
Actually, no he couldn’t have. Dude didn’t even have a license to be a plumber.
Which is to say, out of that many pissed off Americans who still cling to the dying GOP, you think they could have found one with a leg to stand on. (Not to mention being a tax cheat.)
But ya know, who’s to expect conservatives to be competent at anything these days?
Can he possibly go back to it?
I think the real question is “does he want to?”.
Well, I think Southern Quaker pretty much made my point.
Jay Tea,
I am not making a comparison of Joe Biden and Joe the Plumber. I am mearly pointing out that ideologically its in your interest to dismiss the Vice President but not Joe Wurzelbacher. I know you would argue that Obama is a socialist and is spreading the wealth around (tax cuts aside for anyone making 250K or Less), but credibility does matter, even if you are Joe Blow. The McCain campiagn made hay of this till the end and recieved coverage but the American people said your argument was B.S. and voted for Obama. The real problem, and kinda what this post addresses, is what you continue to ignore: People like Joe the Plumber are who represent your party. I am dissapointed to think you want people like Palin, Joe, Rush representing your party like this is some sort of theater production with camera winks and psuedo male truisms and bluster.
What? Mr. Tea thinks JTP is the victim here?
I declare.
People like Joe the Plumber are who represent your party.
oh, but Jay Tea isn’t a Republican, doncha know. *rolls eyes*
Valerie Plame was an intelligence agent whose cover was blown for political reasons. Her career and her reputation were ruined because the administration was hacked off.
How quick we forget. Southern Quaker has already forgotton exactly who outed Plame.
Jay Tea: This guy was a nobody until he dared ask an uncomfortable question of Obama.
What was uncomfortable about the question? Obama sure didn’t look uncomfortable to me. He didn’t brush it off with a hasty non-answer, a wave and rush off to his next stop. He took the question seriously, treated it with respect as shown by the amount of time he spent responding to it. Nearly six minutes, an unusually long time to take to respond to question from a crowd. Of course, that’s immaterial since in the midst of that six minutes of thoughtful reply he said the three words “spread the wealth”. Oh, noes!
At that point, his entire life was declared an open book, his right to privacy cast to the winds, and his every flaw declared fodder for the national debate.
And he’s been struggling to get his privacy back every moment since, hasn’t he. A real shunner of the spotlight, that Joe.
Jay Tea: Why was this guy elevated from “a nobody from nowhere” into a national laughingstock?
…
For the record, his position is asinine.
Thanks for saving us the trouble by answering your own question, Jay.
And he’s been struggling to get his privacy back every moment since, hasn’t he. A real shunner of the spotlight, that Joe.
Joe the Plumber is like a stupider Darva Conger.
And please keep promoting and defending him wingnuts. The more Joe the Plumber speaks, the faster we can get DADT overturned, universal health care, immigration reform, and what have you.
Jay Tea: The McCain campaign latched on to his question, and more importantly, the answer.
No, they didn’t. They latched onto a single three-word phrase in the midst of a six-minute answer. And you know that but seem incapable of knee-jerk supporting any right-wing talking point.
Hey look its Joe The Plumber shying away from the limelight by campaigning with the Republican candidate for president.
And here’s Joe avoiding the media glare by hawking his book at CPAC.
As sure as night follows day, one of JTP’s kids is going to be gay.
WHOSE wealth? Spread around TO whom? Spread around BY whom? Good for EVERYBODY? Does that include those whose wealth is being spread around without their consent? HOW is that good for them?
JT,seriously, have you read the rest of the president’s response,or just that line? Because if you’d read the rest of the response, you’d already have all these answered. But what the hell, maybe you haven’t.
WHOSE wealth?
People in higher tax brackets.
Spread around TO whom?
People in lower tax brackets.
Spread around BY whom?
A governmental revenue service run according to the tax policies it takes to responsibly run a modern country and eventually, when the economy has recovered, have a balanced budget.
