Somebody Tell John McCain He Lost The Election

January 25th, 2009 John McCain 38 Comments

McCain wants a rewrite of the stimulus bill? Off the top of my head I can think of 69 million reasons why John McCain doesn’t get a rewrite of the stimulus bill.

Posted in John McCain | Tags: 2008 Election, Stimulus

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38 Responses to “Somebody Tell John McCain He Lost The Election”

Jay Tea says:

January 25, 2009 at 3:08 pm

…and I can think of one reason that trumps all of yours:

John McCain is, unlike Barack Obama, still a United States Senator and has the legal right to propose amendments to bills before the Senate.

Obama has the right to sign it, not sign it, or veto it — NOT the right to rewrite it.

Yes, practically speaking, Obama can propose and influence legislation, but only through the cooperation of Representatives and Senators. But strictly speaking, McCain has far more right to rewrite legislation than Obama does.

Obama would know this if he’d bothered to show up for work in the Senate on occasion…

J.
natthedem says:

January 25, 2009 at 3:22 pm

I’m sure McCain’s attempt to rewrite the stimulus will be about as successful as the last time he tried this. I hope he doesn’t have any interviews with David Letterman on the calendar.
August J. Pollak says:

January 25, 2009 at 4:06 pm

Obama would know this if he’d bothered to show up for work in the Senate on occasion…

Jesus, you’re stupid.
midderpidge says:

January 25, 2009 at 4:19 pm

I understand McCain made the unselfish decision to suspend his campaign, again, to rush back to Washington and work on fixing the economy. Kudos, Senator.
Zython says:

January 25, 2009 at 4:28 pm

Obama has the right to sign it, not sign it, or veto it — NOT the right to rewrite it.

Unless he were to do a signing statement, like your hero, The Decider.
justadood says:

January 25, 2009 at 4:29 pm

August….your link was a good’un….makes me wanna move to Wisconsin and have Feingold (0%votes missed) working for me.

About the only point JayTea makes that I’m forced (kicking and growling) to agree with is that yes, McCain does indeed have the power, as Senator, to propose rewrites to legislation like the Stimulus Bill. Now, to get him away from his golf or girlfriends to actually *propose* or *Vote*……

One point made elsewhere, that bears appearing here: Dems control commanding majorities in both Houses, so let’s chuck this ‘bi-partisan’ crap. Propose your Vision, stand by it, and make it succeed! Any proposal that has ReThug fingerprints on it will help the Billionaires at the expense of the working folks, so I’m generally against anything that ReThugs want…..

We voted in the Adults to take charge…let them take charge, please?
ed says:

January 25, 2009 at 4:33 pm

Results:

Gold: Zython
Silver: August J. Pollack
Bronze: midderpidge
Jay Tea says:

January 25, 2009 at 4:33 pm

Hey, August, the campaign’s over. We can stop comparing and contrasting Obama with the guy he beat, and instead judge him on his own merits.

Also, my comment was based on knowledge of what the job entails. McCain’s been in the Senate for over 20 years; he knows the job. Obama started running for president after about a year in office.

And I knew if I threw in a little dig there, someone would latch on to it and ignore the main point of my comment — that Oliver apparently has no freaking idea about the roles of senators vs. the president in crafting legislation.

Here’s a hint: one of the branches is called “legislative” for a reason. And it ain’t the one Obama’s heading up.

Perhaps Oliver should stick with recycling Media Matters press releases for his blog while he bones up on basic civics…

J.
Oliver Willis says:

January 25, 2009 at 5:07 pm

I thought you would give up on your anger after swearing in day. For those of you who want to read Media Matters press releases they are here. I haven’t published any here (I tend to link to items and research), though I love to link to progressive critiques of the mainstream media. The folks at FAIR do good work as well.

Also: Jaytea and the other cons apparently live in a world where the president has not a single hand in the crafting of legislation. He or she just sits on their hands and hopes that congress can read their mind. Surely the president never works with members of congress in order to introduce legislation furthering his or her agenda, nor does the president ever ever make it known the parameters for which he or she will sign legislation that passes through the congress.

Never!
Jay Tea says:

January 25, 2009 at 5:09 pm

Shorter Oliver:

“Don’t look at my article called “We Checked,” and don’t actually read the part of Jay Tea’s comment where he mentions presidents working with and through members of Congress! And don’t look at the man behind the curtain, either!”

