This is the kind of thing Bush always does. Dismiss the experts, put down people with intelligence and expertise, deride them and ignore them in favor of short term policies with slightly populist overtones that turn out to be a mess. This is the same sort of thing she pulled when she voted for the Iraq War.
“I’m not going to put my lot in with economists,” the New York senator said when asked to name a credible economist who supported her proposal.
“We’ve got to get out of this mind-set where somehow elite opinion is always on the side of doing things that really disadvantage the vast majority of Americans,” said Clinton, a former first lady who would be the first woman president.
Ron Suskind detailed this sort of world view back in 2004.
In the summer of 2002, after I had written an article in Esquire that the White House didn’t like about Bush’s former communications director, Karen Hughes, I had a meeting with a senior adviser to Bush. He expressed the White House’s displeasure, and then he told me something that at the time I didn’t fully comprehend — but which I now believe gets to the very heart of the Bush presidency.
The aide said that guys like me were ”in what we call the reality-based community,” which he defined as people who ”believe that solutions emerge from your judicious study of discernible reality.” I nodded and murmured something about enlightenment principles and empiricism. He cut me off. ”That’s not the way the world really works anymore,” he continued. ”We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you’re studying that reality — judiciously, as you will — we’ll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that’s how things will sort out. We’re history’s actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.”
With this move – and many others – Clinton continues to move away from a reality-based view of the world.
And the way business works is completely changed. The old paradigms don’t apply at all anymore. Which is why no internet startup ever failed.
Oh, wait a minute….
Translation: We’ve got to stop considering doing things that would actually work and instead turn off our brains, go for the flashy feel-good solution that has no evidence to support it would actually work (quite the contrary) and choose me.
Been saying this about Hilary for a long time. Besides her gimmick gas tax holiday, she bring the same thing to the table that Bush does, less thinking and more feeling. Also she is the anti-uniter like the idiot Bush.
A lot of elite opinion is really just that, opinions of the elite. But there’s a big difference between the self-serving ‘conventional wisdom’ of the elite, and actual reality.
Of course, Clinton is the champion of the sort of free-trade, everything for the wealthy ‘elite opinion’ that she pretends to be against right now. If any of these plans were actually going to hurt the wealthy, she would not be suggesting them. Instead they will eliminate jobs for the working class in road maintenance and make driving conditions unsafe.
We’ve been ignoring the opinion of the true elites for a long time now. And by true elites, I mean the people with actual expertise in these matters, like Paul Krugman. We should get the advice of some who has training in the area, and hasn’t proven himself to be wrong more often than right.
I don’t understand the mentality in this country that intelligence is such a bad thing. I just cannot get over it. It’s so completely ass-backwards, its unbelievable.
Can someone tell me why an ignorant person’s opinion is seen as more valuable than an educated person’s? Why people can deride Barack Obama’s support as coming from “college-educated people”, not “regular Americans.”
Fucking absurd.
Can someone tell me why an ignorant person’s opinion is seen as more valuable than an educated person’s?
Because and ignorant person’s opinion is whatever they are told it should be. Hence, politicians love them.
My grandfather, who was a very wise man, used to say the following during every election cycle:
“If you underestimate the intelligence of the average american voter, you will never be disappointed.”
Words to live by in 2008.
Bush should look that good in a pantsuit!! Really, Hillary’s been looking radiant as her fortunes have come around. Meantime, Obama looks like he could use a little Red Bull and some home cooking. What do they eat in Hawaii anyway??
Hillary hit exactly the right note and smacked Stephanopoulos down as an elite pandering to elites.
To Stephanopoulos and the rest of his Economists who all make over $100k a year, who can drop a $20 on the table for a coffee and a muffin and never think twice as they go off to the Lecture Hall or to the studio, it’s pretty clear who’s out of touch.
To a working mother holding down two jobs and wondering how she’s going to fill up her old Ford Taurus next Wednesday to the tune of $50 when she has $!3.78 in her purse, maybe not so much.
Hillary gets it.
So when that working mother gets her tax holiday, her $3.78 is suddenly going to buy a tank of gas?
