Howard Fineman, STFU
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I realize it’s Super Bowl weekend and Fineman’s looking for a hook. But this one trying to put President Obama and Steelers coach Mike Tomlin in the same boat is ridiculous. God bless Mike Tomlin’s accomplishments on the football field, but he’s the head coach of a football team. He’s part of the entertainment industry.
Barack Obama is president of the United States. It’s not an entertainment job. Yeah, they’re both black. But then so are a lot of people in America.
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© 2000-2011 Oliver Willis
But didn’t you know (actually you’re probably tired of hearing that crap) that black people are here for white Villagers’ entertainment?
[/sarcasm for the brain-impaired and conservatives]
I think he needs to have a little talk with Dick Gregory.
http://www.patriotledger.com/archive/x694603211/Plymouth-civil-rights-activist-Dick-Gregory-looks-forward-to-inauguration
God bless Mike Tomlin’s accomplishments on the football field, but he’s the head coach of a football team. He’s part of the entertainment industry.
What a coincidence! So is Fineman!
Yeah, well I guess Tiger Woods is in the entertainment industry, too. Didn’t stop too many starry-eyed Obama supporters from objecting to the million or so comparisons made to him in the last couple years.
I don’t see the difference why Tiger is an acceptable comparison but woe unto the journalist who makes a comparison to Mike Tomlin on this Super Bowl weekend.
Seriously, who gives a crap? Pretty mild as far as the normal gushing that goes on on the nightly cable stations Fineman guests on. Fineman grew up in Pittsburgh; he’s not an idiot, and he knows what a big deal it was for Dan Rooney to hire Tomlin. The comparisons he made between the two are fair and it was an informative and pretty decent article.
Even though it’s standard fare here for someone to say STFU on just about every thread, this article doesn’t deserve it.
Didn’t stop too many starry-eyed Obama supporters from objecting to the million or so comparisons made to him in the last couple years.
Examples, please.
Howard Fineman is the guy who compared Commander Bunnypants to Shane. Really, that happened. He’s a fucking disgrace and yet another example of how the media isn’t actually liberal.
Well they’re both celebrities, and they’re both black. Good enough for these folks, I suppose.
And football, and sports in general, take on a weird level of hyper-importance anywhere you go. I swear, they use the same narrator for those NFL Films as they do for the History Channel WWII films. If not, he adds a similar level of gravity to the topic. Keeping that in mind, it’s not out of the realm of possibility that people could see nfl head coach in the same grouping with president.
[...] Oliver points out some real stupidity from Howard Fineman: [...]
And were we at least spared the Presidential phone call to the locker room, congratulating the winning team? Talk about conflating entertainment and politics… I’m not sure ’cause I may have missed it in all the post-game interviews.
Bush’s calls to World Series winners and Olympics medalists were pathetic.
Bush’s calls to World Series winners and Olympics medalists were pathetic.
Once a cheerleader, always a cheerleader.
And were we at least spared the Presidential phone call to the locker room, congratulating the winning team?
-The very aptly titled ‘anotherbozo’
Do you happen to know anything about Barack Obama and the Pittsburgh Steelers, Dan Rooney, Mike Tomlin, Franco Harris, etc.? First thing out of Rooney’s mouth when he got the Lombardi trophy was a very creepy thank President Obama for his support, reminiscent of a star player or coach who first thanks Jesus for his performance or victory when asked by an interviewer.
—
Oliver points out some real stupidity from Howard Fineman
What real stupidity, Parthy? Sports figures and Presidents? Like this is somehow a first with any President, or with this president? Or black sports figures and this president? Try googling Obama and Tony Dungy, or Lovie Smith, or as I stated before, Tiger Woods.
But Lincoln, Reagan, Kennedy, Gandhi, MLK… all those are perfectly appropriate and valid comparisons? The logic here is baffling, to say the least.
“I’d like to thank my mom and dad and God,” [Ben]Roethlisberger said. “But I can’t forget our new President Barack Obama; he showed the country that we can achieve anything. Thank you, this victory was because of you too.”
Oliver wants to write about real stupidity, he’s got enough ammunition in that statement alone than Fineman’s whole article. Great performance by Big Ben, though, aside from the hagiography.
Hey Dennis, we’re not here to do your homework for you. Telling *us* to Google for *your* evidence is the same as saying, “I have nothing, and I’m blowing a smokescreen to try to hide that.” You make the claim, you back it up.
And your comparison of Rooney doesn’t change anything. You’re blathering about how he’s just as bad (assuming you’re telling the truth about that; going to tell us to Google that one for you also?). Maybe he is, but that doesn’t change the fact that Fineman was being a serious moron.
