Joe Biden, 2008
“Catholic social doctrine as I was taught it is, you take care of people who need the help the most,” he said. “Now it’d be different if you could make the case to me that by giving this tax cut to the very wealthy, everybody else was going to be better off. We saw what happened the last eight years when we gave that tax cut.”
He then explained his statement, first made at a rally in Sarasota, FL, two weeks ago, that asking the wealthiest Americans to accept tax hikes would be patriotic. And he added that the tax rates would still be lower than they were under the Reagan administration.
“I tell you, Democrats,” Biden said, gritting his teeth. “Don’t you step down from anybody telling you that we don’t value, we don’t have American values. … I want this debate about values! I want this debate about American values.”
Franklin Delano Roosevelt, 1936
The easiest way to summarize the reason for this extension of Government functions, local, State and national, is to use the words of Abraham Lincoln: “The legitimate object of Government is to do for the people what needs to be done but which they cannot by individual effort do at all, or do so well, for themselves.”
Taxes are the price we all pay collectively to get those things done.
To divide fairly among the people the obligation to pay for these benefits has been a major part of our struggle to maintain democracy in America.
Ever since 1776 that struggle has been between two forces. On the one hand, there has been the vast majority of our citizens who believed that the benefits of democracy should be extended and who were willing to pay their fair share to extend them. On the other hand, there has been a small, but powerful group which has fought the extension of those benefits, because it did not want to pay a fair share of their cost.
That was the line-up in 1776. That is the line-up in this campaign. And I am confident that once more—in 1936—democracy in taxation will win.
Here is my principle: Taxes shall be levied according to ability to pay. That is the only American principle.
Before this great war against the depression we fought the World War; and it cost us twenty-five billion dollars in three years to win it. We borrowed to fight that war. Then, as now, a Democratic Administration provided sufficient taxes to pay off the entire war debt within ten or fifteen years.
Those taxes had been levied according to ability to pay. But the succeeding Republican Administration did not believe in that principle. There was a reason. They had political debts to those who sat at their elbows. To pay those political debts, they reduced the taxes of their friends in the higher brackets and left the national debt to be paid by later generations. Because they evaded their obligation, because they regarded the political debt as more important than the national debt, the depression in 1929 started with a sixteen-billion-dollar handicap on us and our children.
Now let’s keep this little drama straight. The actors are the same. But the act is different. Today their role calls for stage tears about the next generation. But in the days after the World War they played a different part.
The moral of the play is clear. They got out from under then, they would get out from under now—if their friends could get back into power and they could get back to the driver’s seat. But neither you nor I think that they are going to get back.
As in the World War, we have again created a tax structure to yield revenues adequate to pay the cost of this war against depression in this generation and not in the next.
***
A number of my friends who belong in these very high upper brackets have suggested to me, more in sorrow than in anger, that if I am reelected they will have to move to some other Nation because of high taxes here. I shall miss them very much but if they go they will soon come back. For a year or two of paying taxes in almost any other country in the world will make them yearn once more for the good old taxes of the U.S.A.
***
Once more this year we must choose between democracy in taxation and special privilege in taxation. Are you willing to turn the control of the Nation’s taxes back to special privilege? I know the American answer to that question. Your pay envelope may be loaded with suggestions of fear, and your dividend letter may be filled with propaganda. But the American people will be neither bluffed nor bludgeoned.
The seeds of fear cannot bear fruit in the polling booth.
Inside the polling booth every American man and woman stands as the equal of every other American man and woman. There they have no superiors. There they have no masters save their own minds and consciences. There they are sovereign American citizens. There on November 3d they will not fear to exercise that sovereignty.
Tale as old as time. Song as old as rhyme. Beauty and the Beast.
Throw in a McCain/Herbert Hoover parallel (”The fundamentals of our economy are strong,” “Light at the end of the tunnel”), and by george, yer onto something.
I had no idea the Republican strategy was that old and unchanged. I thought the level of hypocrisy was fairly recent.
Good to know. Thanks for that Ollie.
Or to put it another way…
“we can only spend tax money on killing arabs and deporting Mexicans. Roads are gay”-repubs
jr, I hope you’re archiving these, ‘cuz you got yourself a book, there, son.
I had no idea the Republican strategy was that old and unchanged. I thought the level of hypocrisy was fairly recent.
If you want a perfect example of hypocrisy, you need look no further than Smokin’ Joe’s charitable contributions. It is simply appalling this man could be so tight-fisted and then lecture Republicans about morality insofar as the taxes they pay. How he can talk about Catholic social doctrine after paying less than 1/2 of one percent of his AGI on average over the last ten years is mind-boggling if one didn’t know what a committed gas-bag the man has always been.
Y’know, Dennis, every time I read one of your posts, all that I get is blah blah blah.