The problem with Hillary is that her plan will help that mythical person next week, and in a year or two now that “working mother” now has to pay $5/gallon and put it in a car that gets 20mph (same as today).
Obama’s long-term solutions can make gas $2-3/gallon and help mandate engines that get 45mph. Which one helps the “working mother” more?
Not to mention that Hillary knows that her plan can never pass, because there aren’t 51 Senators running for President who need to pander to people who aren’t paying attention.
Hillary hit exactly the right note and smacked Stephanopoulos down as an elite pandering to elites.
Do you mean that was the role she was playing? Lemme fix that for ya.
As an elite pandering to elites, Hillary hit exactly the right note and smacked Stephanopoulos down.
That should have read $13.78.
Well, if she gets a 20-30 cents a gallon break, maybe 16 gallons costs her $3-5 less. I would say she can count that as money in her wallet. Maybe not much, but SOMETHING.
AS to long-term solkutions, Hillary has plenty of those, too. But this is supposed to be a SHORT-TERM break.
Like Hillary told Steph yesterday, (Paraphrase, but close) “Where were you and your Economists when we were giving a $20 Billion bailout to Goldman Sachs? I didn’t hear you talking about short-sighted then. I am for working families, and I think they deserve a bailout now and then, too.”
Home run.
Aligning herself w/ former right wing dirty tricks czar Richard Mellon Scaiffe is a desperation move that, like her marriage, demonstrates girlfriend will endure any indignity to live in La Casa Blanca again.
No pundit has chastised her for her religious associations w/ the likes of Rick Santorum, Sam Brownback, Ed Meese and John Ashcroft. Lots of womens’ right to choose in that bunch.
I would say she can count that as money in her wallet. Maybe not much, but SOMETHING.
And by September, that will be gone. Give it a break, would ya?
Lots of things will be gone in September.
But the feeling of whether our politicians tried to help working families, or Obama and Stephanopoulos’ Economists will remain.
I keep thinking of Alan Greenspan, with his glasses down his nose, telling us the very best thing we could do to help us with credit-card debt was to go refinance our mortgages, and take advantage of those fancy new loans…
http://www.federalreserve.gov/boarddocs/speeches/2004/20040223/default.htm
“…American consumers might benefit if lenders provided greater mortgage product alternatives to the traditional fixed-rate mortgage. To the degree that households are driven by fears of payment shocks but are willing to manage their own interest rate risks, the traditional fixed-rate mortgage may be an expensive method of financing…”
We know how well THAT Economist’s advice worked out.
Lots of things will be gone in September.
Your grip on reality springs to mind.
Of all the right-wing strategies, the anti-intellectualism and anti-rationality are probably the most harmful.
“Like Hillary told Steph yesterday, (Paraphrase, but close) “Where were you and your Economists when we were giving a $20 Billion bailout to Goldman Sachs? I didn’t hear you talking about short-sighted then. I am for working families, and I think they deserve a bailout now and then, too.” ”
Well first of all it was Bear Stearns and second of all working families aren’t being bailed out, they are being bribed in a campaign year. Bush’s tax cuts were similar- “regular” people wet themselves over the $300 or so less in income tax, forgetting that they are now spending $3000 more in energy and food costs.
Obama is about solutions, not just getting elected.
Shorter Clinton: Look at the bright shiny thing, voter! COme on you know you want it.
No one is this stupid. No one. I’m calling it right here… Wellstone is an instigator. He’s not in the tank for Hillary at all. He’s a conservative poster deciding to have fun trying to make our heads spin.
I refuse to believe that these comments are coming from a place of sincerity.
wondering how she’s going to fill up her old Ford Taurus next Wednesday to the tune of $50
Rejoice! Thanks to Hillary, it’ll only cost her $48.90*! Huzzah!
*Until September. After that it’ll be $54.00.
No one is this stupid. No one.
Dr. Pedro, line two.
Ya, now she can also afford to pay for a gallon of milk on the way home from the gas station.
I guess that’s not like a big deal to ya, Duros.
Hmmm. Mambo, you don’t get around much, do you?
For a true measure of teh Stupid, I challenge you to visit Townhall.com
Now THAT is some world-class Stupid, right there. I usually shake my head in a place of sincere awe.