What real stupidity, Parthy?
I didn’t say that, amigo. That was balloon juice linking to OW’s post. The new comment software makes it look as though it’s attached to the previous comment.
Sorry, Parthy. My mistake.
Still waiting on Tiger Woods=Obama, Dennis. Where are the “millions” of “starry-eyed Obama supporters” comparing them? Because that was a talking point of right wing morons, not Obama supporters, you nitwit.
Excellent catch Crusty Dem.
ed, I’m as guilty of switching out names, places, and ideologies as anyone, but before anyone makes a ridiculous accusations like Dennis’, a quick check of teh google is in order (since “millions” should at least be >>>1).
CD, that’s what Dennis and his lame-o ilk do: make baseless assertions. Why just the other day, Dennis told us about all the liberals who wanted Bush to fail. He didn’t give us a single specific, linkable instance of course. It’s like Bill O’Reilly writ infinitesimally small.
A tiger, he’s not: enough with the Obama-Woods comparison
”’But [Dowd} Dowd said it anyway, and the phrase has caught on; if you search the Nexis database for stories containing “Barack Obama” and “Tiger Woods,” you’ll find 1,232 examples. That makes it official, at least in the world of the punditocracy: Barack Obama is the Tiger Woods of politics.
Crusty the Clown and Stalker ed. Even Jessica Alba’s googling skills and political acumen put you two to shame. Seriously.
1,232 stories by May, 2008, the time the Bellavia mention first hit the liberal blogs ‘Hey, let’s make something racial out of this’ national scene. Many more comparisons to Woods since then. I stated that millions of starry-eyed Obama supporters had no objection to Obama-Tiger Woods comparisons. I could be wrong, but I don’t see where even Oliver has objected to Obama being compared to Woods, and I’m curious as to why the Tomlin reference is so much worse.
Seriously, Crusty the Clown and ed. I just assume everyone here knows all this and it doesn’t need repeating or specific examples. It’s like you two just started reading political blogs back in September.
Love how Dennis’s link (hey, Dennis figured out how to link!) featured the Bellavia Boner, the incident with which Crusty Dem nailed Dennis upthread. Nice job, dumbfuck.
So if you got a specific link which, you know, supports your thesis, you may wish to share it with us. And we’ll take all those examples of prominent liberals who were publicly expressing hope that George Bush Junior would fail now. You know, ’cause there are so many of them. (And the “several tenets of the Laffer Curve,” natch.) Thanks in advance.
Stalker ed, you are a complete idiot. I gave you and Crusty the Clown what you both asked for and you respond to something tangential, something you always do.
CD, that’s what Dennis and his lame-o ilk do: make baseless assertions. -Stalker ed
So, what’s baseless, eduardo? There have been over 1,200 stories on Obama-Woods comparisons as of May, 2008, according to Nexis, and very few objections by liberal bloggers and jorunalists; my assertion from the beginning.
Do you refute that that assertion? Or do you just want to talk about Bellavia as a defense mechanism so as not to reveal your pathetic ignorance of the subject?
There have been over 1,200 stories on Obama-Woods comparisons as of May, 2008, according to Nexis, and very few objections by liberal bloggers and jorunalists; my assertion from the beginning.
And yet the only specific example you chose to link to was one which contained objections by liberal bloggers (and, as was already noted, was already noted by Crusty Dem). Jeezus are you stupid. You make Sarah Palin sound like John Stuart Mill.
And yet the only specific example you chose to link to was one which contained objections by liberal bloggers
I didn’t see objections by liberal bloggers in that link, unless you think Byron York is liberal. Doesn’t change my assertion, in which you continue to flounder in trying to refute. Is it not enough for you that a Nexis search found over 1,200 stories written comparing the two by that time, or do you need all 1,200 of them to be satisfied that there are more than one, which Crusty the Clown was contending there were not. Why else would Bellavia have said ‘You can have your Tiger Woods’ unless many comparisons had not already been made?
I swear, Zython is less clueless than you are.
Dennis, I know you’re a moron right-wing troll, but you said “Didn’t stop too many starry-eyed Obama supporters from objecting to the million or so comparisons made to him in the last couple years.” and I demonstrated that Obama supporters objected to the comparison. For your literacy-challenged brain, that does not mean that no one ever compared the two, it means that Obama supporters objected to the comparison, rather than endorsing it.
But I am amused by your impotent anger.
he showed the country that we can achieve anything.
I don’t see anything wrong with this statement. What’s the problem?