The amusing irony here is that nobody would want to live in a country where the beast has been starved and government is as small as libertarians profess to prefer. Although, I’ll repeat my advocacy that we give them a state and let them have at it.
Good for EVERYBODY?
Yes. You don’t live in a bubble. If your neighbor is poorer, that does make you poorer in various ways.
Does that include those whose wealth is being spread around without their consent?
You grant your consent to be taxed by living here, and taking advantage of public services like national defense, roads and living in a literate society with a basic level of education. Yes, being among people who have been to school is something of which you take advantage, regardless of whether you went to a private or public school. You are welcome to move if you would like to withdraw your consent.
HOW is that good for them?
Well, as the president said in his response, a higher economic floor means those people will be spending more money because they have more money. As the president said, a higher economic floor means more customers for Joe’s hypothetical plumbing business.
My God now they are defending a ignorant, homophobic, sack of crap, that lies put of both sides of his ass!
Hackery knows no bounds.
{And no shame.}
Jay Tea: “I think when you spread the wealth around, it’s good for everybody.”
WHOSE wealth? Spread around TO whom? Spread around BY whom? Good for EVERYBODY? Does that include those whose wealth is being spread around without their consent? HOW is that good for them?
That is the most important thing from the whole “Joe The Plumber” thing. And that is what gets buried under the desperation to prove that somehow this guy from nowhere had no business daring to ask questions that prompt too-honest answers.
Good questions, but the right wasn’t very interested in answering them, or even asking them, were they? If they were, it certainly got lost under the avalanche of “He said ‘share the wealth’ and that’s SOCIALISM! Omigawd!!” Asking questions and debating answers in a reasoned way was the LAST thing going on.
Jay Tea, 8:16 am: he dared ask an uncomfortable question of Obama … He’s an exemplar of what happens who ask awkward questions…
Jay Tea, 10:04 am: The question wasn’t awkward.
And in under two hours, no less.
Jay Tea: <i.Obama’s closing line was this: “I think when you spread the wealth around, it’s good for everybody.” A LOT of us heard it as “when the government takes YOUR wealth and spreads it around for you, in ways WE think is fair, it’s good for everybody who gets it.”
Really? Is that how it works? Good to know.
Because when you said, well, just about anything in this thread, I heard it as “My name is Jay and I’m being a blithering idiot.” So I guess that makes it true.
Jay Tea: And I see no one wants to refute my Plame/Wilson comparison… their lives are considerably better now. So didn’t Richard Armitage do them a favor when he outed her?
Sure, I’ll take it. Who are you to say their lives are “better”? Here’s a choice: You can continue to serve in a careers that you like where you have served with distinction OR you can have them taken away from you against your wills but get a book deal.
I mean, really isn’t it just a fantastic thing that Armitage outed her? I think he should out more undercover agents, it being such a good thing and all.
And any other person liiving a closeted life of their own choosing, wouldn’t they be better off if we outed them? We could just compensate them with a bit of money and it would all be better for them that way.
Let’s not forget his “careers” of the last few months: public speaker, foreign correspondent, author, and country singer. He’s some private, private citizen, that one. I expect him to be on reality shows and “The Plumber Apprentice” any day now. If he doesn’t run for President instead.
If he doesn’t run for President instead.
He said God hasn’t told him to run for office yet. Really.
Which reminds me, George Bush, Jr. said that God told him He wanted Bush, Jr. to be President. Really. The modern Republican party is so awesome.
J.G.Thayer: “This guy was a nobody until he dared ask an uncomfortable question of Obama.”
Change the subject it is.
J.G.Thayer: “The McCain campaign latched on to his question, and more importantly, the answer.”
Fucking liar. They mentioned him by name over and over again. How often did they mention his question?
J.G.Thayer: “And I see no one wants to refute my Plame/Wilson comparison… their lives are considerably better now.”
She can’t do her job. How is she better off now?
J.G.Thayer: “Thanks, Moby. You proved my point — the most important thing is not the answer, but the question — and the questioner. That is what must get all the attention.”