OK, so it wasn’t exactly short, but you get the point…

J.
jr says:

January 25, 2009 at 5:44 pm

“Don’t primary me! I’ll do anything”-John McCain to Pat Toomey
Dave in SoCal says:

January 25, 2009 at 5:48 pm

Jaytea and the other cons apparently live in a world where the president has not a single hand in the crafting of legislation.

And apparently Oliver and the other libs here live in a fantasy world where President “I won” Obama has ultimate authority over everything and can do anything he wants simply because he won the election.

Welcome to the real world guys.
Oliver Willis says:

January 25, 2009 at 6:12 pm

If anyone actually said that, Dave, you might have a point. Same for Jaytea. Together the two of you have enough straw for an entire farm.
August J. Pollak says:

January 25, 2009 at 6:13 pm

And apparently Oliver and the other libs here live in a fantasy world where President “I won” Obama has ultimate authority over everything and can do anything he wants simply because he won the election.

Jesus, you’re stupid.
fafaroo says:

January 25, 2009 at 6:14 pm

And I knew if I threw in a little dig there, someone would latch on to it and ignore the main point of my comment — that Oliver apparently has no freaking idea about the roles of senators vs. the president in crafting legislation.

Jay Tea, are you on crack again? Is Dave in SoCal your dealer?

It should be obvious to anyone who is either not on crack or, apparently, not crashing after an eight year binge on idiotic far right talking points, that Oliver was referring to McCain’s political capital relative to Obama’s, not the Constitutional authority of either one.

Republicans, with McCain at the top of their slate, got their asses handed to them in November. If McCain wants to rewrite the stimulus bill, he’s welcome to try, but good luck selling that to the American people who’ve already seen McCain “take action” on the subject and were decidedly unimpressed.

And Dave, Obama won the election. It doesn’t mean he can do whatever he wants. He’s only the president, after all. But he’s got the political capital to call McCain’s bluff.

I would love to see McCain try to filibuster a stimulus package in this economic climate. Go for it, dude! I’m that’ll work out real well for ya.
Jay Tea says:

January 25, 2009 at 6:18 pm

So, then, Oliver, enlighten us. The whole point of the election John McCain lost was to keep him IN the Senate and get Barack Obama OUT of it. Had McCain won the election he lost, THEN he’d have no business trying to change proposed legislation. Since he lost, and stayed a seated Senator, it’s not only his right, but his duty (to the constituents he represents) to make the changes he believes necessary to bills.

Apparently, in your world, because McCain lost the election that would have removed him from the Senate (and the legislative branch entirely, and put him at the head of the executive branch), he now has to stop carrying out his duties as Senator from Arizona.

And no, he can’t just vote “present.”

If you wanted that, Oliver, then you should have worked for him to get kicked upstairs out of the Senate.

It’s all spelled out in the Constitution, Oliver. Give it a read some time.

J.
fafaroo says:

January 25, 2009 at 6:25 pm

It’s all spelled out in the Constitution, Oliver. Give it a read some time.

Maybe you’d like to submit your book report on Roe v Wade and the Geneva Conventions while we’re at it, Jay Tea.

I am not surprised you’re clinging to this point so tenaciously, Jay Tea. You clearly think you’ve “caught” someone else here, that’s not you, in a factual error. I understand the thrill of thinking you’re turning the tables, here, or something, but you really should settle down and think this through a little more.

Stop. Think. Then post. That’s all anyone’s ever asked. How hard is that?
Jay Tea says:

January 25, 2009 at 6:32 pm

What’s to think through, fafaroo? The gist of Oliver’s piece seems to be that since John McCain lost the race for the presidency, he should not be acting like the senator he still is.

“Epic fail” seems like a fairly appropriate term to use here.

J.
fafaroo says:

January 25, 2009 at 6:49 pm

“Epic fail” seems like a fairly appropriate term to use here.

Really, Jay Tea. You of all people should not be tossing around the phrase “epic fail”.

Especially given your read on the “gist” of Oliver’s piece.

I think it’s quite an accurate read of the kind of response McCain can expect from the American public if he decides he’s going to threaten a filibuster to get re-writes into the bill.

Quite frankly, I’m surprised McCain is so willing to court humiliating defeat so soon after November.