Blah blah blah, blah blah Joe Biden sux, blah blah.
You guys got nothing and you know it.
It is simply appalling this man could be so tight-fisted and then lecture Republicans….blah blah blah
Come on. If there was an R next to his name, you’d be one of the first to say “Good on ‘im.” Anything illegal or unethical? No? Then STFU.
“The seeds of fear cannot bear fruit in the polling booth.”
This should probably be amended with “…for very long” at the end to match the past six years.
How he can talk about Catholic social doctrine after paying less than 1/2 of one percent of his AGI on average over the last ten years is mind-boggling
And yet, the numbers bear out Sen. Biden’s position. Those in the lowest economic class in those countries where taxation levels are progressively steeper than that of the United States are better off by almost every measure with which I’m familiar.
Biden’s own charitable giving strikes me as a bit of a silly red herring. It’s a positive if one gives; it’s not a negative if one doesn’t. It sort of undermines the idea of charity if you’re going to chastize somebody for not ponying up (and no, there is no correlation between that and the campaign’s proposed programs – those are not charity).
Come on. If there was an R next to his name, you’d be one of the first to say “Good on ‘im.” Anything illegal or unethical? No? Then STFU.
I’ve always sorta liked the guy, but no Duros, as a Catholic, even with an R by his name I would be embarrassed for him to make what he makes, to live where he lives, and to wear the clothes that he wears, to have only given one year $120 to charity. He could’ve donated just 3 of his old Hermes ties and gotten that deduction. Every job I’ve worked at put more than a cursory amount of pressure to give our ‘fair share’ to the United Way. It’s simply baffling.
Yes, it is unethical, morally at least, to be so cheap. Especially when he lecture people about paying what he thinks should be their fair share of taxes.
Dennis, from your own cite:
And this:
Maybe you should go back to making stuff up. At least that way we can’t fact check you.
Shorter Dennis: What Oliver brought up doesn’t matter because Biden doesn’t give much money to charity! Also, I’m an idiot!
This is timely Oliver. I have been saying for a while that the way some of our politicians throw the words Patriotism and Family Values around those words could actually pass as hammer instruments that they use against their own fellow citizens.
As for taxes Biden is right, pretty much all developed nations have them. The only one that doesn’t I am told requires a dress code and is the United Arab Emirates.
One of the things that is being lost is this is the following:
When the undeserving rich such as myself finally get enough dough to pay down the student loans that got me to this point, I will make sure that my wage based income caps at 249,999.99 exactly. Don’t think this can happen ? Think back to what happened when Carter was president, this is exactly what happened. When the taxation rate on the last amount of income that people made got over about 50%, it caused changes in behavior that led to less government revenue.
Oh well, I’ll enjoy the extra off time.
Biden is one of the poorest senators in Congress. He doesn’t own seven-plus mansions like McCain, he didn’t marry into his wealth, and he lives more like a regular American than most ultra-wealthy politicians.
Hell, why doesn’t Cindy McCain donate her nomination address to charity? It’s worth more than most Americans’ houses.
For a man to serve 36 years in Congress and not be a multimillionaire speaks volume about his character. Biden’s no dumbass. If he wanted to get rich from government corruption, could have done so.
Amazingly enough, some people want to be in government because they want to SERVE, not feed at the public trough. Hard as that may be for Republicans to grasp, it’s true.
I regret that I have to give but one dollar for my country…
And sorry Parthenon, but I have a hard time believing that the poor in other countries are so much better off. Go to an average “poor” American household and you’ll see 2 cars, a nice sized tv with a wii, a cell phone or 2, a pc with Internet … Most of the world would consider that firmly middle class.
You want this debate to be about taxes, Parth, Dennis et al?
When is someone in the Obama camp going pound on the fact that John McCain is going to raise my taxes? McCain’s healthcare plan calls for taxing employer contributions to health insurance. That’s a direct hit at my income. Not to mention the fact that, in order to avoid said taxes more and more people will opt out of employer-based insurance, raising the costs for those left in the pool. Eventually the employer-based system will collapse, and folks like us, with kids who have pre-existing conditions, will be up a shit’s creek.
Obama will cut taxes for 95% of American workers.
McCain will raise taxes on everyone who has employer-based health insurance.
Bring. It. On.
*sigh* even with preview, I teh suck.
That was supposed to be Farris, Dennis, et al. Sorry, Parthenon.
A Biden spokesman said the couple has given more to charity than they claimed on their taxes.
Doesn’t make sense, not when you have an abysmally small number like that that sticks out like a sore thumb, especially to a politician. What’s the point of not declaring it, to let the government have the money? WHy not report the deduction and then use the tax savings to make another donation, or simply pay more in taxes than you are required, a novel idea for a Democrat politician who says taxes are too low?