But Lincoln, Reagan, Kennedy, Gandhi, MLK… all those are perfectly appropriate and valid comparisons? The logic here is baffling, to say the least.
Well I don’t recall any Gandhi comparison. I do recall Lincoln by virtue of speaking ability and political skills (though for both it’s certainly premature; Lincoln’s record is unparalleled), Kennedy for being young, open-minded and pragmatic, MLK again for speaking skills, Reagan for political skills…
See the difference? None of the aforementioned are strictly racial. None of them are saying simply “Hey here’s two black guys being awesome! Are they twins or what?”
I didn’t see objections by liberal bloggers in that link
That’s because you’re a dumbfuck, dumbfuck.
and I demonstrated that Obama supporters objected to the comparison.– Crusty the Clown
Where, Crusty? I know about the Bellavia incident, if that’s what you are talking about. Sure, a few liberal bloggers objected to what Bellavia said because they weakly tried to make his statement into some sort of racial slur. But they didn’t object to the Woods comparison. Besides, like I displayed, there had been many comparisons well before the Ballavia incident with few, if any, objections.
And that incident came and went without much of a peep because liberals and Dems wanted the comparisons to Tiger Woods AND they wanted to make his statement into a racial put-down, and they couldn’t have it both ways.
Like Stalker ed, you seem to enjoy getting bogged down in minutiae and way off-topic tangents. Why is the lone comparison to Tomlin so much worse than the many, many more comparisons made to Tiger Woods that it warrants a ‘STFU’ in the title of the blog thread?
I didn’t see objections by liberal bloggers in that link
That’s because you’re a dumbfuck, dumbfuck.
–Stalker ed
Why don’t you copy and paste the objections made by liberal bloggers in that link. Besides, I didn’t say there were no bloggers who objected, just not many. And almost no real journalists.
Why don’t you copy and paste the objections made by liberal bloggers in that link.
Why don’t you? Oh wait…
Parthenon-
1) Gandhi
I’m inspired by Mahatma Gandhi, says Obama
Gandhi made Obama possible: Congresmen
Don’t confuse Obama with Gandhi – Norman Finkelstein
2) Comparisons made by Fineman aside from race:
-In many ways, Obama and Tomlin share a similar, almost paradoxical, outlook: they are pathbreaking traditionalists.
-They stand shoulder to shoulder for hard work, academic accomplishment, family values, attentive parenting and performance-based, no-excuses accountability on their chosen battlefields.
-On a national level, race has nothing to do with the Tomlin story.
-Tomlin has delivered, and that doesn’t just mean that he’s won lots of games. It’s the image and the actions: focused, direct and intense. He is a poetry-quoting drill sergeant who tries to have breakfast at home with his three kids almost every day, who closely supervises their homework, who keeps almost ludicrously detailed notes on every aspect of his football work life, who preaches disciplined teamwork with an almost religious zeal.
-Obama is more laid back, but the traditionalists approach is the same—witness his superbly organized and self-disciplined campaign.
Parthy, there are more and I’m taking up too much space on this, but Fineman dealt very little with race comparisons between the two. There is just no way I can understand how someone could read his article and proclaim it’s a “Hey here’s two black guys being awesome! Are they twins or what?” type of comparison. It’s honestly anything but.
Dennis, I’m “bogged down in the minutiae” because you’re thesis statement was not based in fact. Still isn’t. Dozens (or hundreds – but not millions) of bloggers objected to Bellavia’s comments, and you’re still arguing that no Obama supporters objected to Obama=Woods.
The specific objection to this article (other than it is a high profile columnist making a lengthy, direct comparison, as opposed to the Dowd article York cites, which shows why you shouldn’t take a nexis hit for Obama Tiger as proof of anything) is that it stands out as a lazy, stupid, racially-based comparison. What do Obama and Tomlin have in common? They’re black. What else? Not a whole fuck of a lot, as is clear from such interesting comparisons as “Both men are products of urban life” and “Both men are careful about their own public appearance and that of the people around them”. No shit? Both men are bipedal mammals, too, big fucking deal. The article only exists because both men are black, aside from race, the article could be written about Whisenhunt, too.
the article could be written about Whisenhunt, too.
Fair point, except as I’m sure you know, Whisenhut was passed over for the head coaching job for the Steelers and bolted, something Obama doesn’t have on his resume yet. And he’s closer to Obama’s age, but not considered young as far as NFL head coaching positions go compared to Tomlin, and Obama is considering his ascendancy to the presidency so early in his political career. If Whisenhut had taken the Steelers position and taken them to the Super Bowl I’m sure Fineman could make some comparisons if he wanted to, being a ‘burgher and all, but I don’t think the same parallels are there that he listed.
