Yet you are such a fucking retard…

Shut the fuck up, you lying sack of shit.

You are a fucking whore…

Fuck you. You are a lying, fucking asshole.

How have you not killed yourself yet? You are obviously fucking stupid, and in your stupidity you should have done the world a favor and accidentally killed yourself.

No, you are a fucking liar.

I wouldn’t be angry if you weren’t such a fucking liar and a fucking moron.

…shoot your parents first…

You are far too stupid to live.

But wait! Not only are you a frustrated, angry little man who probably goes into a spittle-flying rage when the high school junior at McDonald’s forgets you ordered your #2 with no tomatoes, you also have the lovely inability to remember things you wrote earlier! The best example of this trait is this…

A little history lesson for you. Clinton tried to do more, but his efforts were blocked by the Republicans in congress. They wouldn’t authorize the war in Afghanistan. A war that could have stopped the attacks of 9/11.

I was living in Texas when the embassies were bombed and I was stationed in Boston when the Cole was attacked and I didn’t remember anything about Clinton seeking authorization for military intervention in Afghanistan. I forget things though (as evidenced by my total failure to remember Phil Hartman was Bill Clinton on SNL) so I went looking to see if I’d just not been paying attention. Couldn’t find anything about it. When I asked for the cite CSS was referring to… here’s the brilliantly self-unaware response…

Clinton never went to congress, because he knew he couldn’t get their support.

Now, I admit that I’m probably splitting hairs, but when you say “his efforts were blocked by Republicans in congress…” I take that to mean that he actually had a proposal drafted up, took it to Congress, and they simply wouldn’t authorize the use of the DoD funds for such an action. Not “he knew he wouldn’t get their support.”

Seriously CSS, it’s okay to admit when you make a mistake. Upthread I misunderstood something Jaim had written. He corrected me and I admitted I was wrong in what I’d written in response. The world didn’t end. Puppies weren’t torn asunder by hellbeasts. I didn’t awake in a world where Nazis traveled back in time to give the Confederacy MP44s. This is a heated discussion. Obviously we don’t agree on a lot of things. I freely admit that you’re fun to tweak by picking apart what you’re saying and applying it to things you didn’t think they’d be applied to. But really man, you might want to calm down. It is possible for someone to have an opinion on subjects, even important subjects like the election of a president or whether Jason Campbell will ever develop into a top-flight QB (he won’t, doesn’t make him a bad QB though), which is different from yours, and have that person not be a “fucking whore” or a “lying sack of shit”.

Learn to enjoy the sauce.

They did. Clinton is the one who made his post a cabinet level position, you fucking idiot.

Whole lot of good it did didn’t it?. Do we really need to rehash all of the Al Qaeda attacks against Americans at home and abroad during the Clinton Administration as he was supposed to be listening to the sage advice of Cabinet-Level-Position-Counter-Terrorism-Guru Richard Clarke? CSS, you have implied, again, and again that the Clinton Administration was obviously doing the right thing in fighting Al Qaeda with Richard Clarke as the go-to guy. Yet time and time again Al Qaeda was able to attack with catastrophic results and faced no concequences which it was not willing to accept and accept gladly (the destruction of closed training camps and the apprehension of a handful of their grunts).

If you don’t think that (not listening to Clarke) has an effect on their entire system…

Um, Clarke, Tenet, and the head of the Bin Laden section at the CIA met w/ Rice in May of 2001 to discuss what more could be done to take the fight to Bin Laden and Al Qaeda. They presented a plan to her, developed in DEC2000 after the Cole, which was going to take five years to fund and implement. In the short term though, Clarke wanted to resume the use of Predators in Afghanistan, however the CIA didn’t want to have the Predators flying in Afghanistan if they weren’t armed, and there were issues to work out regarding who would be responsible for using a Hellfire equipped Predator. There were also issues with the fact the Predator needed to be altered to carry the Hellfire, and the Hellfire itself needed to be changed because it was an anti-armor missile and wasn’t effective against light vehicles and people. This new Predator was supposed to be available at the beginning of September 2001. Unfortunatly the changes to the Hellfire were too extensive to be made and AF tests showed it to be unreliable in its new configuration and would require further development. Spring of 2002 would be when an armed Predator would be available.

Yup. Sounds an awful lot like they were ignoring the threat from Al Qaeda. What with trying to arm a drone. Sure would have been nice if the Clinton Administration had taken terrorism seriously and approved the development of an armed drone for use in surveillance and interdiction. Yes indeed.

…then you need to shoot yourself. You are far too stupid to live. In fact, shoot your parents first, they need to suffer for raising someone like you.

You stay classy CSS.

I wouldn’t be angry if you weren’t such a fucking liar and a fucking moron.

So perhaps you can do us both a favor and act smarter and more honest.

