Oh my God.
A gunman opened fire in a dorm and classroom at Virginia Tech on Monday, killing 22 people in the deadliest campus shooting in U.S. history. The gunman was killed, but it was unclear if he was shot by police or took his own life.
“Today the university was struck with a tragedy that we consider of monumental proportions,” said Virginia Tech president Charles Steger. “The university is shocked and indeed horrified.”
UPDATE: And of course, in the bizarro-effed up world of Instapundit this means we need more guns in our society. You couldn’t buy the gun nuts a clue if you spotted them a $50.
UPDATE: Here’s the deal – we’ve got screwed up people and we’ve got a culture that allows someone to essentially walk into a store and grab more firepower than the revolutionary army had. It’s amazing this doesn’t happen more, and yet people want to have our country awash in guns.
MAJORITY LEADER REID: “The thoughts and prayers of all Americans are with the Virginia Tech family today. As we learn more about this horrific tragedy – the deadliest shooting in our nation’s history – it breaks our hearts and shakes us to our very cores. We pray for those who were lost and for the speedy recovery of the wounded. And we pray that America can find the strength to overcome our grief and outrage as we face this tragedy together.”
SPEAKER PELOSI: “As the Virginia Tech community struggles with the mourning and questioning that is certain to follow, the continued prayers from this Congress are with the students, their families, the faculty, and the staff at Virginia Tech. Leader Boehner joins me in extending our condolences to all concerned, and we ask for a moment of silence to be observed in this body. Would we all please rise to observe the moment of silence?”
PRESIDENT BUSH: “Today, our nation grieves with those who have lost loved ones at Virginia Tech. We hold the victims in our hearts, we lift them up in our prayers, and we ask a loving God to comfort those who are suffering today.”
THE GUN CULTURE: “High capacity ammo clips became widely available for sale when Congress failed to renew a law that banned assault weapons.”
BRADY CAMPAIGN: “Eight years ago this week, the young people in Littleton, Colorado suffered a horrible attack at Columbine High School, and almost exactly six months ago, five young people were killed at an Amish schoolhouse in Pennsylvania. Since these killings, we’ve done nothing as a country to end gun violence in our schools and communities. If anything, we’ve made it easier to access powerful weapons. We have now seen another horrible tragedy that will never be forgotten. It is long overdue for us to take some common-sense actions to prevent tragedies like this from continuing to occur.”
God and Christ ain’t got nothing to do with what happened. What we need to do, instead, is pray for the souls of the victims, their families, and the faculty & student of VaTech.
And then we must rise up in outrage over the fact that this schidt happens, over and over again. To channel Sam Jackson:
Enough is enough! We’ve HAD IT with all these mother—-in’ guns in this mother—-in’ country!!
But of course, that won’t happen. And I’m sure that at this very minute, someone is working on a way to lay this at the feet of Democrats…
God and Christ ain’t got nothing to do with what happened. What we need to do, instead, is pray for the souls of the victims, their families, and the faculty & student of VaTech.
And then we must rise up in outrage over the fact that this schidt happens, over and over again. To channel Sam Jackson:
Enough is enough! We’ve HAD IT with all these mother—-in’ guns in this mother—-in’ country!!
But of course, that won’t happen. And I’m sure that at this very minute, someone is working on a way to lay this at the feet of Democrats…
This is sick.
I understand the need for the right to bear arms, but I always saw it in the context of hunting. THIS is the reason why I don’t understand why we even allow people to own handguns, semi-automatic weapons, etc. No sane person hunts with those – apparently insane people hunt other people with them though (not that that is news). And he committed suicide they’re saying on MSNBC now too. This is just screwed up. Heart goes out to their families.
Given the week (Oklahoma City bombing, Columbine, Waco, tax time, Hitler’s birthday), I think I have a good idea of the persuasion of the killer.
In my first public reaction to this latest shooting, I’d just like to say that I just hope that this doesn’t lead to more Gun Control.
It could have been different:
1 crazed gunman with an illegally acquired weapon shoots
1 innocent person. Then
1 armed security guard shoots
1 crazed gunman
End of story.
What is it with the left’s fascination with “semi -automatic weapons” (which means, by the way, that it shoots one bullet after another without reloading — it doesn’t mean “kinda like a machine gun”)?
And why take a gun away from every Tom, Dick and Harry, when Tom, Dick and Harry haven’t shot anyone?
Man…get this comment, by Bush’s spokesperson:
“The president believes that there is a right for people to bear arms, but that all laws must be followed.”
Boy…that’s really going out on a limb, moron. I’d actually prefer that all laws “not be followed.”
The dumbest President in the history of the United States once again manages to live up to expectations.
And for those of you who say I’m politicizing…I’m not the one who said the above statement today, that I am *responding* to.
Well, this puts Imus in perspective, doesn’t it?
JK
thanks for the scenario fd10801. you obviously didn’t watch the north hollywood shootout and don’t remember the miami fbi shootout. thanks for providing your incredibly naive opinion though.
AP Official Report (as of 5 seconds ago) – 31 Dead. Frank, that’s 31 reasons right there why Tom, Dick, Harry, Jesus, Mary, and Joseph don’t need a God damned handgun.
Dr. Squid, initial reports say the killer was Asian and looking for his girlfriend. That’s what you were thinking, right?
LMMathews: Fatal car crashes in 2005: 39,189
And no Car Control…
One gunman too many (using liberal logic): Take away everybody’s gun.
Given the week … I think I have a good idea of the persuasion of the killer.
I’ll take that bet, just because your hasty, totally unsupported hypothesis is so ideologically bound.
InstaJerk ought to realize that the University of Tennessee prohibits students (and faculty and staff) from carrying weapons on campus–even if one holds the state’s concealed weapons permit. It’s against the law.
Shut up, Frank.
Hey stupid gun nut: cars aren’t designed to kill people yet are heavily regulated, guns by their very nature are designed to kill.
It could have been different:
But it wasn’t, Frank. Try to get that.
And why take a gun away from every Tom, Dick and Harry, when Tom, Dick and Harry haven’t shot anyone?
I am pretty confident that responsible, law-abiding gun owners are exactly that.
Until they decide not to be.
As tragic as this is, I think Larry Johnson makes an outstanding point which needs to be hammered repeatedly:
20-30 dead from a crazed gunman?
Welcome to ONE DAY IN IRAQ.
