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You see kids, the real issue here is not that McCain is an out of touch old warmonger, no, the crime is that Sen. Obama is stepping on the American dream of owning so many houses you forget how many you own.
Beam me up, Scotty, there’s no intelligent life here.
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In 2004 Kerry was an elitist because his wife was rich and they owned multiple homes.
Four years later, having a rich wives and multiple homes is the very embodiment of the American Dream.
It’s really quite amazing how they work this kind of thing.
I really have to wonder, when I see these kinds of reversals, if the folks spouting them actually believe what they say each time or are actually aware of what they are doing.
Is it a breathtaking level of willful self deception, or a deep-seated cynicism and win-at-all-costs attitude?
Either way, not something to be proud of.
What you leftists continue to miss is that elitism is not based on how much money you have. It’s based on how you treat the people around you who don’t have as much.
Obama thinks people not like him cling to guns and religion. He thinks they have never learned a foreign language. He believes he will make the oceans subside. He worries about arugula. It goes on and on. That is the behavior of an elitist.
McCain doesn’t keep track of how many properties are in his wife’s portfolio and owned by his wife’s trust funds because he doesn’t care about the accumulation.
I guess this is politics in action. Both candidates can be fairly termed ‘elite’ compared to the average person both in terms of power and money. So this argument is all about the perception of who is more elite. IMO – Obama has given McCain somewhat more material to work with here than McCain has given in return. I imagine this opinion may change based on the political direction you lean.
Oliver’s latest “McCain is not like us” seems like awfully thin spin though. Which of those charges you level against McCain could not be easily used against Obama?
Leftists don’t care about the poor?
Thank you for the laugh! I needed that.
Yeah, god knows that spending a quarter of a million dollars a year on Servants, Wearing 500 dollar Italian Loafers, owning so many homes you can’t even remember the exact number, and abandoning the wife who stood by you through years of captivity is nothing compared to an offhand remark about a salad green found at McDonalds and having taught at a college! Surely, thats a matter of opinion!
Can you seriously say that any of the things I just said about McCain can be said about Obama? Are you that insane with partisanship?
For the umpteenth time, it was McCain who brought the issue of wealth up in the first place via his stooges — Rove and the idiotic “country club” comment, press releases about the arugula, etc.
Obama is simply fighting back, and very well. He has every right to.
McCain is an uber-wealthy elitist who can’t even keep track of his mansions. Obama and his wife have done pretty well for themselves, but they’ve never accused McCain of being an elitist until now. And in terms of raw wealth, they aren’t in McCain’s ballpark. Not by a long-shot.
But I enjoy seeing your tears of frustration JWG. They taste sweet and delicious!
Obama thinks people not like him cling to guns and religion.
you mean the members of the religious right that are fighting to make sodomy punishable by death? Nope, not clinging to guns and religion at all.
He thinks they have never learned a foreign language.
With the way our public school systems are, chances aren’t too high. Besides, the U.S. is the ONLY 1st world country without a mandatory 2nd language program.
This explains it better than I ever could. But like the last time I brought this up, the ultra con trolls just ran with their tail between their legs. I guess it would only be sporting to give you a head start.
McCain provided jobs for many people, and you think that is a bad thing. Typical leftist — only the government can do that!
Considering many of my students who are receiving free/reduced meals at school also wear $150 sneakers, I don’t think McCain’s shoes tell us very much.
Why should he keep track of homes in his wife’s investment portfolios?
While certainly a moral failing 30 years ago, this is hardly elitist. I’m fairly certain that many men in every financial range have abandoned their faithful wives. Maybe I’m wrong about this, but I think I’ve seen some daytime shows demonstrate this up a time or two.
>Can you seriously say that any of the things I just said about McCain can be said about Obama? Are you that insane with partisanship?
Soullite, of those things you mention, (with the exception of the reference to his wife which I’m not quite sure how that fits into the elitist narrative) if they are all true, they indicate that McCain is.. rich! Which we knew. We also know that Obama is rich. Do you really think Obama knows what its like to be be non-rich any better than McCain does?
Over half of HS graduates take a foreign language. But thanks for playing.
http://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d07/tables/dt07_144.asp
More leftist views — the government must force people to do something some might not do on their own.
More leftist views — the government must force people to do something some might not do on their own.
Japan’s a leftist country? I know the name “LDP” is confusing, but they’re actually a right-wing party. Nice try.
Poor JWG, why do you hate America so much?
McCain is a rich guy who is against policies that would give people a way up to his level of success.
Barack Obama is a recently successful guy who supports policies that would give a path to success.