Maybe your last post and mine crossed, but there were a lot more similarities made by Fineman than the couple you listed aside from race.
So you’re moving the goal posts from “no Obama supporters objected” to “no Obama supporters objected for the right reasons”. Whatever, dude, just don’t admit you’re wrong, I’d lose all respect for you.
No. Nothing remotely insightful (“pathbreaking traditionalists” idiocy included). It’s pretty easy to compare any two individuals or groups, one needs look no further than Jonah Goldberg comparing liberals to Hitler to see how quick one can get to pointless stupidity with those comparisons.
The whole point is, this article is only written because both men are black. And it’s a dumb article, regardless. I’m officially done with it, since I’ve now spent far more time discussing it than the idiot Fineman spent writing it..
Dozens (or hundreds – but not millions) of bloggers objected to Bellavia’s comments, and you’re still arguing that no Obama supporters objected to Obama=Woods.
–Crusty Dem
I never said bloggers didn’t object to Bellavia’s comments. Even still, not many of them could make heads or tails as to what he was saying.
Keith Olbermann (yes, a liberal blogger): Since I first heard this today, I’ve been trying to figure out, with some sports background in my past, if the veteran there was not talking about race, what he could have been talking about. Because what is there to be dismissive about about Tiger Woods? He’s an almost unbeatable golfer. He is, in fact, the man who re-calibrated what had been a very non-diverse sport and because of that re-calibration, everybody in it made a lot more money than they would have otherwise. He brought people a lot of green, never mind any other color. If you’re comparing anybody to Tiger Woods on a non-racial basis, the other guy loses, doesn’t he?
On the bottom of the page of the link you just provided, the astute liberal blogger, Nicole Belle:
The only thing that SilentPatriot and I could come up with is that it’s a vaguely racial comment, although it’s unclear how being multi-racial (which both Woods and Obama are) is somehow a bad thing.
CD, my ‘thesis’ if you want to call it that, is I don’t think on the whole, the Tiger Woods-Barack Obama comparisons have gotten anywhere near the same criticism as this blog post does to Fineman’s with Mike Tomlin. And I don’t understand why Oliver has never objected to Woods comparisons before, but does with this one to Mike Tomlin.
Fair point, except as I’m sure you know, Whisenhut was passed over for the head coaching job for the Steelers and bolted, something Obama doesn’t have on his resume yet.
What the hell could that possibly mean? There’s Don Luskin Stupid, there’s Doug Feith Stupid, there’s Sarah Palin Stupid, there’s George Bush Junior Stupid, and then there’s Dennis Stupid.
What the hell could that possibly mean?– Zython ed
Just what it says, genius. Wiz was passed over for a job and he headed out of Dodge. I’m not aware of anything similar with Obama.
It’s honestly anything but.
Well sure, he skips around it. But it’s there lurking, eh? Would he have written it about Ken Whisenhunt, had the Cards pulled it out? Did he find a handful of common personality traits between George W. Bush and Dick Vermeil a few years back?
Just a weird article all around.
But it’s there lurking, eh?
I don’t know, Parthy, I don’t see it, lurking or explicit, but maybe you and I view it from different perspectives. I think for the most part Fineman is an honest guy and not one to write a story just to link two successful black guys because they share the same skin color.
I just wish he wouldn’t appear on the three most loony left liberal cable tv shows as often as he does. Guess he’s under contract to do it, though, poor guy.
Beat this horse to a pulp. I’m out.
Peace and namaste.
Dumbfuck Dennis writes:
I think for the most part Fineman is an honest guy…
My point at 11:15 stands.
Dumbfuck Dennis writes
I’m dumb yet you comment on everything I write as if you were the president of my fan club.
Dennis, lay off the cold medication, OK?
Dennis: “I’m dumb yet you comment on everything I write as if you were the president of my fan club.”
And you respond to (nearly) everything he writes.
And you respond to (nearly) everything he writes.–CS Lewis Strowbridge
And you aid, abet and continually defend Stalker ed’s sick perversion.
Your sole contribution to this thread.
Me: “And you respond to (nearly) everything he writes.–CS Lewis Strowbridge”
Dennis: “And you aid, abet and continually defend Stalker ed’s sick perversion.”
He’s not a stalker if you respond to him. Simple as that. So cut out the victim whining.
Oh, I’m no victim. He’s a sick stalker and I don’t give a shit what he writes because he’s also a fraud. You and he both enjoy creating noise and confusion on someone else’s bandwidth as your contribution to defending idiotic comments.