How many right-wing warmonger assholes have written editorials along the lines of “Hey, the casualty rate in Iraq ain’t that bad! It’s no worse than South Philadelphia or South Central LA! All these whiny libs need to shut up!” Well, I guess An Coulter, William Kristol, Charles Krauthammer, et al, can ring up the families of these dead kids and tell them they need to stop whining and get over it all, because this loss really isn’t that big when viewed in the grand scheme of things.
initial reports say the killer was Asian
You just make that one up?
I admit to my speculation. You need to do the same.
Sorry for the double post…stupid Pratt Library PCs.
Bush is giving a national address this afternoon. Wanna bet he tries to tie this in with Al Queda and the War on Terr’ism??
Apparently the initial White House press release bigged up the second amendment. Like twats.
Waiting for inevitable “Jail the brown people” from the Malkinites…
initial reports say the killer was Asian
You just make that one up?
I heard it, too…
I also heard that he was looking for an ex-girlfriend. Unless she turns out be a Democrat, your “Adolf Hitler memorial right wing shooting” theory is falling apart, Dr. Squid.
And, if you think the President’s response was dumb, Speaker – in – Chief Pelosi asked for a moment of silence.
While even a moment of silence from Congress is welcome, it’s not extraordinarily productive.
Reality Check #1: Why was there a shooting and killing around 9:00, and another bunch of killings at 11:00 AM?
What the hell was going on?
My question #2: Why in the world is the Press curious about “Why it happened” less than 5 hours after the incident, when they may not have even identified the killer, and or his accomplices?
#1: As I understand it, they locked down the school for a couple of hours, couldn’t find anyone, and then unnacountably OPENED IT UP AGAIN. Like IMBECILES.
#2: What? Shut up. Who cares.
And why are you taking Dr Squid’s theory so personally? He figured, logically enough, that it might be another crazy Hitler guy like in Columbine. It probably wasn’t, but there you go, no reason to get all snippy about it. Unless perhaps you like Jolly Jolly Hitler yourself. But you don’t.
He’s a celebrity now, though.
Hey stupid gun nut: cars aren’t designed to kill people yet are heavily regulated, guns by their very nature are designed to kill.
Oliver, if you own enough land you can drive a car on it all day with no registration, no insurance, and go Tim ‘The Toolman’ Taylor pimp-out crazy on it and nobody can do a damned thing about it.
The ‘we register cars’ argument to drastically regulate guns is probably the most lame on record.
And so what if guns are designed to kill? A gun on its own cannot kill somebody. I’ve been arguing this issue for 10 years and I have yet to see any person lay out a clear, rational explanation for their support of the level of gun control that they want. They react to tragedies like today and use that as a driving force even though these kinds of incidents are rare.
Gun deaths in the United States account for about 1% of all deaths in the country. The majority of those gun deaths are gang and drug related.
With regard to accidental deaths, more people are poisoned or fall to their deaths than are killed with guns.
The bottom line is: guns aren’t the problem and I have yet to see anybody prove that it is.
“And, if you think the President’s response was dumb, Speaker – in – Chief Pelosi asked for a moment of silence.
While even a moment of silence from Congress is welcome, it’s not extraordinarily productive.”
ya, because congress should be down there dressing wounds or something …
Thanks, Nimrod. I own a calendar and all that.
Apparently not a white guy. Now we get to hear from Tom Tancredo’s knuckledraggers. I predict we’ll hear a bunch of noise about them baaad immigrants, and the MSM will be glad to broadcast it.
As for the worst school killing in American history? 45 in 1927, Bath, MI? The killer blamed his taxes.
Nimrod: I’m going to pretend you have a brain for a moment: Try and relax, it shouldn’t be too painful.
This blog purports to be, from time to time, about the media. We can count on this being all over the news for at least 48 hours.
My question is related to that coverage; and to the perennial American question: Why?
I’m thinking that when a guy wakes up, arms himself, and goes on a shooting spree, the reason why is probably complicated.
So complicated, in fact, that asking that question without knowing even the identity of the killer is a monumental waste of time.
All it would have taken, Willis, is one armed person to stand up to the nut case. One.
That you don’t understand that is your problem.
Jesus fucking Christ, not everything is about politics.
Apparently not a white guy. Now we get to hear from Tom Tancredo’s knuckledraggers. I predict we’ll hear a bunch of noise about them baaad immigrants, and the MSM will be glad to broadcast it.
Oh that’s rich. At 2:19pm you posted a comment where you were practically hoping it was some crazed right wing white boy so you could make a bunch of political hay out of it. Now you’re getting your knickers in a twist over what somebody might say because the shooter is (as early reports say) is Asian.
How quickly things change.
All it would have taken was for this nutter to not be able to arm himself like this and go on a murder spree and 31 (or more) people don’t go home dead tonight.
As for the worst school killing in American history? 45 in 1927, Bath, MI? The killer blamed his taxes.
Dr. Squid, you know damn well that wasn’t a “school killing”!
He burnt the school down
What’s next? The Boston Molasses Flood of 1919?
The Our Lady of Angels Fire?
Jay, that has to be the most insane thing I’ve ever heard.
No, a gun on its own cannot kill anyone, but having a gun in your possession expotentially raises your chances of doing so, doesn’t it? ‘Cause chances are ZERO that you will shoot someone without the damned gun. Duh.
Let’s take this all the way out there, going on your suppostion that the guns don’t kill the people, shall we? After all, no weapon can kill someone without a person using it. Therefore, there are a list of other seemingly innocuous items that everyone should be allowed to keep around the house – nuclear weapons on their own can’t kill anybody either. Let’s give everyone in America one of those too. And grenades. And a tank. And a couple of machetes. And some switches. And butterfy knives. And IEDs. And a bazooka or two for good measure. And some Sarin gas. And one of those new lasers that makes you feel like you’re being cooked. Security- gotta protect the homefront and all. Splendid idea – because none of them will kill you without someone operating it, and no one would do that now would they?
Ah but that’s going too far you’d say. What the Hell why not? After all, the ‘honor system’, which is what the gun nut argument you’re using amounts to, worked so damned well today didn’t it? Just ask all the people who only got shot – instead of shot and killed!
Give me a break. Handguns are made to kill people, plain and simple – you can call it protection, you can call it security, you can call it your freakin’ right – whatever the Hell you please. How about the rights of those 31 people? Where were their rights when they were getting killed today?
The simple fact is hand guns were made with one nefarious purpose in mind and should not be wandered around with by private citizens. Period. This is my opinion.