You know what likely happened? People in media wanted to interview him, but they needed to find out more about him, like his name and contact information. While trying to find that information, they found out he lied about his name. Once that was uncovered, then and real reporter would dig a little deeper, and it was discovered than pretty much everything he said was a lie.
Joe the Plumber’s question was, and I’m paraphrasing, ‘I’m just an average person, and my taxes are going to go up. How can you justify that?’
If the first part is a lie, then the second part is not a valid question.
Southern Quaker has already forgotton exactly who outed Plame.
Why does it matter one whit what Armitage’s political affiliation was? The fact of the matter is that he outed her to Libby – knowingly or unknowingly – and Libby outed her to Novak who published the infamous smear at the behest of the Bush WH. From WaPo:
As prosecutor Patrick J. Fitzgerald has reported, when Mr. Wilson charged that intelligence about Iraq had been twisted to make a case for war, Mr. Libby and Mr. Cheney reacted by inquiring about Ms. Plame’s role in recommending Mr. Wilson for a CIA-sponsored trip to Niger, where he investigated reports that Iraq had sought to purchase uranium. Mr. Libby then allegedly disclosed Ms. Plame’s identity to journalists and lied to a grand jury when he said he had learned of her identity from one of those reporters. Mr. Libby and his boss, Mr. Cheney, were trying to discredit Mr. Wilson; if Mr. Fitzgerald’s account is correct, they were careless about handling information that was classified…
thus ending her career. Period.
Which reminds me, George Bush, Jr. said that God told him He wanted Bush, Jr. to be President. Really. The modern Republican party is so awesome. Mister ed
Honestly, ed, what percentage of people belonging to the modern Democratic party would answer yes if asked if they thought Barack Obama was sent by God to be our leader?
We know Nancy Pelosi is one of them. We also know there wasn’t a lot of pushback by liberals when she said Obama was “a leader that God has blessed us with at this time.” Only feigned indignation at his being called a messiah now that he’s won the election when those references weren’t so bad during his campaign.
Maybe Mister can explain how these two declarations differ.
I wonder how Joe Not a Plumber’s alleged ‘gay friends’ (excuse me, homosexual friends) feel about the fact that he won’t let them anywhere near his kids. I’m imagining a household scene:
“Hey, Jack, glad you could stop by! Let me lock my kids in the rec room until you leave.”
Does ANYONE still believe it when people say insane things like this?
Dennis: what percentage of people belonging to the modern Democratic party would answer yes if asked if they thought Barack Obama was sent by God to be our leader?
So you ask a hypothetical question and then act as if the answer you want for it is an accepted fact. I don’t know how many people. You got any data or poll to show what it is?
Personally I expect if phrased that way, “Was Obama sent by God?”, that you’d get rather low numbers among liberals/Democrats. Certainly lower than “Was Bush sent by God?” would get among the right.
We also know there wasn’t a lot of pushback by liberals when she said Obama was “a leader that God has blessed us with at this time.”
We do? We know that? Well, (shrug) even if we do, so what? That’s not the same as saying he was sent by god (the messiah meme the right likes to push so much). It’s akin to thanking god for providing food for the table or “Thank go I’ve got my health. Knock wood.”
Ed: “Which reminds me, George Bush, Jr. said that God told him He wanted Bush, Jr. to be President. Really. The modern Republican party is so awesome.”
Dennis the Bigot: “Honestly, ed, what percentage of people belonging to the modern Democratic party would answer yes if asked if they thought Barack Obama was sent by God to be our leader?”
A hell of a lot smaller than the percentage of Republicans who thought the same about George W. Bush.
“Maybe Mister can explain how these two declarations differ.”
Did Obama say he was sent by god? Hell, I have a simpler question… Did the left refer to him as a messiah as much as the right did?
Why am I asking you? You can’t count past two.
Jay Tea: And I see no one wants to refute my Plame/Wilson comparison…
[Sorry for double post, but just KNEW I'd miss up on the formatting for that one. Whatever happened to preview?]