“So you’re now saying that the Bush Administration ordered its intelligence agencies to ignore Al Qaeda?”

God, it’s compulsive with you. You are such a fucking liar.

“And I come back to, as I have again and again, if Clarke was so very, very awesome and uber, why the hell didn’t Clinton’s Administration listen to him either?”

They did. Clinton is the one who made his post a cabinet level position, you fucking idiot.

“You’ve shown that he damaged the ego one one guy.”

More stupidity of the master.

They stopped listening to the head of counter-terrorism.

If you don’t think that has an effect on their entire system, then you need to shoot yourself. You are far too stupid to live.

In fact, shoot your parents first, they need to suffer for raising someone like you.

CIA agents who ignore orders of the people above them and go off on their own are called Rogue Agents, and that’s a bad thing.

So you’re now saying that the Bush Administration ordered its intelligence agencies to ignore Al Qaeda? You’d think that would have come out during that whole 9-11 investigation by Congress. Seems like a pretty big deal. And they all kept quiet regarding this huge breakdown in American intelligence gathering? We’ve had “whistleblowers” celebrated for outting intelligence programs which were legal, yet no one wrote to their congressman to point out that the Bush Administration had told them to cease operations tracking the terrorists who had tried to sink the Cole?

George W. Bush actively dismantled the counter terrorism leadership stripping Richard Clarke of his cabinet level position.

Are you Richard Clarke? Clarke had spent his entire career in the CIA being unable to get them to agree with him. If his own agency didn’t take his claims as being serious enough to warrant action, why should the White House. And I come back to, as I have again and again, if Clarke was so very, very awesome and uber, why the hell didn’t Clinton’s Administration listen to him either?

I’m not saying Bush was responsible because he was president when it happened. I’ve shown that his actions led to the attack being successful. That is why he is to blame. HIS FUCKING ACTIONS.

You’ve shown that he damaged the ego one one guy. You’re saying that by stripping Clarke of a seat at the big boy table, that made the FBI not follow-up on reports from their agents in Arizona? That made INS (ICE) approve a visa for Atta? That made the screeners @ Logan Airport allow the hijackers on the planes w/ their makeshift weapons? Wow. Bush really was the most powerful man in the world wasn’t he?

You’ve lied about what I’ve said numerous times, and I see you are doing the same with Jaim.

Iraq is now a pro-Iranian, Shia dominated puppet state.

You tell me where Jaim said he meant Iraq was an American puppet state. He tells me that’s what he meant. I took him at his word and apologized for misunderstanding. As far as me lying about what you’re saying. Dude, I’m quoting you directly. If you don’t like the fact that what you say is dumb and that I’m calling you on it, stop saying dumb things.

BTW, do you even read the articles you link to?

Yeah. Did you? Are you saying that The Times (London) and CBS are misrepresenting Obama when he said “But if we have so tightened the noose that he’s in a cave somewhere and can’t even communicate with his operatives then we will meet our goal of protecting America.”? It’s great that he says that capturing or killing Bin Laden is the top priority, but he’s giving a rather huge qualification with that statement.

How have you not killed yourself yet? You are obviously fucking stupid, and in your stupidity you should have done the world a favor and accidentally killed yourself.

CIA agents who ignore orders of the people above them and go off on their own are called Rogue Agents, and that’s a bad thing.

“At no point in here have I said that Bush was blameless for failing to prevent 9-11. However you continue to have this insane belief that, since it happened on Bush’s watch, he is the only person culpulble.”

You are a fucking liar. You seem incapable as saying the truth.

George W. Bush actively dismantled the counter terrorism leadership stripping Richard Clarke of his cabinet level position. Got it? I’m not saying Bush was responsible because he was president when it happened. I’ve shown that his actions led to the attack being successful. That is why he is to blame. HIS FUCKING ACTIONS.

“And you try to defend that by making up some fantasy world where the previous administration handed Bush a play-by-play instruction manual on how to go about defeating Al Qaeda. It never seems to cross your mind that, if that were true, why didn’t the Clinton administration do it themselves?”

They are called elections. Or do you think Bill Clinton should have told Bush, ‘Sorry, you can’t become president yet, we are still busy.’

“My bad, I misunderstood what you were saying.”

No, you are a fucking liar. You’ve lied about what I’ve said numerous times, and I see you are doing the same with Jaim.

So fuck off.

Also known as “perpetrators.”

Richard Clarke’s position as the head of counter terrorism was reduced. When the people at the top show no leadership, the work done by the people at the bottom doesn’t matter.

Man, it must be nice to be some sort of un-thinking automaton who relies entirely on inspiration from your appointed leaders CSS. Abdicating all responsibility for your own actions because “My leaders were uninspired!”. At no point in here have I said that Bush was blameless for failing to prevent 9-11. However you continue to have this insane belief that, since it happened on Bush’s watch, he is the only person culpulble. And you try to defend that by making up some fantasy world where the previous administration handed Bush a play-by-play instruction manual on how to go about defeating Al Qaeda. It never seems to cross your mind that, if that were true, why didn’t the Clinton administration do it themselves? They had the people to do it. You’ve pointed that out. They had the time. They just didn’t…. because…?