I guess some people just need to learn the same lesson over and over and over before it sinks in. I’m sure you know the feeling, Jay Tea.
Oliver Willis says:

January 25, 2009 at 6:58 pm

Jesus you are stupid. The Republican party got its ass kicked in November. The American people don’t buy into their shit any more. John McCain has no mandate for his re-write the bill nonsense.

This is an act from you guys, right? Please, tell me its an act. Nobody is this stupid. I know at a minimum you can turn on the computer and operate the keyboard, so you can’t be as stupid as your rhetoric repeatedly sounds.

Can you?
Sean D. Martin says:

January 25, 2009 at 7:12 pm

Jay Tea: The whole point of the election John McCain lost was to keep him IN the Senate and get Barack Obama OUT of it.

Yup, that’s why I voted for Obama. Because I wanted to get Obama out of the Senate so he couldn’t have any influence on legislation anymore.
Jay Tea says:

January 25, 2009 at 7:47 pm

“You’re in the minority now, so you need to STFU and go away!”

Damn, it would have been nice if that had been the attitude when Dodd, Frank, and the rest were protecting their scumbag buddies at Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, and the like from the Republican bills to impose MORE oversight and regulation on them…

J.
C.S.Strowbridge says:

January 25, 2009 at 8:02 pm

J.G.Thayer: “Damn, it would have been nice if that had been the attitude when Dodd, Frank, and the rest were protecting their scumbag buddies at Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac…”

You keep repeating those words, but I don’t think you know what they mean.

I think you are merely repeating talking points, because you are incapable of doing anything more.
OM says:

January 25, 2009 at 8:04 pm

Poor guy… give him something. Maybe enough for a couple of Arizona state fairs?

I had an old uncle who called on me every cousin’s birthday to show me how he can move his ears. But I was polite, and pretended I was amazed. Give McCain something. Even a hug could go a long way.
Parthenon says:

January 25, 2009 at 8:23 pm

It’s his job to represent the interests and concerns of the people and state of Arizona. If he believes withholding his support absent heavier spending restraints is the best way to do that, well fine. That’s what he’s paid to do. Losing the election obviously doesn’t change that. Let him bluster. He’s only 1%, after all.
Zython says:

January 25, 2009 at 9:01 pm

And apparently Oliver and the other libs here live in a fantasy world where President “I won” Obama has ultimate authority over everything and can do anything he wants simply because he won the election.

Actually, according to the precidence set by Bush, he actually can.

Damn, it would have been nice if that had been the attitude when Dodd, Frank, and the rest were protecting their scumbag buddies at Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, and the like from the Republican bills to impose MORE oversight and regulation on them…

Ok, how about a compromise? Dems will take the blame for Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac, and the Pubs will take blame for the Unregulated Credit Market. Deal?
C.S.Strowbridge says:

January 25, 2009 at 10:25 pm

J.G.Thayer: “And I knew if I threw in a little dig there, someone would latch on to it and ignore the main point of my comment — that Oliver apparently has no freaking idea about the roles of senators vs. the president in crafting legislation.”

Or Oliver understands that Obama is the head of the government, and he has political capital. And he understands that McCain, as the loser of the presidential election and in the vast minority in the Senate, and indeed congress as a whole, does not.

This debate reminds me of Lemon Lyman incident on The West Wing. There’s a difference between the rules of government, and the realities. The reality is the president has more power over the laws than any one senator does.

If that weren’t the case, the political parties would not spend hundreds of millions of dollars to win the White House when winning Senate seats would be so much cheaper.

Don’t you agree?
Quaker in a Basement says:

January 25, 2009 at 11:13 pm

when Dodd, Frank, and the rest were protecting their scumbag buddies at Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, and the like from the Republican bills

I keep hearing about this, Mr. Tea, but no one has ever explained how Mssr. Dodd and Frank kept a GOP-controlled Congress from passing stricter regulations.

Can you help with that?
Jaim says:

January 25, 2009 at 11:33 pm

August J. Pollack drinking Jay’s milkshake, twice, ftw.

I think it’s adorable how Republicans are now calling for improved Congressional oversight.

What’s next, calls for a rollback in Presidential authority vis a vis signing statements and “unitary executive” theories? Call for the Vice President to be more transparent in his actions and his hirings?

Oh lordie, allow me to clutcheth my pearls!
Oliver Willis says:

January 26, 2009 at 1:02 am

For 8 years the right has said: The President is KING!*

Why *?