He has little to add in the way of honest political debate and you get agitated when the conversation isn’t about comic books or movies, which isn’t often here.
Dennis: “Oh, I’m no victim. He’s a sick stalker and I don’t give a shit what he writes because he’s also a fraud.”
Clearly you give a shit, or you wouldn’t respond to him (nearly) every time. He’s not a stalker. You two are have a personal flamewar. There’s a huge difference.
Now, if he followed you to another site, you might have something. But you are making accusations you can’t back up.
“He has little to add in the way of honest political debate and you get agitated when the conversation isn’t about comic books or movies, which isn’t often here.”
Comic books & movies? I come here for the politics.
It sounds like you are just throwing out words hoping they magically form a point.
Clearly you give a shit, or you wouldn’t respond to him (nearly) every time.
I don’t give a shit in that I don’t feel victimized. He doesn’t bother me. He actually amuses me. That’s what I meant. If I was playing the victim, I’d be looking for some support from someone. But he needs you to back him up, or you obviously feel he needs your support.
And that has nothing to do with politics, so I question your sincerity when you say you come here for the politics. Especially when you brag to your fans about how much you like screwing around with conservatives you have no respect for.
If you come here for the politics, why no comment on this blog topic? Why don’t you tell me why that article is so wrong, why it’s racist, and why Fineman should ‘STFU’. And why OW chose to admonish a comparison of Obama to Mike Tomlin, but said nothing about anything wrong with Obama- Tiger Woods comps, which have been made in abundance over the last two years? I’ve wondered that since my very first post on here and no one has yet to even try to answer it, so I’m a bit baffled that you accuse me of just throwing out words to magically form a point.
“I don’t give a shit in that I don’t feel victimized. He doesn’t bother me. He actually amuses me. That’s what I meant. If I was playing the victim, I’d be looking for some support from someone.”
You keep saying that and maybe one day you will believe it.
“But he needs you to back him up, or you obviously feel he needs your support.”
You are just talking out of your ass now.
You and Ed have a personal flamewar that you are both responsible for. Ed is not stalking you any more than anyone on this site can stalk another person.
Ed and I are not wasting OW’s bandwidth.
Ed does not need me to defend him.
No one is running to defend you, because you are wrong.
I am merely pointing out that your accusations are factually incorrect. Maybe if you left this site, and Ed followed you to another site, you could say he was stalking you.
“And that has nothing to do with politics, so I question your sincerity…”
And I question your sincerity.
“And why OW chose to admonish a comparison of Obama to Mike Tomlin, but said nothing about anything wrong with Obama- Tiger Woods comps, which have been made in abundance over the last two years?”
If I were to guess, it would be because OW follows NFL and doesn’t follow golf.
I don’t follow either, so I can’t make a comment.
I also don’t follow comics anymore. Which is why you don’t see me in the DC Crisis thread. I didn’t comment in the Transformers trailer thread, or G.I.Joe trailer thread.
I did comment in the Star Trek trailer thread, but that’s one for four.
“…so I’m a bit baffled that you accuse me of just throwing out words to magically form a point.”
You are one for four in the ‘comics and movies’ comment. So yeah, I don’t think you have a point.
If I were to guess, it would be because OW follows NFL and doesn’t follow golf.
And my guess is a follower of golf or not, he knows a whole hell of a lot more about Tiger than he does Mike Tomlin.
My guess also is, living in the DC/Baltimore area and haaving suffered through four excruciating losses between the ‘Skins and the Dirty Birds, he’s not a big fan of the ‘Six’-burgh Steelers, either. Thus the ‘STFU’ directive to a Pgh-native journalist who wrote a fair, relevant, pertinent and informative article that didn’t deserve the criticism he gave it, or even what little was provided.
Me: “If I were to guess, it would be because OW follows NFL and doesn’t follow golf.”
Dennis: “And my guess is a follower of golf or not, he knows a whole hell of a lot more about Tiger than he does Mike Tomlin.”
Why? He knows he’s a good golfer, but probably nothing about his personality.
“My guess also is, living in the DC/Baltimore area and haaving suffered through four excruciating losses between the ‘Skins and the Dirty Birds, he’s not a big fan of the ‘Six’-burgh Steelers, either. Thus the ‘STFU’ directive to a Pgh-native journalist who wrote a fair, relevant, pertinent and informative article that didn’t deserve the criticism he gave it, or even what little was provided.”
So you are making accusations against OW based on… sports rivalries.
By the way, I noticed you dropped every other point I made.
Admitting defeat on those?