Why can’t you guys get that? We don’t resent McCain because he’s rich, we resent him because he’s rich and he wants to erect a wall between the rest of us and wealth.
So then there’s not already a “wall” then?
BTW, I’d have more wealth if the government wouldn’t take so much of my earned income away from me.
So then there’s not already a “wall” then?
Let me revise my remarks – McCain is adding another layer of brick to the wall.
I’d have more wealth if the government wouldn’t take so much of my earned income away from me.
Yeah, well, we’re trying to run a modern society here.
If you want to use the collectivist culture of Japan as an example to compare to the individualist culture of America, go right ahead. It certainly supports my argument that you leftists think the individual should be subservient to the state. Whatever would I do if the government didn’t tell me how to live my life?
Knowing you, you’d be dead within a week.
McCain provided jobs for many people, and you think that is a bad thing. Typical leftist — only the government can do that!
I’m beginning to suspect that JWG is a parody troll. Right down to the use of the word “leftist”. When did that come back anyway?
Do you even pay attention to your own logic? You claim the evil McCain is trying to prevent you from becoming wealthy (since your Media Matters gig and comic book obsession would have you rolling in dough if it wasn’t for those rascally republicans), but at the same time you argue that the government must keep taking more and more of the money we earn. If only Obama could be elected, then we’ll all be rich!
I’m so sick of people bitching about paying their taxes. You live in the greatest country in the world! No one in this country would be rich if not for the infrastructure that supports all our trade and the legal system that enforces contracts. Can you name any Ethiopian billionaires?
Taxes provide all kinds of benefits that you take for granted. The SEC keeps your investments safe, the military keeps your freedoms safe, the FDA keeps your food safe, the SS system keeps your loved ones from starving in their old age.
Pay your fair share, demand that everyone else does, too, and STFU.
“Can you name any Ethiopian billionaires?”
You know, I’ve encountered my share of crabby rugged Internet libertarians, and I’ve often wondered why they don’t go to Somalia, where there’s no entrenched tax system and no government interference with their desire and certain ability to make it in the world. I don’t know if any of them have taken the plunge.
But at least they’re here, trying to spin the fact that their guy doesn’t know how many houses he owns, so it’s entertaining at least.
>Pay your fair share, demand that everyone else does, too, and STFU.
So tell me Bruce – whats fair? Who decides what’s fair?
“What you leftists continue to miss is that elitism is not based on how much money you have. It’s based on how you treat the people around you who don’t have as much.”
Wow, this is sounding just like the wingnut explanation (a la pecksniff assheads like Dennis Prager) that it’s unfair to accuse “family values” Republicans of hypocrisy when they cheat on their spouses, pick up rent boys, or die of auto-erotic asphyxiation while wearing multiple wetsuits with dildoes stuck up their asses. What’s important isn’t what they DO, it’s what they STAND FOR! And they stand for more goodness and purity than rotten Democrats who stay loyal to their spouses but also don’t wag their fingers at everyone else’s personal lives!
Yes family values isn’t about what deviant sex you have, it’s about what deviant sex you tell others NOT to have! Elitism isn’t about being filthy stinking rich and not having a clue how the mass of Americans live, it’s about how you make them THINK you give a crap about them! Go Republicans!
Rheinhard, you’re so stupid you don’t even realize you just reinforced my point. I said elitism is based on your actions (”how you treat the people around you”). You seem to agree that how you act is more important than the fake things you tell people when you want them to like you *cough*obama*cough*.
As far as “deviant sex” is concerned (I’m not sure why you thought to analogize that with elitism — there’s probably something there psycologically that you may want to talk about with a therapist), it sure seems like leftists spend a lot of time and effort pointing out the non-mainstream sexual activities of people they don’t like. But, hey — I’m sure it’s done out of tolerance and a desire to avoid poking your noses in other people’s personal lives.
it sure seems like leftists spend a lot of time and effort pointing out the non-mainstream sexual activities of people they don’t like
It’s not the activity alone, you moron. It’s the fact that those same people shriek to the high heavens about homosexuals having the same rights as heterosexuals, calling them perverts and pedophiles. It’s the hypocricy.
However, I must be keeping you. Those crosses won’t burn themselves.
Gosh, maybe I should take some responsibility to help them out if they were my “loved ones,” rather than expecting everyone else to do it for me. You’d also think they would have quite a nest egg if they were allowed to invest the nearly 8% of the income that is taken from them for their own good. But of course we can’t trust people with their own money. We better take it away and give some of it back in pre-determined chunks when they’re older (unless they die first).
As far as the other taxes — when I argue that I shouldn’t pay any taxes then feel free to bring up your arguments again — then they won’t be such a pathetic strawman.