——
Jay Tea: And I see no one wants to refute my Plame/Wilson comparison…
… their lives are considerably better now.
Challenge accepted and answered.
Can’t wait to see what rationalizations Jay Tea comes up with now.
That was some Nesting Gone Wild in that first post there…
Only in J.G.Thayer’s mind can Joe the Plumber be the victim and Valerie Plame should be thankful for her new career.
The man truly is a waste.
Eric: That was some Nesting Gone Wild in that first post there…
Yeah. You try to format so the meaning is clear. But then leave out one little / and… sigh.
TFJ for CSS.
Sean: “TFJ for CSS.”
Urban dictionary failed me. Unless you were offering me tight fitting jeans.
Sean D. Martin: “So you ask a hypothetical question and then act as if the answer you want for it is an accepted fact. I don’t know how many people. You got any data or poll to show what it is?
Personally I expect if phrased that way, “Was Obama sent by God?”, that you’d get rather low numbers among liberals/Democrats. Certainly lower than “Was Bush sent by God?” would get among the right.”
The point was, Sean, that Mister ed mocked the modern Republican party for George Bush claiming God indicated he wanted him to be President, and it is the case that many Democrats feel the same way about Barack Obama, and have stated as such. How is it different for Democrats to have gone to church and prayed to God for Barack Obama to become President? Would there be a difference? And honestly, if someone asked Obama a direct question as to how God played a role in his decision to run for President, what do you think he would say? When he told Harry Reid “I have a gift, Harry”, what was he implying there? Who was the gift from?
It’s just blatantly hypocritical for Mister ed to mock Bush for his statement and dismiss similar statements from politicians on the left.
I’m confused. When, exactly, did President Obama say that he believes that God wanted him to be President?
Sean: “TFJ for CSS.”
Urban dictionary failed me. Unless you were offering me tight fitting jeans.
Terrorist Fist Jab.
First awarded by QIB.
I’m confused. When, exactly, did President Obama say that he believes that God wanted him to be President? ed
You’re not confused, ed, you’re being obtuse.
If Obama once said “I think I have an ongoing conversation with God. Throughout the day I’m constantly asking myself questions about what I’m doing, why I am doing it.”
Do you think this revelation, coupled with his declaration that he has a gift, that many other people have likened him to a messiah figure, The One, is in no way an indication that his admitted strong relationship with God would in no way imply that he felt he received some sort of guidance from God to run for President? Or that his “gift”, whoever it is you think he got that gift from, wasn’t a sign to him to pursue the presidency?
And here, Mister ed. Why is it any different for Obama to run brochures in South Carolina declaring that he was “Called to Christ”, Called to Bring Change”, and “Called to Serve”, than it is for Bush to say he answered a similar call?
There’s really not much of a difference, is there?
it is the case that many Democrats feel the same way about Barack Obama, and have stated as such.
Evidence?
I’m not saying they don’t exist, but I’ve never spoken to a single Obama voter who believes he was called to the office by God.
Some see God’s will in Obama win
Maybe you’re just not talking to enough people, Parthy.
But seriously, the distinction I’d like from Mister ed is how what Bush said is any different from Obama feeling like he was answering his own call from God, and that he had a gift, and that other prominent people also think he was sent by God to lead. I personally don’t see a whole lot of difference.
I personally don’t see a whole lot of difference.
That’s because you’re a dumbass straw warrior.
I wonder if Obama understands and believes in evolution, contra George Bush, Jr. Dennis, do you?
This guy was a nobody until he dared ask an uncomfortable question of Obama.
But it was not an uncomfortable question, and he got a thoughtful and detailed answer, much more detailed than he would have gotten from McCain.
Quaker, what happened to the life he had before he dared ask The Question? Can he possibly go back to it?
He probably could if he’d just shut up already. and I wish he would, but he’s an attention whore, just like the rest of the GOP, and he can’t give it up now.
t is more than a bit disengenuous to suggest that the McCain/Palin campain only used Joe as part of their ‘campign of ideas’ when anyone not blinded by dogma must know that their campaign was bereft of ideas.
