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	<title>Comments on: MSM/Conservative Bull On Black Bloggers</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/</link>
	<description>Like Kryptonite To Stupid</description>
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		<title>By: Morgaine Swann</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97868</link>
		<dc:creator>Morgaine Swann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2008 05:09:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97868</guid>
		<description>The blogosphere is segregated, but not by color. The segregation is by gender. Notice the article quotes a woman. You, being male, have always been linked by other male bloggers. Women bloggers are much more diverse in their links, but most of them link to a small group of elite male bloggers, including you. Those men might link to a few women here or there, but their blogrolls are nowhere near as diverse, and because there are so many more women blogging, it&#039;s rare for one woman to gain enough links to reach the highest level of notoriety. You guys have lots of links coming in from women, but few go out, and the few that do are spread over a larger number of blogs.  

There is a case to be made that there&#039;s segregation by color within the feminine subset of the political blogosphere, and that is an ongoing conversation, especially in the feminist community. It&#039;s not at all unusual to hear women of color object to an unfair concentration on the issues of upper class white women. Popularity in the blogosphere skews heavily toward younger, whiter, more attractive women. There is no similar trend among male bloggers that I have observed, and your comments seem to confirm that. I do find that male bloggers tend to be very insular, talking to, linking to and reading only each other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The blogosphere is segregated, but not by color. The segregation is by gender. Notice the article quotes a woman. You, being male, have always been linked by other male bloggers. Women bloggers are much more diverse in their links, but most of them link to a small group of elite male bloggers, including you. Those men might link to a few women here or there, but their blogrolls are nowhere near as diverse, and because there are so many more women blogging, it&#8217;s rare for one woman to gain enough links to reach the highest level of notoriety. You guys have lots of links coming in from women, but few go out, and the few that do are spread over a larger number of blogs.  </p>
<p>There is a case to be made that there&#8217;s segregation by color within the feminine subset of the political blogosphere, and that is an ongoing conversation, especially in the feminist community. It&#8217;s not at all unusual to hear women of color object to an unfair concentration on the issues of upper class white women. Popularity in the blogosphere skews heavily toward younger, whiter, more attractive women. There is no similar trend among male bloggers that I have observed, and your comments seem to confirm that. I do find that male bloggers tend to be very insular, talking to, linking to and reading only each other.</p>
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		<title>By: Blue Texan</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97781</link>
		<dc:creator>Blue Texan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 22:05:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97781</guid>
		<description>Who knows more about being a black progressive blogger than Glenn Reynolds?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who knows more about being a black progressive blogger than Glenn Reynolds?</p>
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		<title>By: revenantive</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97718</link>
		<dc:creator>revenantive</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 17:22:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97718</guid>
		<description>through diversity we can only grow stronger.  good, vibrant writing and ideas know no color boundary.  

that is why progressives will win in the long run.  

that said, we are still moving through vestiges of racism and indifference some 40 years after the civil rights movement.  if we can continue to bridge our differences and bring power to ideas and instill optimism where there is little hope, we will put racism and ignorance  where they belong:  the past.

like many others here, i find solace in the anonymity of the internet.  i believe that it provides us with a weapon against stupidity and ignorance.  even as the internets have brought the freepers together (like the free republic forums, where racism and ignorance reign supreme), it has allowed those of us who reject that shit to come together and build the connections and share ideas that  would, could and should turn this country around.  

the only thing that scares me is that someday the bilderbergs and  other such reptiles that control the earth will realize just how powerful a weapon the internets can be...and turn it off...leaving us in the dark...unable to communicate and coordinate, ending our dreams of a more perfect society.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>through diversity we can only grow stronger.  good, vibrant writing and ideas know no color boundary.  </p>
<p>that is why progressives will win in the long run.  </p>
<p>that said, we are still moving through vestiges of racism and indifference some 40 years after the civil rights movement.  if we can continue to bridge our differences and bring power to ideas and instill optimism where there is little hope, we will put racism and ignorance  where they belong:  the past.</p>
<p>like many others here, i find solace in the anonymity of the internet.  i believe that it provides us with a weapon against stupidity and ignorance.  even as the internets have brought the freepers together (like the free republic forums, where racism and ignorance reign supreme), it has allowed those of us who reject that shit to come together and build the connections and share ideas that  would, could and should turn this country around.  </p>
<p>the only thing that scares me is that someday the bilderbergs and  other such reptiles that control the earth will realize just how powerful a weapon the internets can be&#8230;and turn it off&#8230;leaving us in the dark&#8230;unable to communicate and coordinate, ending our dreams of a more perfect society.</p>
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		<title>By: Caged Lion</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97697</link>
		<dc:creator>Caged Lion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 16:30:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97697</guid>
		<description>The white progressive blogosphere doesn&#039;t handle african american issues or general AA thought well---but overall I don&#039;t know why they should be expected to.

It&#039;s only when there is a specific assymetric issue that affects black folks that the derth of black bloggers in influential places hurts.