And before you go off I realize that assholes are like opinions and everyone has one but THIS asshole would rather live, and not see or be the victim of some moron shooting up another college, high school, Amish community, his wife, brother, sister, next door neighbor, yadda yadda yadda ad infinitum so you can keep your wholly unnecessary deadly freakin’ man-toy!
Actually, Frank, he blew it up.
I didn’t look it up, Hedley; but I knew it wasn’t a shooting spree.
…one armed person to stand up to the nut case.
Ah yes, the one lone hero who armed himself just incase and decides he’s going to arbitrate justice and spread safety throughout the land. I’m very positive it would have only been the one too, right? Wouldn’t have a situation of, say, a dozen armed people in the area, gunfire is heard, I’m positive none of these people with the extra, safety-making guns would have, for instance, gotten jumpy and accidently shot off early before taking proper aim, hearing the source in the wrong location and start shooting someone with a cell phone, see someone else with a gun who is actually trying to stop the origional shooter and make the mistake that ends that would-be-hero’s life. I’m so very positive it would have happened in the perfect way that would have left everyone happy at the end if only everyone there were armed. Thats what we should want for our kids, crossfire.
The ‘we register cars’ argument to drastically regulate guns is probably the most lame on record.
And so what if guns are designed to kill? A gun on its own cannot kill somebody. I’ve been arguing this issue for 10 years and I have yet to see any person lay out a clear, rational explanation for their support of the level of gun control that they want.
May I? *ahem* Guns, like Cars, have both positive and negative applications. Both can be beneficial to people, both can be negative to people. Lets take a quick comparison:
Cars – Operator/Owner must have a license to operate the device, proving that they are competant enough to use it safely; The device must be registered with the MVA/DMV, making it trackable in case its stolen and/or used in a crime.
Guns – Lobbying organization opposes Licensing of people, registration of the devices, and any regulation at all on how/where they may be used and to what effect.
My question is what exactly would be the downside of keeping a database of who purchased what gun in order to track them for potential criminal uses, and what is the downside of requiring gun-owners to prove they posses the basic competancy to use the damn things safely? Cars, Radioactive Materials, Flammable fuels, myriad other things have positive and negative uses, and are regulated such that the negative are minimized as much as possible. No such equivalent exists for guns. How many more car accidents would there be annually if there were no licensing process? How many fewer gun deaths might we have if there were one?
What Duros said.
Yeah, Frank, because blowing the school up a la the Murrah building makes it totally different, as if the kids are a different kind of dead.
And I never said it was a shooting spree.
Don’t you have some biochemistry to deny somewhere else, kook?
Therefore, there are a list of other seemingly innocuous items that everyone should be allowed to keep around the house – nuclear weapons on their own can’t kill anybody either. Let’s give everyone in America one of those too. And grenades. And a tank. And a couple of machetes. And some switches. And butterfy knives. And IEDs.
Your ‘point’ makes little sense and is not a refutation of what I said. I didn’t use what I said as a justification for what you just said, so its irrelevant.
Cars – Operator/Owner must have a license to operate the device, proving that they are competant enough to use it safely; The device must be registered with the MVA/DMV, making it trackable in case its stolen and/or used in a crime.
That is not the case for somebody that is operating a vehicle on their own land. Let’s say you have a few acres of property. You can drive an SUV all around that property with:
A. No license
B. No insurance
C. No registration
Without penalty.
My question is what exactly would be the downside of keeping a database of who purchased what gun in order to track them for potential criminal uses
Actually there is. Each gun has its own serial number and at the time of the sale, that record is put on file as licensed firearm dealers are required to do.
and what is the downside of requiring gun-owners to prove they posses the basic competancy to use the damn things safely?
In states where concealed carry licenses are issued, they have to do just that.
Cars, Radioactive Materials, Flammable fuels, myriad other things have positive and negative uses, and are regulated such that the negative are minimized as much as possible. No such equivalent exists for guns.
That’s nonsense. How do you explain the fact that accidental gun deaths are so low each year in relation to the amount of guns that are owned? About ten times more people each year die from falls than from accidental gun deaths.
Once again, we have a situation that rarely occurs and yet people are behaving as though it is something that happens routinely.
Yes we should thank heavens that we only sporadically have mass killings in America. I honestly know you don’t understand how twisted that sounds.
Ooooh, Dr. Squid! You called me a kook!
Can I call you something now?
There were 92 children killed in the Our Lady of Angels fire in Chicago.
1,503 people died when the Titanic went down. Wanna talk about steamship control?
“Kook” doesn’t begin to describe you.
People, please just ignore him when he does this.
That is not the case for somebody that is operating a vehicle on their own land. Let’s say you have a few acres of property. You can drive an SUV all around that property with…
Cool. How about we let people have any gun they want as long as they never take them off their own property.
And as long as no ordnance that they fire from their weapons leaves their property.
Agreed?
Now please have the basic common decency to notice that this scenario has nothing to do with the VT shooter and his ordnance.
eh, that last comment was by me.
Oliver, the logic you are torturing to make sense out of this is that because there are so many guns around, that their mere presence makes these incidents possible.
However, when you consider the rarity of such incidents, it suggests that we would have to extend a gargantuan effort to reduce the number of guns — even if the possession of a weapon by anyone anywhere could be made a crime — to a point where no such incidents could ever happen again.
We have millions of policeman, but crimes still occur. We have millions of firemen, but fires still occur.
Assuming we could just ignore the Constitution, and dispossess everyone in the United States of their guns, we would immediately have two problems:
1) Law abiding citizens would relinquish their guns first, leaving only those who don’t obey laws would have guns. Certainly a fair number of them would take advantage of the situation; and
2) People who intended to kill might be delayed or even prevented from killing others, because they wouldn’t have a gun, but they could still blow things up, start fires, or come up with other ingenious ways to kill others.
What you, and your well – intentioned liberal friends, are hoping for is that the elimination of guns will accomplish the elimination of murders.
Since it won’t, and you know it, you more likely just want to feel like you are doing SOMETHING. As Randy in Baltimore put it at 1:47, “And then we must rise up in outrage”.
Thanks, Oliver – for nothing. Dr. Squid called me a kook because I pointed out how blazingly irrelevant his post was to the issue at hand.
Of course, this translates to “Ignore Frank.”
You guys don’t want to discuss anything. If you could blame Bush for this, you probably would. Dr. Squid already attributed the killings to a right wing assailant, hours ago.
But I’m a kook. Gimme a break.