Biden’s financial disclosure returns also show donations of speaking fees to charity that aren’t reported on the tax returns.
Maybe. Still sounds a bit suspect given the glaringly low number on his charitable deduction line. Again, omitting this perfectly allowable deduction shows shows a lack of understanding about taxes or a stupid oversight for a guy who likes to make himself like a regular working man who just happens to dress very well. If he’s that cavalier about his tax return I don’t want him anywhere near the White House.
Go to an average “poor” American household and you’ll see 2 cars, a nice sized tv with a wii, a cell phone or 2, a pc with Internet … Most of the world would consider that firmly middle class.
12 years ago, they were.
Putting aside that you have no idea what an average poor American household is like. Scare quotes or otherwise.
Yeah Dennis, good call. Of all the things to latch onto in this election cycle, let’s focus on Biden and his “cavalier” way of going about his tax return. That should be the focal point in this election. Good call. ‘Cause that matters. A lot. No, I’m totally serious. You’re fucking brilliant. You should print up bumper stickers or something. Maybe take out an ad in the local newspaper.
You’re a fucking idiot.
[threadjack]Just be thankful FDR is dead. Were he not Biden would probably ask him to stand up so everyone could see him.[/threadjack]
Go, Joe, Go! Take back Christianity from the hate-filled Religious Right.
In my job, I go into rich people’s homes, middle class people’s homes, and poor peoples’s homes.
Yes, in poor people’s homes, you can find color tv’s, which they are often buying at “rent-to-own” stores and paying through the nose for. Sometimes a PSP they bought at a pawn shop. They have these things because they want their kids to have the things other kids have, they work, and deserve them.
They also, quite often, have termites they can’t afford to treat, roof leaks they can’t afford to fix, and power bills they can’t afford to pay. They have unbelieveable levels of stress, and no health care.
The next time a conservative tells me how relatively well off the American poor are, my head will explode. Conservatives are ignorant, unfeeling, smug-ass bullies.
[...] Oliver Willis brings us a stirring speech from FDR in defense of progressive taxation: Here is my principle: Taxes shall be levied according to ability to pay. That is the only American principle. [...]
[...] my favorite was when Oliver Willis (Occupation: Toole) even went and excerpted a 1936 Franklin Delano Roosevelt speech on how fair he thought the [...]
Uh, Dennis? That would be exactly the effect of leaving the donation off his tax return.
What? The “charitable deduction line” only became public because Biden released his tax returns when he was selected to run for Vice President.
Why didn’t Biden know, many years ago, that someday he’d be releasing his tax returns?? Then you could call him “calculating”!
Please, please, tie Obama and Biden to FDR some more.
We can then remind folks about how Roosevelt extended the Great Depression by at least five years with his overtaxing of the American public to build legacy projects. How he arrested and interned tens of thousands of American citizens on a whim of evidence. How he nearly causes a Constitutional Crisis by attempting to stack the SCOTUS with judges that would agree with his blatantly socialistic programs. How he used his Fireside Chat radio programs to attack and belittle individual American citizens when they publicly disagreed with him. The man who, had he lived, was so power hungry that he would have run for a fourth term in office. Who repeatedly lied to the American public about the state of his health and who used their tax dollars to hide these facts.
Not only will Obama lose the election if the comparison is made, we may actually get a chance to finally put the dirt of his shameful presidency where it belongs and knock FDR down a notch in the public mind.
If paying taxes is so patriotic, why don’t Obama and Biden have a plane to make everyone pay 50% taxes so we can all be hyper-patriotic?
If paying taxes is so patriotic, why don’t liberals volunteer to pay the maximum amount, or even extra taxes, so that they can publicly show their super-patriotism?
You all aren’t all broke. I live and work in hyper-liberal Seattle and see Obama stickers on Beemers and Audis and MB’s all day long. I see Obama yard signs in front of epic sized homes worth, even now, seven figures. Why can’t liberals be more patriotic and just write a check for whatever they have left in their bank account at the end of the month? Why do they not volunteer their excess wealth and instead demand that the government pass a law to force me to do so?
[...] conservative blogger is attacking me for connecting FDR to Obama/Biden. He thinks that this is a bad thing. FDR is considered one of America’s [...]
And sorry Parthenon, but I have a hard time believing that the poor in other countries are so much better off.
Zoinks, go to work and get called out on one’s unsupported statement while one is gone.
Farris, of course it depends on the country. Bruce beat me to most of this point, but his anecodotal evidence more or less correlates with that with which I’m familiar. It’s probably true that the poorest American is materially better off than the average human being on planet earth in 2008 (mostly because of the high population concentration in former colonies), but is “better off than the average human” really good enough when one lives in the world’s richest country?
Really the comparison I was making was the industrialized, liberal republics like Northern and Western Europe, Japan, etc.