Indeed, they used Joe INSTEAD of ideas, answers, or suggestions.
I expect him to be on reality shows and “The Plumber Apprentice” any day now. If he doesn’t run for President instead.
Ah, yes. I can see it now on the Fox Reality channel.
“The Plumber’s Helper”
TFJ© is a Kryptonite to Stupid Exclusive.
Evidence?
Shorter Dennis: No thank you.
Shorter Dennis: No thank you. Duros
Shorter Duros: I’m much too stupid to open up the link Dennis provided and read the evidence so I’ll just make the usual ‘Shorter Dennis’ reference.
That’s because you’re a dumbass straw warrior. Mister ed
It was a straw man for you to provide a quote about George Bush and apply it to the whole Republican party, especially given the fact you won’t address blatantly similar references made by and about your current President. Makes you a hypocrite and a chickenshit, which is common for you, ed.
Whatever, Denny.
Obama has never said God wanted him to be President.
George Bush did.
That’s the difference.
I wonder if Obama understands and believes in evolution, contra George Bush, Jr. Dennis, do you? Mister ed
I believe in devolution, Mister ed. It’s happening to you on a rapid scale. I can see it, it’s happening so fast.
Obama has never said God wanted him to be President.
George Bush did.
That’s the difference. Duros
That’s idiotic, Duros.
Read this: Barack Obama: “Committed Christian — Called to Bring Change”
How can it be different when he says he was “Called to Christ,” “Called to Bring Change” and “Called to Serve”.
Or are you saying he was called by someone different than God? Or that God was calling him to do those things, but God didn’t specifically mention going as far a becoming President?
No, Duros. There is no difference.
Many people feel a calling outside themselves. That is not the same thing as saying “God told me to be President.”
that many other people conservative bloviators have likened him to a messiah figure
fixed that for you
Many people feel a calling outside themselves. That is not the same thing as saying “God told me to be President.” Duros
Weak, Duros. So you’re saying Obama wasn’t implying that he was being called by God, even though on the same brochure where he stated these callings it included in big bold letters, ‘COMMITTED CHRISTIAN’, and described how he “felt a beckoning and accepted Jesus Christ into [his] life”:”?
No real discernible difference between that language and what Bush said.
Dennis: The point was, Sean, that Mister ed mocked the modern Republican party for George Bush claiming God indicated he wanted him to be President, and it is the case that many Democrats feel the same way about Barack Obama, and have stated as such. How is it different for Democrats to have gone to church and prayed to God for Barack Obama to become President?
There is a difference, Dennis, between someone saying “God sent me” and someone saying “Thank God so-and-so is President.”
I know you want to keep pushing the “Obama is viewed as the Messiah” meme so you can then scoff at folks for something they haven’t actually said. But let’s at least acknowledge there is a difference between, David Koresh’s view and that of someone who is grateful for something.
Dennis: that many other people have likened him to a messiah figure, The One,
Again, this is an idea pushed by those opposed to Obama. Yes, there are certainly some who have voiced glowing opinions of Obama and may have said “sent by God” or something akin to it. But nowhere near the number of people on the right who are pushing this idea that Obama is widely viewed as some kind of “Messiah”. It’s an idea the right want to keep pushing so they can then dismiss the Obama supporters en masse as infatuated kooks.
No real discernible difference between that language and what Bush said.
Speaking of weak, Denny, my god, split that hair!
There IS a huge difference. There is a difference between “I felt a calling to Christianity” and “God told me personally that I should be President.”
The sad fact that you can’t see that just further points out your intellectual dishonesty.
Whatever, Denny.
Sean-
Seriously, anyone scoffing at the ‘Messiah’ moniker now is in no way any different than you guys here scoffing and chuckling at the ‘teabagger’ moniker for anyone who went to the recent tea parties. The messiah references started with his supporters and his detractors picked up on it. Same thing with teabaggers, you guys claim.