For once in your lives, ignore your reflexes and try to tell yourselves, “Some people just go off”… The killer’s Hard Drive revealed that he played a ton of violent video games.
As more and more of this guy’s background is uncovered, we will probably find a triggering event, isolation, misperception, and ten other things that characterize “random killers”, who, in actual fact, had been walking on the path towards their crimes for quite some time.
“What you, and your well – intentioned liberal friends, are hoping for is that the elimination of guns will accomplish the elimination of murders.”
Or the reduction of them to levels seen in the rest of the developed world, i.e. Australia, New Zealand, Canada, Great Britain, Germany, France, Scandinavia, Japan — all places where the rates of violent crime are similar, but the rates of deaths resulting from violent crime are far lower.
Because you start hurling insults and thread derailment right away. You do it all the time.
How about the rarity of such events in, say, Great Britain?
Not to be a thread jumper here, but…
What you, and your well – intentioned conservative friends, are hoping for is that the elimination of legal and safe abortions will accomplish the elimination of abortions
There. Fixed.
Actually there is [a database]. Each gun has its own serial number and at the time of the sale, that record is put on file as licensed firearm dealers are required to do.
I might be wrong about this, and I hate that I cannot find the appropriate sources off hand, but as I understand it, the database that used to exist only kept track of sales and registration numbers for 6 months and then deleted the records entirely. At some point in the past six years, I also seem to recall Rumsfeld or someone else high up in the administration eliminating the registration database altogether. If I’m wrong about this I do regret it, but if not that still leaves a very limited record of what firearms went to who at what time, and considering such records are/were eliminated after 6 months severely hinders its usefulness. Why not just keep a full record of them all somewhere? It’s unlikely that each individual record will need to be referenced, but the database on the whole would certainly be useful.
As far as conceal-carry laws and licences, I’m completely fine with that. If you’re sane enough to operate a gun safely theres no reason you shouldnt be able to carry one around in public. Curious, does that law extend to the purchasing of the gun as well as carrying though? Just that it occurs to me that part of the cause of these shootings can correlate to the availability of guns over licensing procedures since, to my incomplete knowledge, these killers don’t tend to be licensed.
About ten times more people each year die from falls than from accidental gun deaths.
Well yes, okay, but “accidental” deaths, while a larger part of the fatalities that can be attributed to automobile, radioactive and petrochemical misuse are typically accounted as accidental, not all of them are, and as such, like Guns, they pose a hazard to people at large (though the hazard Guns pose is one more of intent than of accident) and as such I think need to be regulated at least as much as the others if not slightly moreso given that they are basically built to inflict physical damage. If this is the case already in some form or other and I don’t know it, then I don’t have anything else to say I suppose.
Great, Duros62: Do what I was accused of doing and — nada, zip, zilch, bupkus.
I do not own a gun–never have and likely never will. I still defend the right to own one, just like I defend the right of people to speak their mind even when that mind appears damaged, belong to crazy religious sects, be free from unreasonable eavesdropping by the government etc. With respect to the idea that just one law abiding citizen who was armed could have stopped this guy, has anybody checked to see if Virginia has concealed carry? I have a pal who just got his concealed carry permit in another state and I was chiding him about how long it would be before he stopped a massacre and he told me he would not actually carry his firearm around because it was heavy, was cold in the winter and hot in the summer–so much for that justification. On the other hand I recall reading some Royal report on the alarming number of homicides in Scotland a few years back and it was attributed to young men drinking and “the ready availability of knives”. Obviously it would be very difficult for a single guy to knife 32 people to death and injure another 15 at least in the space of a couple of hours, but I do not see the gun control issue as simple in any respect. I wish there were fewer guns, but I worry about the government taking them away and while it might prevent tragedies like Virginia Tech, I doubt if it would reduce the overall rates of murder in this country.
“I doubt if it would reduce the overall rates of murder in this country.”
With due respect, it’s the simplest and best explanation for why Western Europe’s similar violent crime rates don’t lead to a similar murder rate.
Guns … pose a hazard to people at large … and as such I think need to be regulated …
They are regulated!
In the first place, no one knows yet where he got the guns: Did he buy them legally? Did he steal them? Did he get them from someone else, without their knowledge?
Let me try this one more time: When people say, “Guns don’t kill people; people kill people”, they mean, in this case, that this guy woke up, armed himself (in some way or other), and killed dozens of people.
That is monstrous! You’re talking about guns, when you should be amazed that a man like this is outside an institution’s walls.
You should be asking why campus security assumed that the problem was solved when they couldn’t find the gunman from shooting #1.
Did you ever have a mouse in your house? Did you ever watch it disappear behind the stove or the refrigerator? Did you assume it was gone?
Of course not! The police should not have rested until they found the guy.
Once in my building there was the smell of gas. A fireman came around and advised us that the next time a fireman came to the door, he would be asking us to leave. We stayed up, dressed, and ready to get out, until all the fire engines rolled away.
A simple telephone warning tree would have prevented the second batch (the numerically greater amount) of shootings.
But, no, let’s take away everyone’s guns in America…
Yeah, that’s the ticket!
it’s the simplest and best explanation for why Western Europe’s similar violent crime rates don’t lead to a similar murder rate.
It may be the simplest, but it is by no means the best.
There are a number of possible factors which might be at play here:
1) Perhaps Americans commit more violent crimes, i.e., crimes with more force and vigor;
2) Perhaps Europeans cling to life more tenaciously;
3) Perhaps life is less valuable here in the United States (the one I’d put my money on), and death eliminates witnesses, especially in death penalty states. and
4) I’ve never even heard of that statistical comparison — that are a similar amount of violent crimes in Europe, but less deaths. And I don’t know why Europeans think that it might be so.
I think you’re just parroting what you’ve heard somewhere, from an unreliable source.
“As more and more of this guy’s background is uncovered, we will probably find a triggering event, isolation, misperception, and ten other things that characterize ‘random killers’ ”
like obsessively posting idiotic rants on blogs?
You should be amazed that a man like this is outside an institution’s walls.
You are wrong to think I’m not. Presuming, as we’ll likely hear more about, that there were earlier warning signs that should have had him being watched heavily, theres no excuse for him to have had the freedom he did, nor the access to firearms.
You should be asking why campus security assumed that the problem was solved when they couldn’t find the gunman from shooting #1.
You are wrong to assume that I dont think this was the wrong decision on their part. It was unconscionably negligent of them to have not taken basic precautions like that. However, this is an issue of the problem exacerbating where we’re talking about how it started in the first place.