That’s not what I wrote. I said Iraq is an American puppet state, and one that is pro-Iranian.

My bad, I misunderstood what you were saying. But, you’re saying that Iraq’s government is pro-Iranian is that the leaders of Iraq and Iran don’t hate each other and that they’ve visited each other’s nation? They’re neighboring countries. While I’m sure some folks would prefer that they were belligerent towards each other, threatening horrible death and all that, honestly, given the history of the region, if they spend a few years making nice towards each it might turn out better for everyone.

massive pro-Hezbollah marches took place in Baghdad.

Massive pro-Hezzbollah marches and demonstrations have taken place across Europe and here in the US as well. Do you prefer that the police go in and crush such demonstrations under their thuggish jackboots?

Israel is obviously in no better a position than it was in 2000 (no closer to a real peace deal, more hated by the world than ever before).

Israel is going to be “hated by the world” no matter what they do. They’ve accepted that fact, I don’t see why you can’t.

Oh, and did I mention North Korea? They now claim to have weaponized plutonium.

Well then, thank our lucky stars that President Obama will be able to step in and solve that nasty problem north of the 38th Parallel. Now that America has been returned to the hands of right thinking people and we’re now going to be admired and respected around the world, I’m sure the UN will be stepping up as will China to exert pressure on North Korea to stop producing weaponized plutonium.

because why whould terrorists go through the trouble of coming all the way to America when they can fight and kill American soldiers much closer to home?

Speaking as an American Soldier who has non-Soldier Americans for family, that’s a feature, not a bug. Because, quite honestly, we’re a lot better at killing them then they are at killing us. A lot better.

Reality
“Obama said that al-Qaeda and Osama bin Laden remain the “number one threat” to U.S. security, after the elusive militant leader warned of new fronts in his war on the West.”

“Bin Laden and al-Qaeda are our number one threat when it comes to American security,” Obama told reporters after the emergence of the 22-minute audio recording entitled “A call for jihad to stop aggression against Gaza.”

http://www.alarabiya.net/articles/2009/01/15/64255.html

BTW, do you even read the articles you link to?

“Iraqis themselves tend to identify more as Iraqis first, Arabs second, whatever their sect is third.”

Right — Shia and Sunni Iraqis get along just fine. They throw rose petals at one another and dance hand in hand!

Please do yourself and read a few books about the region before you continue to spout such idiotic statements.

That’s not what I wrote. I said Iraq is an American puppet state, and one that is pro-Iranian. It’s population is majority Shia, al-Maliki has been warmly welcomed in Tehran and hugged Ahmadenihjad a few times (sorry, again, for my spelling), and during the 2006 Israeli bombing of Lebanon, massive pro-Hezbollah marches took place in Baghdad.

I agree with you that AQ remains dangerous. But they’re only one part of the puzzle. The Taliban have reformed in Afghanistan. Iran is in a very strong position right now with a new friendly neighbor in the form of a US funded, Shia-led Iraq (although falling gasoline prices are hurting them). Israel is obviously in no better a position than it was in 2000 (no closer to a real peace deal, more hated by the world than ever before).

Oh, and did I mention North Korea? They now claim to have weaponized plutonium.

Heck of a job, Bushie.

And again, the “9/11 only happened once” argument is lame, because why whould terrorists go through the trouble of coming all the way to America when they can fight and kill American soldiers much closer to home?

You miss a lot when you have your head up your ass.

Richard Clarke’s position as the head of counter terrorism was reduced. When the people at the top show no leadership, the work done by the people at the bottom doesn’t matter.

“CSS, seriously, you, yourself, said that Clinton didn’t make fighting terrorism his top priority, and were fine with that because it wasn’t obvious at the time what the threat it represented was. Bush does the exact same thing…

So you get paid per lie you tell here?

Richard Clarke’s position as the head of counter terrorism was reduced, so obivously Bush didn’t do the exact same thing.

And on that note, fuck you, you lying sack of shit.

I don’t give a fuck what you have to say on this matter, because you have no credibility.

So, when Bush took office the CIA, NSA, and DIA all went and said “Okay, we’ll cease operations in the Middle East and focus on something else.” I must have missed that memo. CSS, seriously, you, yourself, said that Clinton didn’t make fighting terrorism his top priority, and were fine with that because it wasn’t obvious at the time what the threat it represented was. Bush does the exact same thing and it is a prima facie evidence he made it a “ZOMG!!11!! ZERO!111!!” priority. Drama queen much CSS?

