Hey, me too! Often times though, political leaders of any stripe that do this, will be attacked for being a flip-flopper. We need to be careful how we allow other organizations to discourage actual change from taking place.

There is definitely flip-flopping for political reasons which of course is closely linked to insincerity and corruption for votes.

(And linked to the propaganda behind statements like:
And, Southern Quaker he wants us to be in Iraq for 100 more years.)

Argue with the guy on the issues, there are a million ways in which he is not the leader we need. Discuss why his Iraq policy was wrong and is wrong. Don’t go with shallow misrepresentations that “he wants us to be in Iraq for 100 more years.” That paints you as an unenlightened propagandist, hardly someone I would consider progressive, or liberal.

“As far as I can tell, they — almost to a one — all came out in favor of the war, then shut up to see which way the wind was blowing, then started talking as if they were never for it in the first place.”

Yes. It’s called admitting you made a mistake. I know eight years of the most stubborn, arrogant prick ever to hold the office has made a lot of people forget that notion ever existed, but it did, and it might just be making a comeback.

You mean specifics like this? Or like this? Or like this?

Tom, your reading comprehension skills are poor. I didn’t ask for examples of what Obama says he’s going to do when he gets in office, I asked what has he actually done to demonstrate that he is a man who has worked for and acheived change?

Dave – your reading skills have just been shown to be poorer than those you claim I have. I was not responding to your request. I was responding to Jay’s assertion that specifics to Obamoids are like garlic to vampires.

Funny – you don’t seemed to have noticed that in your hurry to insult your fellow commenters here…

As far as I can tell, they — almost to a one — all came out in favor of the war, then shut up to see which way the wind was blowing, then started talking as if they were never for it in the first place.

I find myself wondering that, had Obama been in the Senate at the time, he would have voted “present” for this one.

J.

It’s all there, Dave.

Oh and BTW, you might wanna google Nimnrod. It don’t mean what you thnk it does.

I like clarifying that because it makes it even worse.

They have also, by and large, admitted it was a mistake, and in some instances even apologized.

Your guy? The cheerleader, commander-guy? Not so much.

So, as I recall, did Joe Biden. Biden, who in 2002, said of Saddam “He’s a long term threat and a short term threat to our national security… “We have no choice but to eliminate the threat. This is a guy who is an extreme danger to the world.”

Just once, I’d dearly love to hear one of the 81 Democratic Representatives and 29 Democratic Senators who voted in favor of the war to explain just when they changed their minds, and what was involved in that decision… Biden? Clinton? Dodd? Edwards? Feinstein? Harkin? Kerry? Reid? Schumer? Anyone/ Bueller? Bueller?

Boy, it’s a good thing that warmongering fascist Biden isn’t on the ticket, isn’t it?

J.

I’ve listed specific examples and provided links. Scroll up.

Peace.
Obama/Biden ‘08

No, Nimrod, they didn’t. Everyone likes to think they did, though.

Here is Obama’s bio, directly from his website:

Barack Obama was raised by a single mother and his grandparents. They didn’t have much money, but they taught him values from the Kansas heartland where they grew up. He took out loans to put himself through school. After college, he worked for Christian churches in Chicago, helping communities devastated when steel plants closed. Obama turned down lucrative job offers after law school to return to Chicago, leading a successful voter registration drive. He joined a small law firm, taught constitutional law and, guided by his Christian faith, stayed active in his community. Obama and his wife Michelle are proud parents of two daughters, Sasha and Malia.

Early Years

Barack Obama was born in Hawaii on August 4th, 1961. His father, Barack Obama Sr., was born and raised in a small village in Kenya, where he grew up herding goats with his own father, who was a domestic servant to the British.

Barack’s mother, Ann Dunham, grew up in small-town Kansas. Her father worked on oil rigs during the Depression, and then signed up for World War II after Pearl Harbor, where he marched across Europe in Patton’s army. Her mother went to work on a bomber assembly line, and after the war, they studied on the G.I. Bill, bought a house through the Federal Housing Program, and moved west to Hawaii.

It was there, at the University of Hawaii, where Barack’s parents met. His mother was a student there, and his father had won a scholarship that allowed him to leave Kenya and pursue his dreams in America.