But, no, let’s take away everyone’s guns in America
You are wrong to pretend I suggested anything of the sort. I haven’t, and don’t, advocated anything like that. I’m talking about just keeping track of as many as possible and core competancy requirements on par with that of car ownership to minimize problems.
Please stop being self-evidently wrong about so much Frank. Its one of the reasons nobody respects you.
Jay, I don’t know what state you live in but you can’t do that here. Called a notary public who works at a car dealership to make sure. You cannot purchase a car in my state without a valid license, obtaining a plate, proof of insurance, yadda yadda. So your fantastic thoery of driving a car wherever on your property is moot because you can’t buy one here that way. Hence – regulation. And by the way there is a huge difference between regulating a mode of transportation and something specifically designed to cause someone to shuffle off the mortal coil, sir. Ford didn’t make the model T with the intent of murdering people – it was to move people.
And Frank – yes we should take the handguns and automatic weapons away from private citizens because as has been mentioned several times their designed intent is to be used to KILL people. I’m all for it and I come from a long line of gun nuts. This isn’t a question of the constitutional right for the states to bear arms against the nation if it ever came to that, which no one wants it to but that provision is there isn’t it? It’s not about the right to hunt and kill your own food. This is a question of where is the sanity of the state in letting private citizens walk about with weapons that are specifically designed to kill other people, let alone with the minimal amount of regulation that they now have. It’s an apples and oranges comparison.
Cops should have handguns. Military should have handguns. Joe Schmoe doesn’t need and shouldn’t have a 9MM, a AK-47, etc. The idea of that somehow being a constitutionally protect right is just insipid.
“Joe Average does not have a constitutional right to own a gun, for god’s sake. We’re not stupid.”
- James Madison.
In Duckman. But he’s not wrong.
Christ, 33 kids dead and all assholes like Frank and Jay can think about is how this threatens their god-given right to arm bears.
Isn’t there some unused cattle range out in Wyoming or Nevada where we can fence these people in and let them shoot the fuck out of each other to their heart’s content?
Rex: Why even answer me?
The comment was addressed to everyone.
And, I made no assumptions about you whatever, so I couldn’t possibly be wrong to have those assumptions…
You should be amazed that a man like this is outside an institution’s walls.
You are wrong to think I’m not.
I didn’t say you thought that. My comment was addressed to everyone. No one was talking about it, including you.
You should be asking why campus security assumed that the problem was solved when they couldn’t find the gunman from shooting #1.
You are wrong to assume that I dont think this was the wrong decision on their part.
Addressed to everyone again, not just you. You didn’t mention it, and very few people did.
So, there was nothing to be wrong about.
“But, no, let’s take away everyone’s guns in America” was not addressed to anyone in particular. It was a response to the impression I was getting from the pro gun – control people, that there should be no guns.
You don’t think that? Good for you. I didn’t read your mind, and you didn’t say so.
So, it seems you have made three false assumptions. Care to run that “self – evidently wrong” thing by me again?
You, like many people on this blog, have made assumptions about me, long, long ago. And that is why you don’t respect me. And there is no other reason.
LMMathews: I really wouldn’t care if no one owned a gun. But there is a special Constitutional amendment designed for, and devoted to, the idea that people have a right to keep and bear arms.
I didn’t write that, although some of you think I’m old enough.
I really wouldn’t care if no one had a gun, police included. Unlike you, however, I’m not crazed about the idea of personal gun ownership.
I don’t care why people own the gun or guns they own, but I do know that lots of people — lots and lots of people — own guns with no danger to themselves or anyone else.
I also know that there are gun control laws in cities and states all over the United States. With all of those laws in place, gun crimes continue to occur. That’s that.
“I think you’re just parroting what you’ve heard somewhere, from an unreliable source.”
Yes. I’m parroting wikipedia, which is in turn parroting the Justice Department.
“Despite the overall crime rate of the United States being seemingly in line with that of other industrialized countries, its homicide rate, which has declined substantially since 1991, is still among the highest in the industrialized world.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States
The reason why we have more murders here as compared with Western Europe, Japan, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand is because it’s harder for people get guns there.
Bear in mind that a) I don’t think Democrats should make gun control a big issue, and b) killing sprees are a separate issue from the homicide rate overall. But I definitely think that the relatively lax gun availability that we have here in the U.S. kills many, many more people than Instapundit would have you believe it saves.
The bottom line is: guns aren’t the problem and I have yet to see anybody prove that it is.
Well gosh, I’ll let you know when the first of 31 coroner’s reports come out.
Dipshit.
Uh, Wilbur…
Didn’t initial few commenters make the focus of the comments about gun control?
I don’t think it is inappropriate to respond to that- pro or con- though it’s unfortunate the conversation had to come to that so soon rather than just make one post about the tragedy itself.
Jay is almost right. Guns are PART of the problem. First and foremost, is the lack of regard for human life. Before you put a gun in your hand, and decided to off 33 innocents, you had to have a lack of regard for human life.
Where does that come from? Hell…I don’t know. Studies have shown that children who witness violent acts are much more likely to engage in similar acts.
Then there is mentall illness. Then there is just the simple notion that some people are inherently “evil.”
It’s too damn complicated to blame it on the gun that was the weapon of choice….I’ll only say that for whatever reason, this guy had a gun in his possession that he should not have had. How did that happen?
Sometimes, I wonder if kids these days simply can’t handle the world. Too much to absorb, too damn fast.
JK
Wilbur: The British tried a similar idea in South Africa around the beginning of the 20th Century.
I believe they called them concentration camps.
JK: I think you’ve finally got it.
The topic is “Deviance and Social Control” Why do people do stuff that is against the law?
Why do people have a lack of regard for human life? It’s called “desensitization”. Many years ago, on the Dick Cavett Show, Cavett questioned Lee van Cleef about his participation in “violent” “spaghetti westerns” (of course, they were nothing compared to today’s “slash and splatter” films). Lee’s response was prescient: “Kids should see what it looks like when someone gets shot. Now, they watch television, a guy gets shot, and all he gets is a hole in his shirt.”
Now, kids “kill” hundreds of virtual opponents in video games every day. Is it a big surprise that the transition to real life murder is easy?
As a community, people with mental illness are less violent than their sane neighbors. This is because their disorders are regulated by medication, their behaviors are closely monitored, and their lack of social skills and disordered thought processes make it difficult for them to carry out complicated murder schemes.