And it wasn’t just “Thank God he is President”. Certainly not what Nancy Pelosi said, or even close to that on what was on his brochure he distributed all throughout South Carolina.
And if he said he was “Called to bring Change” and Change is his primary campaign promise, how can you believe at all that the messiah reference didn’t indeed start with him and his people?
I don’t get it, Sean. I really don’t see how you deny that it all started with he and his supporters.
I don’t get it
No shit, Sherlock.
No shit, Sherlock. ed
You’re a mental coward, ed.
A drive-by, idiotic, hypocritical mental midget.
You can’t verbalize your mockery of what Bush said and draw any distinction whatsoever to things Obama and his supporters have said about him regarding his calling to God.
Why don’t you just recite your usual Rush Limbaugh mantra and call it a day?
Here’s a really simple difference, regardless of how both Presidents phrased their relationship to God.
Bush used his “calling” as an excuse to shape public policy around his Christian faith.
Obama has done no such thing so far and has not expressed any intentions to do so
If I wanted to live in a theocracy I’d move to Iran.
A drive-by, idiotic, hypocritical mental midget.
I know you are, but what am I?
No tagbacks.
Infinity.
.
There IS a huge difference. There is a difference between “I felt a calling to Christianity” and “God told me personally that I should be President.” The sad fact that you can’t see that just further points out your intellectual dishonesty.
Whatever, Denny. Duros
That’s not quite the comparison between statements I drew, Duros. But let’s assume I concede to you there is a difference. Is that difference of how Obama stated his ‘calling to change’, his ‘calling to lead’, so great that it causes no concern for you whatsoever, but Bush’s statement somehow does? Such that Bush’s should be mocked and ridiculed along with every Republican, but Obama’s statements were completely innocuous in comparison?
You think that is being intellectually honest, Duros?
I know you are, but what am I?
No tagbacks. ed
Just answer a question honestly every once in a while, ed.
If you think Obama pretends to be religious for political expediency, just as he does with the gay marriage issue, just say it. Nothing to be embarrassed about. Even his ‘mentor’ said he was just another politician.
Dennis: Seriously, anyone scoffing at the ‘Messiah’ moniker now is in no way any different than you guys here scoffing and chuckling at the ‘teabagger’ moniker for anyone who went to the recent tea parties.
Show me a rally where hundreds are showing up waving placards saying “He is the Messiah” and showing up in Nightly News interviews calling themselves “Messiah-gers” and I’ll start to see some similarity.
So Sean, to you it’s all a matter of which side had more of something as to right and wrong. Before you argued the point to me that there were certainly more people on the right who would say that ‘Bush was sent from God’, than the number of people on the left who would say that ‘Obama was sent from God’. So therefore Bush is a religious nut for saying God called him to be President, but Obama gets the pass and in no way is Obama one for saying essentially the same thing because fewer of his supporters actually believe it.
And same with the ‘teabagger’ moniker. You are peeved that Obama’s detractors would use a moniker that was originated by his supporters in reference to him, while at the same time quite amused at the teabagger moniker because it originated with people in the majority who are not Obama supporters. B
But your justification for how one is ok and one is not is because there were more teabaggers than there were people making messiah references to Obama?
Am I getting that about right?
Is that difference of how Obama stated his ‘calling to change’, his ‘calling to lead’, so great that it causes no concern for you whatsoever, but Bush’s statement somehow does? Such that Bush’s should be mocked and ridiculed along with every Republican, but Obama’s statements were completely innocuous in comparison?
Yes. And yes.
Can we fucking move on now?
There is no point whatsoever in arguing with Dennis.
Seriously.
There is no point whatsoever in arguing with Dennis.
–Southern Quacker
Yet the last time you tried and I asked you how it was that you managed to sell your house with no trouble but converting your equity holdings to cash or fixed income was too much of ‘a pain in the ass’, you just flittered away.
Dennis, believe it or not I do have a life, and can’t afford to spend endless time running around in circles trying to hold rational discussions with you. …
nah, not worth it.