* Not when he’s a Democrat, silly.
Dave in SoCal says:

January 26, 2009 at 11:21 am

For 8 years the right has said: The President is KING!*

If anyone actually said that, Oliver, you might have a point.
Duros 62 says:

January 26, 2009 at 12:51 pm

it’s not only his right, but his duty (to the constituents he represents) to make the changes he believes necessary to bills.

No he can’t. He can propose changes. He can put forth amendments. He can’t just redline what he doesn’t like.
Duros 62 says:

January 26, 2009 at 12:58 pm

I guess some people just need to learn the same lesson over and over and over before it sinks in. I’m sure you know the feeling, Jay Tea.

Will Rogers once said;

There are three kinds of men. The ones that learn from reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves.
C.S.Strowbridge says:

January 26, 2009 at 9:58 pm

OW: “For 8 years the right has said: The President is KING!*”

Dave in SoCal says: “If anyone actually said that, Oliver, you might have a point.”

You’re kidding, right? Clearly Oliver was paraphrasing, but the heart of the statement is solid.
Oliver Willis says:

January 26, 2009 at 10:28 pm

Perhaps you’ve heard of this guy named Dick Cheney?

“In short, Presidents exercised a broad range of foreign policy powers for which they neither sought nor received Congressional sanction through statute. This history speaks volumes about the Constitution’s allocation of powers between the branches. It leaves little, if any, doubt that the President was expected to have the primary role of conducting the foreign policy of the United States. Congressional actions to limit the President in this area therefore should be reviewed with a considerable degree of skepticism. If they interfere with core presidential foreign policy functions, they should be struck down. Moreover, the lesson of our constitutional history is that doubtful cases should be decided in favor of the President.”

Now,in practical application the President does tend to have more power than the other branches. But the actual law is pretty clear that the President, Speaker, and Chief Justice are equal.
Jay Tea says:

January 26, 2009 at 10:54 pm

Lemme annotate Oliver’s Cheney quote just a little:

In short, Presidents exercised a broad range of foreign policy powers for which they neither sought nor received Congressional sanction through statute.

…and this has to do with a bill on the domestic economy precisely how?

In fact, the Constitution specifically spells out certain details mandating Congress’ involvement in such things — such as how all tax bills have to originate in the House.

Thanks for the quote, Oliver. Pity it does more damage to your argument than to ours.

Oh, and I’m not quite sure where you get the idea that the Speaker is co-equal with the Chief Justice and the President. The Speaker governs only half of a branch. The Senate’s leadership is divided up between the Majority Leader, the Vice President, and (in a potential way only) the President Pro Tempore. The reason that the Speaker might even be considered on the same level is because it’s clear-cut in the unitary leadership, while the Senate’s is divided.

J.
- Oliver Willis says:
  
  January 26, 2009 at 11:09 pm
  
  And yet you understood exactly what the heck it was I was saying. The right believes the presidency to be imperial… unless the office is held by a Democrat. I concede the Prez comes out ahead of congress and supreme court, but the law says otherwise (and yes I neglected to include the Sen. Majority Leader, though that’s in part because Reid still acts like he’s a follower).
Jay Tea says:

January 27, 2009 at 4:01 am

You’re projecting again, Oliver. I’ve seen a lot of people disagreeing with Obama’s foreign policy, but very, very few questioning his authority to exercise it.

I see why you’re staying on the offensive so much, attacking whoever you can, whenever you can. It’s because you’re better at that than defending and promoting the Obama administration. Is it because you stink at it, or because so far Obama has done some really, really dumb things so far? How about a spirited defense of Eric Holder and Timothy Geithner?

Props for the dig at Biden, by the way. Every time that clown opens his mouth, I think back to the days of Dan Quayle and have the most delicious sense of schadenfreude.

Even Obama has to be regretting his choice. Did you see the video of the White House staff swearing-in? Jon Stewart was so right — now we know what Obama’s “shut the fuck up” face looks like.

But back to the topic at hand… I can’t believe you’re doubling down on this. First, you say that a senator should not try to influence pending legislation, and then you defend it by citing quotes regarding presidential power in foreign policy. That’s not just shifting the goalposts, that’s leaving the football stadium and slipping all over the ice on the hockey rink.

J.

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Oliver Willis

Like Kryptonite To Stupid

Somebody Tell John McCain He Lost The Election

38 Responses to “Somebody Tell John McCain He Lost The Election”

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