Having a black blogger or writer is nice; but if these bloggers never speak up for issues that affect themselves as AAs, so much so that you don&#039;t even know they are black, that doesn&#039;t help black folks in general. The point to me is to have our particular issues/perspectives on the table.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The white progressive blogosphere doesn&#8217;t handle african american issues or general AA thought well&#8212;but overall I don&#8217;t know why they should be expected to.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s only when there is a specific assymetric issue that affects black folks that the derth of black bloggers in influential places hurts.</p>
<p>Having a black blogger or writer is nice; but if these bloggers never speak up for issues that affect themselves as AAs, so much so that you don&#8217;t even know they are black, that doesn&#8217;t help black folks in general. The point to me is to have our particular issues/perspectives on the table.</p>
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		<title>By: anotherbozo</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97683</link>
		<dc:creator>anotherbozo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 15:23:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97683</guid>
		<description>Beautifully said, Vanessa.  You&#039;re pretty eloquent yourself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Beautifully said, Vanessa.  You&#8217;re pretty eloquent yourself.</p>
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		<title>By: Vanessa</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97681</link>
		<dc:creator>Vanessa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 15:14:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97681</guid>
		<description>The MSM loves to divide us into black and white, working class and rich, educated and uneducated, beer drinkers and wine drinkers, sport fanatics and opera enthusiasts, arugula eaters and hot-pocket eaters. Divide and conquer is their motive. These divisions are so tired.  

The truth is, as Obama has so eloquently stated over and over again, that we have common goals despite what kind of lettuce we eat.  We all want honest and transparent government. We all want a decent education for our children.  We all want reliable and affordable health care. We all want peace, stability and prosperity.

I&#039;m so sick of the main stream media. They really have no clue, do they?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The MSM loves to divide us into black and white, working class and rich, educated and uneducated, beer drinkers and wine drinkers, sport fanatics and opera enthusiasts, arugula eaters and hot-pocket eaters. Divide and conquer is their motive. These divisions are so tired.  </p>
<p>The truth is, as Obama has so eloquently stated over and over again, that we have common goals despite what kind of lettuce we eat.  We all want honest and transparent government. We all want a decent education for our children.  We all want reliable and affordable health care. We all want peace, stability and prosperity.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m so sick of the main stream media. They really have no clue, do they?</p>
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		<title>By: Repack Rider</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97668</link>
		<dc:creator>Repack Rider</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 14:32:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97668</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve heard the same about female bloggers  How long was it before we found out the Digby was female?

The playing field here is as level as it will ever get.  I read good writing, no matter who provides it.

The MSM MUST attack the legitimacy of the blogs, because apparently only people who own printing presses have worthwhile opinions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve heard the same about female bloggers  How long was it before we found out the Digby was female?</p>
<p>The playing field here is as level as it will ever get.  I read good writing, no matter who provides it.</p>
<p>The MSM MUST attack the legitimacy of the blogs, because apparently only people who own printing presses have worthwhile opinions.</p>
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		<title>By: Jet</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97660</link>
		<dc:creator>Jet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 14:05:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97660</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m with you 100% on this, Oliver. We link to good WRITERS on our blog, and we&#039;ve linked to you forever because you bring it, and well. I think we have a fantastic and diverse blogroll. When I have time, I just roll down it, click and revel. :-)

I&#039;ll share a personal story. Our 4 year-old blog is a group blog with 12 writers. We exchange group emails, cheer each other on for accomplishments that aren&#039;t blogging related and are friends, though of course we&#039;ve never actually met one another. (Five of us making it to YK2 last year was a first.) We have a social as well as professional relationship.

I just found out a couple of months ago that one of my writers who&#039;s been with us for a couple of years is African American. The anonymity of the net lets the writing stand as the wrting, and the lables don&#039;t get a toehold. I share this because while naturally there are bloggers who blog specific issues, race issues being one of them, you really have no idea who is at the keyboard. You can only engage with words, and they belong to all of us equally.