Barack’s father eventually returned to Kenya, and Barack grew up with his mother in Hawaii, and for a few years in Indonesia. Later, he moved to New York, where he graduated from Columbia University in 1983.

The College Years

Remembering the values of empathy and service that his mother taught him, Barack put law school and corporate life on hold after college and moved to Chicago in 1985, where he became a community organizer with a church-based group seeking to improve living conditions in poor neighborhoods plagued with crime and high unemployment.

The group had some success, but Barack had come to realize that in order to truly improve the lives of people in that community and other communities, it would take not just a change at the local level, but a change in our laws and in our politics.

He went on to earn his law degree from Harvard in 1991, where he became the first African-American president of the Harvard Law Review. Soon after, he returned to Chicago to practice as a civil rights lawyer and teach constitutional law. Finally, his advocacy work led him to run for the Illinois State Senate, where he served for eight years. In 2004, he became the third African American since Reconstruction to be elected to the U.S. Senate.

Political Career

It has been the rich and varied experiences of Barack Obama’s life – growing up in different places with people who had differing ideas – that have animated his political journey. Amid the partisanship and bickering of today’s public debate, he still believes in the ability to unite people around a politics of purpose – a politics that puts solving the challenges of everyday Americans ahead of partisan calculation and political gain.

In the Illinois State Senate, this meant working with both Democrats and Republicans to help working families get ahead by creating programs like the state Earned Income Tax Credit, which in three years provided over $100 million in tax cuts to families across the state. He also pushed through an expansion of early childhood education, and after a number of inmates on death row were found innocent, Senator Obama worked with law enforcement officials to require the videotaping of interrogations and confessions in all capital cases.

In the U.S. Senate, he has focused on tackling the challenges of a globalized, 21st century world with fresh thinking and a politics that no longer settles for the lowest common denominator. His first law was passed with Republican Tom Coburn, a measure to rebuild trust in government by allowing every American to go online and see how and where every dime of their tax dollars is spent. He has also been the lead voice in championing ethics reform that would root out Jack Abramoff-style corruption in Congress.

As a member of the Veterans’ Affairs Committee, Senator Obama has fought to help Illinois veterans get the disability pay they were promised, while working to prepare the VA for the return of the thousands of veterans who will need care after Iraq and Afghanistan. Recognizing the terrorist threat posed by weapons of mass destruction, he traveled to Russia with Republican Dick Lugar to begin a new generation of non-proliferation efforts designed to find and secure deadly weapons around the world. And knowing the threat we face to our economy and our security from America’s addiction to oil, he’s working to bring auto companies, unions, farmers, businesses and politicians of both parties together to promote the greater use of alternative fuels and higher fuel standards in our cars.

Whether it’s the poverty exposed by Katrina, the genocide in Darfur, or the role of faith in our politics, Barack Obama continues to speak out on the issues that will define America in the 21st century. But above all his accomplishments and experiences, he is most proud and grateful for his family. His wife, Michelle, and his two daughters, Malia, 10, and Sasha, 7, live on Chicago’s South Side.

Please point out the examples of actual change that were pushed through and achieved by Obama.

There’s a lot of “Working with…” and “Speaking out…”, but no actual change that I can see.

So after saying that I’m “one of those people who needs to walk around with a disclaimer”, I point out the irony, what with your name being Nimrod (’slang: idiot, jerk’ is the definition I was using) and all, you whine that I’m resorting to insults.

Jeez, don’t get your knickers in a wad, Nimrod.

Have you ever heard of the Declaration of Independence? I suppose not. It begins by stating the most basic and fundamental of all human rights: the right to “dissociate themselves from the bonds that have connected them to others.” If you don’t support the right to self-determination then you aren’t American.

But it doesn’t matter. Your union is ancient history at this point. It’s falling apart as we speak. Doesn’t matter what you say or do, your time is past.

Oliver, this video strikes me as being a classic example of corporate propaganda. It uses meaningless phrases like “hope” and “change” to distract attention from the reality of Democratic and Republican evil. I found it very offensive. Just MHO of course.

Heh. I notice that no one has managed to provide an example of actual Obama change. Other than Southern Quaker’s lame “entire life of public service” claim.

Pretty telling.