Finally, it’;s not so much that kids can’t handle the world; it’s more like they’re not expected to. I believe that this is an unintended consequence of “letting kids be kids”. They feel an internal pressure to do the right thing with no good tools for doing the right thing.
Finally, frameone should send a “Thank You” note to Abbott Laboratories.
=;-}
Sure thing, frank. Why if it wasn’t for Depakote I’d be obsessivley posting rambling, incoherent drivel with indications of an extreme persecution complex …
What’s worse? A messed up kid with a violent video game, or a messed up kid with a gun.
frameone: So why did you stop taking it?
(In your case, it obviously prevents you from having a sense of humor. The joke was on me, and you didn’t even get it)
Oliver: What’s worse?
Why are you asking?
It’s too bad you condensed my comment into a phrase.
I’m not trying to “win” anything here; I’m trying to make a point.
A messed up kid with both.
Uh, geniuses, if he doesn’t have the gun no matter how bad the video game he can’t spray and kill people.
Then he will find something else.
A Symptom of our “Chain Letter Society”?
Read an analysis of the influences in our “Chain Letter Society” that may be precipitating events like the tragedy at Virginia Tech and how our focus on winning and being number one may be fostering a generation of children with fully inadequate coping skills who have a misguided sense of self-worth…here:
http://www.thoughttheater.com
Wow! Great find, Daniel!
I’ll be Furling that.
A refreshing alternative to “No Guns!” “No Guns!”
Compare “No Guns!” with “abstinence is a failure” for some interesting cognitive dissonance…
And further to that point:
Murder: The Weapon Isn’t the Question
yea, and hey, what up with switzerland?
Low homicide rate, an AUTOMATIC RIFLE in every household with a male between 18-32?
Hey, ollie, you don’t want to protect yourself….fine. Don’t stand in the way of my constitutional right to protect MYSELF and my family ok?
Yeah, Frank, I Know You Are But What Am I. The pinnacle of conservative argument. Must be a good conservative argument because it comes from someone with self-proclaimed conservative credentials.
Meanwhile, the topic was school killings. Not a tragic fire. Not the Titanic. School killings. That thing at Bath was, you know, AT A SCHOOL. And it wasn’t an accident. Hell, the guy even smiled as he saw it blow up.
Saying that a mass killing at a school is irrelevant to school killings is, well, just silly.
Is it good to be silly as long you have conservative credentials?
Dr. Squid: I surrender. No go away.
yea, and hey, what up with switzerland?
In addition to a rifle in most every household, Switzerland also has…
-a compulsory and ongoing program of training in firearm use and safety for those with the rifles
-a humane and well-funded set of social programs, including decent and affordable health insurance for everyone
-a public education system that isn’t a complete joke
-very little poverty
-a culture that doesn’t promote killing – through guns, daisy cutters and lethal injections – as a solution to every problem.
Tell you what, pedro, you help me work to get all that in our country and I’ll help you get the right to wear an uzi into the operating theater, if that’s what floats your boat.
What really galls me is the ghoulish reaction of freakballs like instupidnut and ithead up above: If only all the VT students had been packing heat! I’m really tired of having this country run by nutjobs who think they’re living in an episode of Mannix.
Wilbur: Do we really have to resurrect the same lament, every three or four years, when some loner nutjob gets his hands on a weapon, and decides to go out in a blaze of glory?
It’s not like there’s a rash of copycat multiple murders that will follow, and the poor jimoke who pulls the stunt almost always ends up dead, most times at his own hand.
I certainly don’t want everyone armed: frameone with a gun? “s”? OMG, No!
But there are sick people out there. We can’t get ‘em all into rehab, or Family Court. That’s just the way it is.
Don’t you think that if people didn’t want a gun, the way I don’t want a gun — I really don’t want a gun — that there would be a lot less of them?
Access to guns didn’t create an atmosphere of violence; an atmosphere of violence gave the budding nutjobs out there the idea that a massive shootout was the way to settle their score with the world.
We’ve a long way to go before anger and violence are compartmentalized, and killing is really marginalized. A long, long way to go.
As Carleton S, Coon put it in The Story of Man: We’re not at all removed from our neolithic ancestors, who looked across their neighbors’ border. and thought, “My sheep are my sheep, and your sheep are your sheep, unless something happens to my sheep; then I’ll steal your sheep, if I have to.”
Only now we have XBoxes, and YouTube — and guns.
Frank, do you ever shut up?
Yes, because “a well regulated militia” translates into “I must have a machine gun to compensate for my shortcomings as a man”.
Access to guns didn’t create an atmosphere of violence; an atmosphere of violence gave the budding nutjobs out there the idea that a massive shootout was the way to settle their score with the world.
I agree, but you’re kidding yourself if you think what you’re describing is endemic to the human condition, and not something deeply out of whack in this country in particular.
The people in Canada, Britain, Sweden, France and Switzerland are no further from our neolithic cousins than we are, but their rate of firearm deaths is – at most – half of what ours is.
We’ve a long way to go before anger and violence are compartmentalized, and killing is really marginalized. A long, long way to go.
You’re right, but people like you aren’t helping. You may not be a gun nut yourself, Frank, but you run interference for gun nuts.
You cannot purchase a car in my state without a valid license, obtaining a plate, proof of insurance, yadda yadda. So your fantastic thoery of driving a car wherever on your property is moot because you can’t buy one here that way.
You cannot purchase a car at a dealership without a license, insurance, etc.
I can easily purchase a car from somebody without all of that paperwork. And it isn’t a ‘fantastic theory.’ It is a fact. And what it does is shoot down the absurd “Well, we have to register cars, why not guns?” argument which is lame to begin with in the context of owning an automobile and operating it on private property. It is only when the automobile is used in the public domain that registration, insurance and a license become necessary.
“Despite the overall crime rate of the United States being seemingly in line with that of other industrialized countries, its homicide rate, which has declined substantially since 1991, is still among the highest in the industrialized world.”
Is that per capita?
Waiting for inevitable “Jail the brown people” from the Malkinites…
Right sentiment, wrong source.
The C-list conservatives all seem to run together.
If it is ever illegal for citizens to own guns, only criminals and military, law enforcement, etc., will own them.
Guns that are now legal will end up on the black market, also available only to criminals. Is that what gun control idiots really want?
What makes people think that gun control would stop people from getting guns in the first place? Do you really think someone plotting a murder is concerned with the legality of owning a gun?