People may like to know who they are dealing with, but I love not knowing. I think nobody knowing Digby was a woman until last year made a poignant point. What was being said was had to be taken as face value with no filters. It&#039;s perfect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m with you 100% on this, Oliver. We link to good WRITERS on our blog, and we&#8217;ve linked to you forever because you bring it, and well. I think we have a fantastic and diverse blogroll. When I have time, I just roll down it, click and revel. <img src='http://www.oliverwillis.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>I&#8217;ll share a personal story. Our 4 year-old blog is a group blog with 12 writers. We exchange group emails, cheer each other on for accomplishments that aren&#8217;t blogging related and are friends, though of course we&#8217;ve never actually met one another. (Five of us making it to YK2 last year was a first.) We have a social as well as professional relationship.</p>
<p>I just found out a couple of months ago that one of my writers who&#8217;s been with us for a couple of years is African American. The anonymity of the net lets the writing stand as the wrting, and the lables don&#8217;t get a toehold. I share this because while naturally there are bloggers who blog specific issues, race issues being one of them, you really have no idea who is at the keyboard. You can only engage with words, and they belong to all of us equally.</p>
<p>People may like to know who they are dealing with, but I love not knowing. I think nobody knowing Digby was a woman until last year made a poignant point. What was being said was had to be taken as face value with no filters. It&#8217;s perfect.</p>
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		<title>By: Zaius Nation</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97647</link>
		<dc:creator>Zaius Nation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 13:21:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97647</guid>
		<description>I have it on good authority that many bloggers are indeed cylons, Tralfamadorians or Lektroids from Planet 10.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have it on good authority that many bloggers are indeed cylons, Tralfamadorians or Lektroids from Planet 10.</p>
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		<title>By: Oliver Willis</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97564</link>
		<dc:creator>Oliver Willis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 07:14:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97564</guid>
		<description>Nobody seems to be able to point to an actual instance of the progressive blogosphere being discriminatory. It mostly reads as people just not getting linked, which is a problem way outside of race. As far as the Harlem blogger meeting, the reason I pooh-poohed the outrage was because I was invited to the meeting but couldn&#039;t attend.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nobody seems to be able to point to an actual instance of the progressive blogosphere being discriminatory. It mostly reads as people just not getting linked, which is a problem way outside of race. As far as the Harlem blogger meeting, the reason I pooh-poohed the outrage was because I was invited to the meeting but couldn&#8217;t attend.</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Smooth</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97562</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Smooth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 06:55:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97562</guid>
		<description>I gotta say, from where I sit it is your attempt to dismiss this issue that doesn&#039;t pass the sniff test.. a wide variety of people link to me as well, but I know that my individual experience does nothing to disprove the trends suggested in the piece, any more than a few wealthy Black celebrities can prove anything about racism in America. 

In theory the medium of blogging would seem to be &quot;color blind&quot; but in practice the same old patterns play out, as they did with Clinton&#039;s all-white blogger meeting in Harlem (which IIRC you were also anxious to dismiss as a non-issue). I&#039;m not suggesting a particular answer to why things play out this way, but I see no reason to shy away and pretend the question isn&#039;t there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I gotta say, from where I sit it is your attempt to dismiss this issue that doesn&#8217;t pass the sniff test.. a wide variety of people link to me as well, but I know that my individual experience does nothing to disprove the trends suggested in the piece, any more than a few wealthy Black celebrities can prove anything about racism in America. </p>
<p>In theory the medium of blogging would seem to be &#8220;color blind&#8221; but in practice the same old patterns play out, as they did with Clinton&#8217;s all-white blogger meeting in Harlem (which IIRC you were also anxious to dismiss as a non-issue). I&#8217;m not suggesting a particular answer to why things play out this way, but I see no reason to shy away and pretend the question isn&#8217;t there.</p>
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		<title>By: inkognegro</title>
		<link>http://www.oliverwillis.com/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97560</link>
		<dc:creator>inkognegro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 06:45:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.oliverwillis.com/index.php/2008/06/02/msmconservative-bull-on-black-bloggers/#comment-97560</guid>
		<description>I think that you are unique in that a.  you have been in the game so long and b. your subject matter is not as centered around race.

most of the offended parties speak out of a perception that the left blogosphere is indifferent to Black causes unless it can be used to bolster their own message.  A lot of the left is STILL uncomfortable dealing with race (just watch what happens if this magical michelle tape DOES exist) and doesn&#039;t do it very well.   

All that said...I thought the whole DNC State Blogging corps dust up was much ado about nothing.  

The kinds of blogs that the DNC was looking for for the state Blogging corps was VERY specific and I don&#039;t know that a lot of the Offended parties were doing the kinda nuts and bolts state party specific stuff.

Either way, I see what Reynolds is doing and its typical of how those folk get down.  

The article was...as is typical of most MSM articles on race...shallow like a kiddie pool and not the least bit enlightening on a topic that REALLY needs some serious work put in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that you are unique in that a.  you have been in the game so long and b. your subject matter is not as centered around race.</p>
<p>most of the offended parties speak out of a perception that the left blogosphere is indifferent to Black causes unless it can be used to bolster their own message.  A lot of the left is STILL uncomfortable dealing with race (just watch what happens if this magical michelle tape DOES exist) and doesn&#8217;t do it very well.   </p>
<p>All that said&#8230;I thought the whole DNC State Blogging corps dust up was much ado about nothing.  </p>
<p>The kinds of blogs that the DNC was looking for for the state Blogging corps was VERY specific and I don&#8217;t know that a lot of the Offended parties were doing the kinda nuts and bolts state party specific stuff.</p>
<p>Either way, I see what Reynolds is doing and its typical of how those folk get down.  </p>
<p>The article was&#8230;as is typical of most MSM articles on race&#8230;shallow like a kiddie pool and not the least bit enlightening on a topic that REALLY needs some serious work put in.</p>
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