Just answer a question honestly every once in a while, ed.
What is the question? Please phrase it in a succinct, non-loaded manner such as,
or
Thanks in advance.
(P.S. Who’s the chickenshit now, chickenshit?)
Dennis: Am I getting that about right?
Nope. Not really at all.
Southern Quaker: nah, not worth it.
Now he’s getting it about right.
Oh, and chickenshit Dennis, “Do you believe in evolution?” would be one more example of a direct question. Kthxbai.
Sean, just for the record, I’m of the feminine persuasion.
OK, one more example for you Dennis:
Enjoy!
Do you agree with the Joe the Plumber statement noted in this blog post?
No.
Oh, and chickenshit Dennis, “Do you believe in evolution?” would be one more example of a direct question. Kthxbai.
Yes.
“Do you believe Rush Limbaugh is a racist asshole.”
In general, no more of one than Joe Biden. Far less of an asshole than you are currently, and far less of a racist than you at one time highly likely were, since you have this unusual penchant for declaring other white guys as racist and frequently boast of having Black Friends.
Southern Quaker: Sean, just for the record, I’m of the feminine persuasion.
Y’know, I wondered about that when I bolded the “he”. I’ll remember for next time. The default assumption always seems to be that posters are guys, when in fact many of us have never actually said anything to specify which sex we are. And I know folks have often gotten it wrong..
We just automatically assume that guys have nothing better to do all friggin’ day. And folks of the feminine persuasion have lives.
And stuff.
At least I do.
At least I do.
You have a life? or a presumption?
Ah, the ambiguity
A presumption. Sorry for the ambiguousness.
In general, no more of one than Joe Biden.
This sounds like a quantitative measurement, and as such, I challenge you to Racist Faux Pas Showdown. You, or anybody who agrees with you, should toss into this thread one example of Joe Biden’s racism. I, or anybody who disagrees with you, will toss out one similar example of Limbaugh’s racism.
First person to run out of bullets loses.
Game, Dennis?
First person to run out of bullets loses.
Game, Dennis? Spider J
Racism isn’t quantitative to me, Spider. Nor is it a game.
Though I believe it is here with Mr. ed.
If it’s not quantitative to you, then don’t make quantitative fucking comparisons, Dennis.
But I applaud your nobility, Prince Valiant.
Though I believe it is here with Mr. ed.
Nope, I just try to call out racist assholes like modern Republican party de facto leader Rush Limbaugh and their defenders. And the ongoing Southern Strategy. It’s important.
Nope, I just try to call out racist assholes like modern Republican party de facto leader Rush Limbaugh and their defenders. And the ongoing Southern Strategy. It’s important. ed
If it was as important as you say, then you’d be aware that screeching it every time you post is overkill. And the overkill diminishes its effect. It’s not about calling it out for you, it’s about making yourself feel better. It’s mental masturbation to you.
The guilt must be awful, ed. Tell us more about your Black Friends and how you think you are helping them by repeating over and over what a racist Rush Limbaugh is on some blog.
Do they thank you for your wonderful deeds? Do they tell you how much better you’ve made their lives?
It’s like Mama always said: Racist asshole (and their defender) is as racist asshole (and their defender) does.
If it’s not quantitative to you, then don’t make quantitative fucking comparisons, Dennis.
Dennis, the quintessential modern Republican, cannot be bothered with staying consistent. He has more straw to fight.
It’s like Mama always said: Racist asshole (and their defender) is as racist asshole (and their defender) does. ed
You defend Joe Biden and Jeremiah Wright. I imagine Mama wouldn’t be too proud of little ed Jr. Or maybe Mama’s a hypocrite too when it comes to racism being a function of what political side she happens to agree with.
I’m not fighting straw any more than you are, Mister ed. You made a ridiculous statement about Bush and his calling and you are too much of a coward to back it up. You hide behind other posters who come on to defend you. It’s what you always do.
A drive-by coward.