So wellstone, a gallon of milk costs $1.10? Now whose out of touch?
Wow, a whole gallon?
Happy days are truly here again.
Wellstone: Ya, now she can also afford to pay for a gallon of milk on the way home from the gas station.
Today. She could afford (maybe) to get that gallon of milk today. And next week she’ll be back to SOL unable to afford milk or gas.
But, hey, next week is after the election and what does Hillary care about any longer term solution than what would get her in office?
You never lose votes by offering people free money.
I said she had $13.78 in her purse. Now she’ll have a little more.
In NYC where I live, even though I’m a member of the French-speaking, Veuve-Clicquot-drinking Elite upper crust, I will still go to my local CostCo and buy a gallon of milk for $2.98 instead of paying $4.99 at my local grocer.
I am also a Liberal Budget Hawk.
So, wait! You’re a Coastal elitist and you’re not for Obama? WTF? I thought that was the rule.
Wellstone, it is only an elitist that shops at Costco. The poor, downtrodden single mother that you speak of can’t afford the $50 membership fee, and she doesn’t have the money for gas to drive all the way to Costco to save $2 on milk. Most Costco’s aren’t in small town America. You’re out of touch with middle America.
“I said she had $13.78 in her purse. Now she’ll have a little more.”
Earlier, you said she was trying to fill a $50 tank with that $13.78. If she buys milk instead, how does she get to Costco for those great deals? Walk?
Mambo, I think you’re half right. He’s a liberal but is neutral or supports Obama. Some of the posts are too over the top to be anything but parody.
Wellstone, you are forgetting that our idealistic poor mother just had the transmission drop out of her car at a cost of about $2,000 because she just drove over a manhole-sized pothole that was never filled because we diverted highway funds to pay for a naked pander. It’s ok. The work was going to be done by some undeserving low education construction worker who will now be free to be more bitter and buy into the next political pander.
I’m worried about this Rush Limbaugh “Operation Chaos” –
With Bush’s administration not that popular right now –
What if a Vote for Hillary is…. a Vote for Hillary? HELP!!!!
I guess that’s not like a big deal to ya, Duros.
Kids! Come to dinner! Enjoy your cereal, I got milk.
Wellstone: “We know how well THAT Economist’s advice worked out.”
Yes… let’s burn down the observatory so this never happens again! Good call.
(props to anyone who gets the reference)
Enlightened, I said she had til next Wednesday to figure out how to strecth that $13.78 to a $50 fill-up as an example of the challenges facing most working-class Americans.
I think you challenged my knowledge of the cost of a gallon of milk, and I used my CostCo shopping as an example of my intimate knowledge of essential commodity prices.
I never said that working mother should go to CostCo! You guys make me laugh.
Although, if you visit the only CostCO in NYC, on Vernon Blvd next to the East River in Queens, they are a doable walk from two of the toughest projects in NYC, Queensbridge and Ravenswood houses. I’ve been to that Costco, and watched the same CostCo card clear out like 12 wagons of groceries with different people pushing them.
I’ve been and worked in NYC’s worst neighborhoods, and in Alabama from Mobile to Huntsville, and in South Carolina from Columbia to Greenville. I know poor families, and I know better than to parody them.
Wellstone has poor people cred. Noted.
“Although, if you visit the only CostCO in NYC, on Vernon Blvd next to the East River in Queens, they are a doable walk from two of the toughest projects in NYC, Queensbridge and Ravenswood houses. I’ve been to that Costco, and watched the same CostCo card clear out like 12 wagons of groceries with different people pushing them.”
Of course that does nothing for poor families in the rest of New York City, who aren’t going to have the money for the membership and even if they did, can’t get to Costco without a long subway/bus ride with a cart full of groceries.
Either way, Hillary will do little more for them than McCain.
mambo: Yes… let’s burn down the observatory so this never happens again!
Asimov?
MST3K?
simpsons… From the “Bart’s comet” episode. Moe says it.
Simpsons? Huh. Never would have guessed. (Not a regular watcher.)
Still sounds very Nightfall to me.