Furthermore, when half of the country is not paying any federal income tax and my small tax bracket (made from the salaries of a middle school teacher and an elementary teacher) is paying 2/3 of all collected taxes in the nation, I’m certain I’m well ahead of my “fair share.”
(made from the salaries of a middle school teacher and an elementary teacher)
Ok, considering the fact that someone of your…um…character has most likely done something in the past that would make it illegal for you to be within 100 feet of children, I’m pretty sure this isn’t true.
Ok, considering the fact that someone of your…um…character has most likely done something in the past that would make it illegal for you to be within 100 feet of children, I’m pretty sure this isn’t true.
You know, comments like this are really fucking unacceptable. Insults are one thing. Accusing another person commenting on this blog of being a pedophile and doing so with the comfort of anonymity makes you the biggest PUSSY I’ve come across in a long time.
You’re a pussy Zython.
The Onion had better watch out, because Fox is going to outdo them.
JWG, sorry I couldn’t keep up with the discussion last night. I work two jobs (something I never had to do in the 1990s) and I was tired.
What I say to middle or lower middle class people who make comments like yours is: There are only two kinds of Republicans. Multimilliomaires and SUCKERS.
How much of a tax cut did you get in the great Bush tax-cut scheme of 2001 and 2003? Now, how much do you think Cindy McCain got? Know what I’m sayin’?
Under MCCain’s proposed tax plan, he’d save $300,000. I’d save $319. And the debt would grow deeper, the infrastructure would continue to rot, etc., etc.
Woops, I meant to address that last to Haplo 9 as well.
I’ve been through the statistics about the tax cuts before on this blog. Repeatedly. I don’t have time right now to dig them up and go through it again as links. Each of the bottom 4 quintiles (that’s the bottom 80% of earners) got substantially larger tax cuts than the top quintile. That’s a fact that can’t be disputed if you bother to look at the tax rates. The fact that McCain and other incredibly wealthy people saved vastly larger sums of money has to do with the fact that they also pay even larger sums in taxes. For example, would you rather save 33% or 5%? If someone sees a 33% reduction on a former $3,000 tax bill, that’s still going to be much less money than a 5% savings on a $3,000,000 tax bill.
Statistics, schmatistics. The whole point of a progressive income tax is that the rich pay more because they benefit more from living and doing business in this country.As Michael said above, why don’t more of these crabby libertarians move to Somalia, where there is NO tax burden and NO pesky government to interfere with their pursuit of happiness? H/T, by the way, Michael.
And the country has to pay its bills. Deficits matter, just as they matter in your own finances.
We have a MORE progressive income tax system now under Bush than we’ve had since before Carter. I’ll link to the proof in this blog later.
As far as Somalia is concerned: You’re confusing liberty with anarchy. I’m not surprised that the concepts are confusing to liberals.
You’re a pussy Zython.
Eh, I was shooting towards asshole, really, but whatever.
As far as Somalia is concerned: You’re confusing liberty with anarchy. I’m not surprised that the concepts are confusing to liberals.
You haven’t heard from alot of libertarians, have you?
McCain doesn’t keep track of how many properties are in his wife’s portfolio and owned by his wife’s trust funds because he doesn’t care about the accumulation.
A small point, I know, and I’m late to this shindig, but what would make me think he cares about anything else, if he doesn’t even care about his own stuff? Do you honestly think he cares about you?
It’s based on how you treat the people around you who don’t have as much.
Obama lives in the same neighborhood as people who don’t have as much, and has lived their most of his adult life. McCain splits his time between a bunch of isolated estates.
Bush has more than McCain and comes from a much higher social class, and Bush savaged McCain for his audacity to run against him, engaging in a lot of disgusting tactics in South Carolina– Bush obviously treats people whom he believes to be his “lessors” very poorly.
Finally, the American people seem to dislike candidates who have wealthy wives. Those voters made their voices heard in 2004 and deserve representation in 2008. Is it reprehensible for you to claim that they don’t deserve a vote, simply because the target of their ire and ridicule is on Cindy McCain, rather than the much more intelligent and interesting Teresa Heinz Kerry.
Do you really think Obama knows what its like to be be non-rich any better than McCain does?
You can’t be serious with this, are you? Ya, I think he does.
Isolated estates? Really?
Here is McCain’s primary residence in Phoenix
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=24th and camelback phoenix&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=50.777825,102.480469&ie=UTF8&ll=33.508847,-112.030367&spn=0.006584,0.01251&t=h&z=17
does that really look “isolated”
The unfortunate thing is that you liberals just make up shit like this all the time…We only have time to pin you down some of the time