This is the world view of Texas governor Rick Perry, former Lieutenant Governor to George W. Bush.
Texas Gov. Rick Perry has drawn criticism from rival candidates for saying he agrees non-Christians are condemned to spend eternity in hell.
Perry was among some 60 mostly Republican candidates for Tuesday’s midterm election attending a Sunday service at San Antonio’s Cornerstone Church, where pastor John Hagee said in his sermon non-Christians were “going straight to hell with a non-stop ticket,” The Dallas Morning News reported.
Afterward, Perry told reporters there was nothing in the sermon he could disagree with, prompting quick condemnations from opponents.
“He doesn’t think very differently from the Taliban, does he?” said independent candidate Kinky Friedman.
No, he doesn’t.
So if he believes that and is open about it, whats the problem. I could care less if you believe I will go to Hell as long as that belief doesn’t carry forward into prejudicial actions in the public arena against me. I mean its his private religious belief. Its his public actions that matter. Why do you guys get so wrapped around the wheel re motive. Motive for anything is completely legal. I have a motive for stealing all the single malt Scotch in theworld. Gonna arrest me for even if I steal nothing.
I could care less if you believe I will go to Hell as long as that belief doesn’t carry forward into prejudicial actions in the public arena against me.
Even though he pre-judges their fate in the afterlife, Rick Perry is probably not prejudiced against non-Christians.
“I have a motive for stealing all the single malt Scotch in theworld.”
I think that explains just about everything …
Wasn’t Perry the gay one?
Texas Gov. Rick Perry has drawn criticism from rival candidates for saying he agrees non-Christians are condemned to spend eternity in hell.
What the duggers don’t understand is that it’s a question of intelligence. Those with an irrational belief in the christianist invisible omnipotent deity base their decisions and policies on dogma (bush, e.g.). The reason why these people whittle away our Constitutional rights is because the Constitution is the third priority, coming after religious fervor and keeping the party in power.
buma,
It matters not ‘why’ he does something as opposed to ‘what’ he does. That goes for anybody. And I don’t buy the presumption behind your intelligence argument. For most, their religious convictions are a matter of faith not rationality. Just as otherwise intelligent progressives have faith ‘Bush lied’, others have faith in their God of choice. And until you or anyone else can explain where the uninverse comes from, or how it began, or can explain the concept of it being here forever in context of what we understand are hard scientific laws (matter can neither be created nor destroyed), then I wouldn’t sneer at any religious person.
Y’see, that’s the problem with “evangelicals”.
Their job is to CARE about the hell-bound people and show them that God’s Love is the way to redemption.
Instead, these hate-mongering hypocrites REVEL in the knowledge that the unclean are going to hell and they GLOAT over it!
They treat Christianity as a sort of gang. They’re in the good gand and everyone else is in the bad gang. You can join the good gang but they’re not out recruiting because they really don’t want anyone else to join. It gives them that oh-so-glorious feeling of self-righteousness and superiorty. Like God is their own personal supernatural enforcer and he’ll punish everyone they don’t like (liberals, gays, brown-people, hell, non-whites in general).
These people disgust me. How can one so full of hate claim to be “of God”?
There’s plenty of evidence that Bush lied, Dugger. Just because interpret it as not “proving” he’s a liar doesn’t mean it’s based on faith. It’s based on the fact that he appears to say things he knows not to be true.
Ooh! Ooh! Can I be Dugger?
Ahem.
No. Bush never lied. No evidence. Not one. No lies. Never. He never ever ever lies. Ever. Because there is no documented evidence. Because I say so. I also do not lie. Ever. No evidence of my lies or those of Bush. Not that there would be. Because he doesn’t lie. Ever. Not once.
Go ahead and take a vacation, Dugger, I got you covered.
Close but no Ceegar, BD. I would not have said “Bush never lied” but that no lies have been proven. As I have said many times (see, I think about this stuff – try it instead of just emoting), I suspect Bush, being human and fallible, has lied. But not moreso than any other average human being and perhaps (only, perhaps) less so since he is born again – as the evangelicals say.
And you know I’m right.
I know you’re something, “right” isn’t a word that comes instantly to mind.
Instead, these hate-mongering hypocrites REVEL in the knowledge that the unclean are going to hell and they GLOAT over it!
Did you hear Hagee’s message? How exactly did you arrive at the conclusion he gloated over it?
And it has nothing to do with being ‘unclean.’ Nor does it have anything to do with race (it’s a rather stupid remark to make about Hagee when one considers that a large portion of his congregation is Black and Hispanic).
Hagee was merely stating in other words what John 14:6 states. I don’t see how that makes Perry like the Taliban.
Frankly, I am not a fan of Hagee. I think he said something stupid about Hurricane Katrina being God’s punishment on the people of New Orleans for something.
I have to agree that this is a silly argument. If he wants to espouse this belief then fine! If he were to force this believe(Constituition amendment damning all non-christians) then yes, there would be something wrong. I find it silly to make a judgement on who is going to heaven and who is not. In my opinion, it only serves the ego of Christians who need a crutch to have strenght in thier beliefs. I would remind my non-christian liberal bretheren that while having these beliefs is not what you believe that it is ok. Religion tends to put people in groups. Hell, being non-christian to a degree can box in what your beliefs are to a degree. Evangelical beliefs are rather ridiculous in my opinion but saying this man is like the Taliban is hyperbolic. The Taliban would as Dugger said actually act on these beliefs. Now if we are talking banning gay marriage because of a belief, that is Taliban like.
less so since he is born again
Timing, Dugger. Don’t try to sell this bill of goods until at least a week after the Haggard mess.
Being born-again doesn’t purify you. It just means you believe you’re purified.