“Sure you want to go there? Of course you do, because you are fucking Republican ‘tard who doesn’t know any better.”

Way to ignore the sentence before that were I pointed out Number Three was his oppression of his own people. And, I guess it’s alright that he killed 2,500-5,000 of his own people with a chemical attack because it happened a long time before. I guess the Iraqi people didn’t agree with you since Saddam was hung for one of the massacres of his people he committed.

“Milosevic was committing genocide WHILE CLINTON WAS TRYING TO GET SUPPORT TO INVADE.”

Saddam was killing his own people by diverting money meant to aid them during the embargo to enrich himself and his supporters. I don’t see a huge difference between Milosevic killing his opposition directly and Saddam starving them indirectly. But then again I don’t like seeing any government kill it’s own people as a blanket policy.

“Did I say it we shouldn’t have used military force in Rwanda?”

No, you didn’t. You said that if a people are being exterminated then that’s justification for a military intervention. The Hutus in Rwanda were making the Serbs look like pikers. Instead of going in w/ the 82nd Airborne, Clinton issued stern speeches. Hell, did he even do that? It’s not like the former Yugoslavia had any strategic interest to the US. It didn’t attack anyone who we’d need to defend as a member of NATO. We went in there on our own. Clinton could have, and probably should have, done the same thing for Rwanda. But, I suppose that suffering Africans just weren’t as important to St. Bill.

“This strategy was voiced by Bin Laden, and it was the strategy used by him to defeat Russia.”

Uh, you’re very ignorant of history. Bin Laden was a nobody in the USSR-Afghan fight. He was just another Abdul on the street. He had about as much say in the strategy of the mujadaheen as I do in the War on Terror. The fact he’s progressed to where he was, doesn’t change the fact he was just another face in the crowd in the 80s.

“Fully regained strength. So says America’s intelligence committee.”

That would have been the NIE from back in the beginning of 2007. There have been a couple of changes to facts-on-the-ground since then.

“But if we have so tightened the noose that he’s (bin laden) in a cave somewhere and can’t even communicate with his operatives then we will meet our goal of protecting America.”

It was on CBS as well. Not that hard to find man.

AQ remains dangerous, but only the most hopeful anti-Bush partisan would think they are anywhere near as strong or as relevant as they were on 10SEP2001.

Aside from your assertation, is there any actual proof that Iraq is Iran’s puppet state? Or is even trending towards it? A sizable portion of Iraq’s government are factions which are not friendly towards the Iranian gov’t. Iraqis themselves tend to identify more as Iraqis first, Arabs second, whatever their sect is third. Of course the exceptions to this are the folks who get all the press, so I suppose it can be forgiven if you’re ignorant of that. Afghanistan is a fight which it will be up to Obama to win. Whether he has the backbone to follow through on it to the best plausible outcome is up to him. Pakistan will be far more likely to fall into the hands of a government hostile to the US if Obama follows through on his campaign rhetoric of invading Pakistan unilaterally. So, again, what Pakistan does is Obama’s responsibility now.

The world has always been a dangerous place, and it likely always will be. Just because you were too ignorant to realize it before doesn’t change the fact it was.

SFC B: “That is every bit the ex post facto justification that ‘We went into Iraq for more than WMD’ is. And you know it.”

You are a lying sack of shit, and you know it.

This strategy was voiced by Bin Laden, and it was the strategy used by him to defeat Russia.

“Al Qaeda has seen itself go from being able to strike world-wide at prime targets to…”

Fully regained strength. So says America’s intelligence committee.

Or this that part of some devious plot to confuse us as well?

Source? Because I’m pretty sure that’s bullshit.

3,000 Americans died on 9/11. Over 4,000 more have been killed in a useless war in Iraq since then. AQ remains strong, as do other terrorist organizations. Iraq is now a pro-Iranian, Shia dominated puppet state. Al-Maliki is _personal friends_ with Ahdemenijad (I know that’s spelled wrong). Osama bin Laden has not been captured. Afghanistan is another failed country. Pakistan is in danger of being taken over by Muslim hard-liners who will have nukes. The Israel/Palestine issue is more violent and dangerous than ever.

The world is a much more dangerous place now thanks to George W. Bush and the Republican party. Thankfully, adults are now back in charge.

That is every bit the ex post facto justification that “We went into Iraq for more than WMD” is. And you know it. Al Qaeda has seen itself go from being able to strike world-wide at prime targets to not being able to strike at targets in their own backyard without fear of being turned in by their neighbors. OBL has gone from being the most visible face on Al Jazeera to being a Weekend at Bernie’s gag. The Who’s Who of the Al Qaeda member’s directory in 1999 is now a list of KIA, Captured, or So Deeply Hidden as to Basically be Dead. Even Obama is saying that Bin Laden is no longer a threat to America worth making the top priority.

Much better. Were you lying or just misinformed before?