Indeed there are.

However, if I compare a bank robber to Clyde Barrow, that doesn’t mean I’m accusing the bank robber of murder.

The FBI says they did it.

In other words, Durbin’s statement is true.

If:
1) I read this to you, and
2) did not tell you it was done by Americans,

you might guess….who was it again?

But that was then. Now “Americans” would probably be most people’s first guess.

Hooray for us.

That’s Dugger world- it’s ok to waterboard. It’s ok to torture. But let’s not TALK about it. That is “morally wrong”.

…someone else. But not Americans. That’s not what we think of ourselves. It’s not what we expect to read about our military.

OK w/that but what about the rest of it. He in effect syas they did it (last sentence) and the it is something that people would think Nazis etc would do. I don’t get how you cana void that, but I won’t belabor it any longer.

I concede with your (non-contextual) criteria criteria that some would have said Nazi. Unfortunately for your argument, there is context; there are allegations versus factual findings; htere is the Holocaust and knolwedge of the overwhelming evils of Nazism and communism; and there are degrees of wrong -doing and misbehaviour.

I won’t convince you. IMO it was intellectually and morally wrong for Durbin to use a Nazi comparator.

…someone else. But not Americans. That’s not what we think of ourselves. It’s not what we expect to read about our military.

Let’s try setting this apart from you and me. Suppose you did a phone survey–before any of this came to light and before all the uproar over Durbin’s remarks.

The survey asks 1,000 people at random: “I’m going to describe to you a situation in which a prisoner in a military prison was abused. The prisoner was subjected to the following treatments: blah, blah, blah.”

“What country’s military do you think is most likely to treat a prisoner in this fashion?”

Is it your contention that few or none of the 1,000 respondents would guess any of the groups Durbin named?

How many of the 1,000 respondents do you think would guess: “That sounds like Americans to me”?

More or fewer than would have guessed Nazis?

Hmm.

‘If I read this to you and did not tell you that it was an FBI agent describing what Americans had done to prisoners in their control, you would most certainly believe this must have been done by Nazis, Soviets in their gulags, or some mad regime–Pol Pot or others–that had no concern for human beings. Sadly, that is not the case. This was the action of Americans in the treatment of their prisoners.”

I’m puzzled.

IE ‘what was done was comparable to what Nazis or Pol Pot etc did.’ Don’t see how you can escape the Nazi comparison. Do you mean he didn’t comapre them to Nazis as people but only their their deeds to Nazi deeds?

Same level of nastiness, idf so.

Again, Dugs, you’re on record as supporting torture so why all the euphemisms and denial here? Why are you so afraid of calling it torture when you, in fact, support torture? Indeed, why, if you support torture, do you have such a problem with calling US troops who practice it torturers?

Again? Shame!

Not just “bad air conditioning,” Dugger. Prolonged, unescapable exposure to temperatures that can bring on hypothermia. Uncontrollable shaking. Loss of bowel and bladder control.

But nothing we should be ashamed of, right?

There was no “Nazi comparison.” And we BOTH know that.

Haw!

Let me help: “If I read this to you, who would you guess did it?”

No one in particular? Very well.

There was once a time when no one would say, “That sounds like the way Americans treat prisoners.”

I’m not sure what your question is. If I heard that (and I assumed it to all be true and I didn’t know some the extenuating circumstances) who would I think of? No one entity specifically. Harsher than usual jailers, I guess. Not Nazis. Not Dachau. Not Pol Pot. Not the killing fields.

And re Dachau you say “Not anymore”. Right? So prior to Gitmo, those things would have conjured up Dachau etc to you? Barking dogs, bad air conditioning = Dachau? Is that the equation? Hope not. When do you get serious and reject the Nazi comparison? It was inappropriate and you know it.

“If I read this to you, who would you guess did it?”

That’s your analogy, “Bubba”, not mine. See September 12, 5:53 p.m.

You ain’t getting no closer Quaker. Rap music, inconsistent air conditioning,
restraint of an obviously violent prisoner. Yeah, the first thing that comes to mind is Dachau.

Not anymore. Now the first thing that comes to mind is: American jailers at Guantanamo.

Makes you proud, don’t it?