Lastly, the vast majority of killers are not spree killers, but people who plan on killing a specific person. They don’t need a gun to do this, and if they don’t have access to a gun they always have another way to kill them. And if they decide to kill a mass of people, they will always have the option of making bombs, which can be made easily and cheaply using household items and readily-available recipes.
This will never change. Personally, I’m not at all concerned that events like this will affect gun legislation and the right of law-abiding citizens to own and carry guns.
Actually what switzerland, Sweden, britain etc have is a much more homogenous society with a common sense of social mores. They don’t have miilions of undocumented aliens living there and forming violent gangs. They don’t have the cultural diversity of the United States. They don’t have a Hollywood full of liberals that on one hand make billions selling gun violence and on the other condeming it.
Any lefty with the stones to look…here is the data
http://www.tinyvital.com/BlogArchives/000220.html
Out of curiosity to Frank and the rest of you who support the gun nuts in this, have you ever been shot? Ever been even grazed?
Out of curiosity to Frank and the rest of you who support the gun nuts in this, have you ever been shot? Ever been even grazed?
What does that have to do with anything? And what constitutes a ‘gun nut’ exactly?
You don’t really know anything about Europe, have you pedro? There are huge problems with immigration and minority cultures in most European countries, including UK, France, Sweden. Not so much Switzerland but they have it there as well. Somehow they manage to handle it without blowing each other away on a regular basis as often.
And as for the bullshit link you provided, maybe you didn’t read enough of it to come across this sentence, which not even the racist dipshit who wrote it was dishonest enough to omit:
It is true that we (USA) have a high murder rate, mostly of criminals killing criminals, but a distressingly large number of people killing their spouses in anger, and the rate of “stranger killings” is rising.
Pay attention, Pedro: overall crime rate is not the issue here; murder by firearms is, and you know it.
Once again, Pedro, you are a disgrace to your (alleged) profession. You nauseate me.
And what it does is shoot down the absurd “Well, we have to register cars, why not guns?” argument which is lame to begin with in the context of owning an automobile and operating it on private property.
No it doesn’t, because we’re not talking about the use of guns limited to one’s own private property, and because cars, unlike guns, are not designed to kill people.
What is this, false analogy day down at the RNC? You get two for the price of one or something?
Silly me: every day is false analogy day if you’re a Republican.
Christ almighty, 32 people murdered on a college campus. Can’t you jerks give the talking points a rest for just one day?
LMMathews: Have you ever seen an M-14 round fired into a 5 gallon can of water?
Have you ever seen a Nighfire exercize with two M-60 machine guns laying down a crossfire, and every 5th round is tipped with white phosphorus? *
Have you ever fired an M-60 machine gun?
I know exactly what weapons can do, which is why there will never be one in my house.
But do I believe that because weapons can, in the wrong hands, do a lot of damage, that no one should have one?
NO.
* After I saw that crossfire, I reported to the Orderly Room, and respectfully informed them that I would never fire a weapon at another human being, and I demanded to be reassigned from the Infantry.
It didn’t get me out of the Army, it didn’t get me out of being sent to a combat zone. It didn’t even get me excused from carrying a weapon. But I have never owned one, nor will I.
If defending the rights of others to own a weapon, as they are permitted to do under the Second Amendment to the Constitution, is called “running interference” by you, well, OK.
Hey Wilbur, back up a little. I wasn’t the one that brought up the automobile bullshit. Our esteemed host did, so please spare me the sanctimony ok?
Twit.
Now see that’s what I thought. I can see by both your responses that the answer is no. Lucky freakin’ you. And I do mean that.
I was grazed in an accident and it burned like nothing I’ve ever felt before in my life and left a lovely scar. I’d rather have four more kids and another set of kidney stones before I feel that again. You know what that scar is? A mark of someone’s stupidity who just had to have a freakin’ gun – for safety, security, because it was his ‘right’, and all those other bullshit reasons.
I also did a short internship at the city morgue, so I am well aware of what shooting victims look like – inside and out.
Look, I’m not saying take all the guns away. I’m saying take the handguns and the automatics and semi-automatics away. They have no place in a civil society and you damned well know that the intent of the Constitution was not for every person who feels they need to compensate for something or has a touch of paranoid scizophrenia to own one.
In decades past, a 15 year old boy could walk into the country store with two $20 bills and then walk out with a 12 gage shotgun and a box of shells.
People had relatively unlimited access to firearms in those days, and yet mass murders were found only within the realm of serial killers; the only mass “spree” killing in decades took place at the University of Texas in 1966. Why?
Last year, in San Francisco and at the University of North Carolina, lunitics used SUV’s to run down and kill innocent civilians.
Clearly our society has serious problem — it is fostering the notion that killing as many innocent people as possible is the most spectacular way that an individual can rid himself of his problems.
Only an idiot would try to make a direct connection between these mass killings and firearms.
Link for the North Carolina incident, which was lost in my previous comment.
This is one of those “word’s can not express” responses you probably don’t want to read but I need to write.
There are ‘reportedly’ 26,000 acres at Virginia Tech. There are also ‘reportedly’ 26,000 students. It’s about half a mile between the two places where tragedy struck yesterday.
I have pictures of myself at Virginia Tech with my uncle, when he was a student there and also when he graduated. My son has three very close friends who graduated from ‘Tech. There were former Great Bridge High School grads with full scholarships to ‘Tech. He’d often visit them on a routine basis and actually ‘lived’ in the dormrooms with them for days at a time during special evants held on campus. Many of his classmates graduated with honors from ‘Tech. Obviously, I have a special place in my heart for what I lovingly refer to as “VPI”.
What the world doesn’t know or understand is that ‘Tech is bigger, land wise, than Philadelphia and some of it’s suburbs put together. Even with the police force in Blacksburg as well as the Campus Security, they lack the manpower a big city would have had to follow up the possibility of another individual being part of the massacre. If they thought there was more than one ’shooter’ the National Guard would have been called in to help out. Unless, of course, they were too busy in Iraq and couldn’t afford to lose the men to go on a wild goose chase throught the Mountains of the Blue Ridge looking for a non-discript individual who may or may not have been on campus! No, the Administration did the right thing.
The Administration did exactly what any administration would have done under the same circumstances with the information they had first received. The police on both the campus and the surrounding areas, performed their duties as well as they could given the massacre and what must have been “horror” for them at the time.