“And until you or anyone else can explain where the uninverse comes from … then I wouldn’t sneer at any religious person.”
Especially religious people who are convinced that other religious people are going to spen an eternity in damnation. Boy, you sure wouldn’t want to sneer at them unless you had ALL the answers.
“Frankly, I am not a fan of Hagee. I think he said something stupid about Hurricane Katrina being God’s punishment on the people of New Orleans for something.”
Um, ya. Apparently he
did:
But don’t sneer at him. He beleives in Jesus. He has ALL the answers.
BD, Never said it purifies anyone. My point would be that ANY deeply religious person, Christian (Born Again), Jew, Muslim whoever, may well and likely does live by a code wherein a conscious lie is an immoral thing. I’m not conferring super morality upon them, merely noting that they may adhere a certain strong code of conduct. That has been generally true of the deeply religious people I know.
“I’m not conferring super morality upon them, merely noting that they may adhere a certain strong code of conduct. That has been generally true of the deeply religious people I know.”
So fucking what? Are we supposed to give them medals or something for doing what everyone is supposed to do/should do anyway?
I’m not conferring super morality upon them, merely noting that they may adhere a certain strong code of conduct. That has been generally true of the deeply religious people I know.
That describes every atheist I know. OTOH, I have never heard an atheist preach for years against something that it later turns out he participates in.
Apparently hypocrisy is limited to the religious.
“I would not have said “Bush never lied” but that no lies have been proven.”
Actually, Dugger, you asserted that liberals base our belief that Bush is a liar on faith. In fact, we base it on clear evidence, regardless of your inane, mindreading proof standard. Typical weasel behavior from dishonorable, bad faith Dugger, though.
Well, shit, I tell you what. If heaven is gonna be full of asshats like that, I don’t want to go anyway.
Jehovahs’ Witness:
on’t you want to go to the Paradise pictured here in this brochure?”
Me: “Well, no, not if it’s full of Jehovahs Witnesses!”
White Whale: The Taliban would as Dugger said actually act on these beliefs. Now if we are talking banning gay marriage because of a belief, that is Taliban like.
How about invading another country because GOD tells you to? Is that Taliban-like? I’d say so. I’m not saying that Hagee is that nuts, but you gotta keep an eye on those evangelical types.
nihilistic_disintegration,
I agree with that assertion. I just don’t want this to become a venting for why some hate religion or faith. I don’t agree with evangelicals AT ALL, but they have a right to thier odd beliefs
WW,
Agreed. The argument shouldn’t be over religion. It should be over keeping religion out of government.
Apparently hypocrisy is limited to the religious.
That’s an absurd statement.
Hypocrisy is not limited to any religion or faith or person.
Sorry about that link in my name!
Dugger | Nov 6, 2006 12:06:44 PM
“I have a motive for stealing all the single malt Scotch in theworld.”
We know, Dugs, we know. You like to steal it and drink it. Explains the incoherent thoughts you spew from your keyboard.
Agree with Jay. Most all of us are hypocritical but I find plenty of hypocrisy within the ‘moral’ , but a-religious political extremes. Rightists on my side who sanctify life and oppose abortion but are pro death penalty and leftists who are against the death penalty but support all forms of abortion.
“leftists who are against the death penalty but support all forms of abortion.”
Not necessarily hypocrasy if they take the view, as I do, that a clump of cells which has not yet developed as much as a brain or nervous system is, clinically and spiritually speaking, the same as a living breathing human being though. Just putting it out there.
And while I do… geh… (glass of rum to take the edge off of agreeing with Dugger) hic… concede your point about personal religious convictions not necessarily mattering, but certainly there is a relevant trend as far as political evangelicals go, namely that it tends to serve as a motive for people to do greivous wrong unto others too much of the time.
You, as you say, have a motive for stealing all the world’s single-malt. You publically state it even. Thing is you dont have means. Someone like (and here I’m pointing out how far I’m stretching here so you dont have to) Bush, who believes that all the brown people on the other side of the world are going to hell and has the means to send them there, is a different issue. I’m not saying we’re in Iraq for the specific purpose of killing brown people so close to Christ’s hometown, but is it any wonder he seems unconcerned about the number of civilian deaths over there? That he treats the mounting death toll as just a “comma?”
rex
But under Saddam, more brown people died. Don’t take my word for it. Do the math from middle of the road web sites and you’ll find that total deaths under Saddam (Kurds, political murders, Iran/Iraq war etc) versus total deaths in Iraq since Saddam was deposed were higher – per annum.
I am not an evnagelical but growing up in the deep south, the ones I knew were much more like Jimmy Carter – we were all ‘brothers’ regardless of our background (but, true, Christian brothers). The real haters (say like McVeigh) weren’t the deeply, evangelical religious – that I saw. But others may have had different experiences.
Duggster,
Exactly how small does the difference in the number of deaths per year have to be for you to stop supporting Bush’s illegal war? What if Saddam killed 2 more people per year than Bush’s illegal war? Is that enough? Would you still support it?
Since your main justification for the war seems to be that fewer people are dying per year (which may or may not be the case) I’d just like to know what the threshold of acceptance is. Are we talking two? Two thousand? Two million? What’s the magic number?
nihilist
First. Both parties supported the war. Its Bush’s war and the bi partisan Congress’ war.
Second. Its legal.
Third. The war is ongoing. I support our engaged forces. Don’t you? You want to talk about why it started – thats different.
The fact that Saddam’s death total per year is higher is only a rejoinder to the exploitation of war deaths on this site by the left. It is not a justification used by the Admin or Congress for the war – to my knowledge.
I have said many times, I probably would not have gone into Iraq in the first place. That does not change the fact that there were more deaths under Saddam. Other than all of the errors and fundamental misconceptions, good post — for you.