Even though he was once Dominican, one of the father’s of my son’s friends was a citizen long before he married his wife and their children (who later graduated from ‘Tech)were born. He is a hardworking successful American, as many previous “foreigners” are.
With many people feeling sorrow at this time, it is understandable why they will be in shock and live with this trauma for years. They will demand answers that will never come. Once again, it will be another ’sad’ day for America, forever.
News reporters doing what they call “their job’s” are anxious to point blame on why it took so long to notify students, etc. Even one reporter in another part of the world wrote that this tragedy was “As American as Apple Pie”.
I, on the other hand, believe it is time to close our doors. Literally. No more free handouts to non-Americans on any level, no matter where they come from, how much money they have or under what circumstances they need to seek asylum in America. Somehow underneath it all, lies a common thread, an American thread that foreign nationals never learn until their offspring’s offspring learn what it is all about.
You just don’t go to somebody elses house and disrespect the family. Virginia Tech is one of the finest families I have ever known and if they don’t close their doors to foreign nationals after this I’ll want to know why.
Otherwise, history is repeating itself. What DID we learn from 9-11-2001?
Commentary by Barbara Anne Wood-Post
And the AP just put out that the shooter was a Korean student here on a green card who left behind a “disturbing note”. From ABC – ‘Under Virginia law, state residents can only buy one handgun in any 30 day period, suggesting Cho bought his second weapon after April 13, or sometime over the weekend.’
Do I even need to mention how insanely out of control this whole country is if not only are we arming ourselves with these weapons but apparently in the state of VA even if you aren’t a citizen of the US you can buy a freakin’ gun here???????? But one only every 30 days??????????
JESUS H. CHRIST this almost makes me want to go to church and pray for the freakin’ fate of the nation because damn we are all screwed!!!!!
I can see by both your responses that the answer is no. Lucky freakin’ you. And I do mean that.
Sorry, but you personal experience does not give you a leg up in the debate. There are others who were probably in the same situation that would have the complete opposite opinion of you, so its irrelevant.
They have no place in a civil society and you damned well know that the intent of the Constitution was not for every person who feels they need to compensate for something or has a touch of paranoid scizophrenia to own one.
Oh give me a huge freaking break with that ‘compensation’ and paranoia nonsense. The majority of gun owners use their guns for several reasons:
1. Hunting
2. Target shooting
3. Shooting for fun
Yes, people keep them in their home for defense and yes, many people have used them to protect themselves.
The overwhelming majority of gun owners in this country are law abiding, everyday citizens just like yourself. It’s people like you that crap over any chance at a dialog when you start talking ‘compensation’ and ‘paranoia’ nonsense.
I mean, really. What the hell do you care if some guy takes his 9mm Beretta down to a shooting range from time to time and shoots at targets?
LM: Am I supposed to believe that if I had ever been shot, and held my same views, that that would be OK with you?
That makes me want to LOL out loud…
Because the targets that Baretta were designed for stand upright on two freakin’ legs, speak, and have families that live next door to you, you nunce!
HUNTING MY ASS! Those guns are designed to hunt PEOPLE! Not freakin cute and fuzzy bunnies, moose, turkey, bear, deer, antelope, or elephants – P-E-O-P-L-E !!! It’s like I’m talking to one of my kids here!!!! What moron goes hunting for anything with a damned 9MM? The only time I’ve seen someone take a handgun on a hunting trip was to put the animal out of its misery if they didn’t get a good shot at the get go and even then most won’t use them!!!
And shooting for fun? PLEASE! Where is the ‘fun’ in having something recoil on you so hard you could break your damned wrist? You want target practice chief get a bow and freakin’ arrow and have at it – same thing and it actually requires a Hell of a lot more skill (something I do as well), thanks!
You know what’s real funny about the ass who grazed me? The next year he accidentally shot his damned toes off! I kid you not I couldn’t make this shit up if I tried! How’s that for transendence?!
even if you aren’t a citizen of the US
Calm down, LM!
It’s well known that people residing legally in the United States have virtually all the rights of natural born citizens.
Yes Frank you would, because I’d chalk it up to a complete and total loss, which I’ve done anyway. It’s hard to respect anyone talking about a weapon that kills people like it’s a freakin’ toy and not think that if tables were turned they’d feel differently!
That’s it I’m done for the day. I’m going to blow a gasket. I need to go clean something ….
I wasn’t the one that brought up the automobile bullshit.
You may not have brought up the automobiles, Jay, but you sure brought up the bullshit.
Barbara: I agree with one point you made. It was not the fault of the Police that the shootings took place.
However, there was literally a killer on the loose. The administration of the University is to blame — including the Police — for not taking every step possible to ensure the safety of the students.
They sent eMails! I’m in College. I read my College eMails about once a month. The students could have been sleeping or in those rooms, you know, where the teacher talks, and you write things down, oh, yeah! Classes!
It was not handled properly. I am sure that lawyers were on the phone within minutes of putting 2 and 2 together.
I’m sure the Courts of the Commonwealth of Virginia will agree that the School was criminally negligent — to the tune of millions of dollars.
Frank: “I am sure that lawyers were on the phone within minutes of putting 2 and 2 together.
I’m sure the Courts of the Commonwealth of Virginia will agree that the School was criminally negligent — to the tune of millions of dollars.”
It’ll be just another example of overzealous greedy Volvo-driving latte-sipping liberal puke trial lawyers milking the system for their own personal gain, right Frank? Just like when they try to hold corporations like Eli Lilly responsible for their negligence?
Oh, wait. That’s different.
ND: I wasn’t complaining about the lawyers. You are.
And I don’t care to join the debate with yourself that you seem already to have won.
I’ve been reading this blog for a while, and usually I agree with Mr. Willis. But this time I’m not quite sure we’re on the same page.
Gun control is a very tough topic. I believe a number of things on the left, and some on the right.
Guns should be regulated as they are in many states. A gun cannot be legally sold to anyone with a criminal record, nor can they be sold to someone with a history of violence, which would be on the record anyways. And if it isn’t like this, then it should be.
It should NOT be legal to carry a handgun whilst concealed. To me it makes it too easy for someone to use it for malicious intent, such as this particular incident.
It should be legal to own guns in your own home however. Though some view it as dumb, security is an issue.
Banning guns in their entirety breaks the constitution, and it’s beyond stupid. Illegal gun sales EXIST. Criminals can still get them. And without one at your side, what would you do?
Of course, I live in a small town, and am not of age to own a gun. I would have no reason to own one here, but if I was in a bad part of a town, what then?