Comments on: Not To Pat Myself On The Back Or Anything http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/ Like Kryptonite To Stupid Sat, 11 Feb 2012 06:30:02 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.4 By: Quaker in a Basement http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42712 Quaker in a Basement Wed, 30 Aug 2006 21:13:27 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42712 I guess a clarification is in order. The explanation was for you, Rex. The condescension thing was for Farris. I guess a clarification is in order.

The explanation was for you, Rex.

The condescension thing was for Farris.

]]> By: Nimrod Gently http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42711 Nimrod Gently Wed, 30 Aug 2006 21:10:37 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42711 <blockquote>Unfortunately, you fell for the "the White House purposely leaked the identity of a covert CIA operative for political payback" story and have been pimping that endlessly.</blockquote>Oh, you mean the truth. Not surprised you have an aversion to that.

Unfortunately, you fell for the “the White House purposely leaked the identity of a covert CIA operative for political payback” story and have been pimping that endlessly.

Oh, you mean the truth. Not surprised you have an aversion to that.

]]> By: Rex Mundane http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42710 Rex Mundane Wed, 30 Aug 2006 21:00:31 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42710 Ah, SSCI then...hm, I might be reading this wrong but I'm still not seeing where Wilson lied. The Wiki link offers differences of opinion from both sides on what happened, but quotes Newsday saying Plame may have been involved in nominating her husband for the investigation that Cheney requested by pointing to his connections and experience, but wasnt involved in actually sending him to Niger. The only thing of any marginal substance he found was a former prime minister saying Iraq wanted to "expand commercial relations" which the PM interpreted as meaning Yellowcake... so we have the personal opinion of a former government official of an otherwise innocuous statement (If Walmart wanted to "expand commercial relations" thered be no damn problem) and apparently the CIA didnt think that enough to change the opinion put forth in their assesment "Niger: Sale of Uranium to Iraq is Unlikely" a week previous... And what else is there seems to be differences between personal accounts, not so much actual lies... um... is that it? That all the proof that he lied? Honestly here, what am I missing? Ah, SSCI then…hm, I might be reading this wrong but I’m still not seeing where Wilson lied. The Wiki link offers differences of opinion from both sides on what happened, but quotes Newsday saying Plame may have been involved in nominating her husband for the investigation that Cheney requested by pointing to his connections and experience, but wasnt involved in actually sending him to Niger. The only thing of any marginal substance he found was a former prime minister saying Iraq wanted to “expand commercial relations” which the PM interpreted as meaning Yellowcake… so we have the personal opinion of a former government official of an otherwise innocuous statement (If Walmart wanted to “expand commercial relations” thered be no damn problem) and apparently the CIA didnt think that enough to change the opinion put forth in their assesment “Niger: Sale of Uranium to Iraq is Unlikely” a week previous… And what else is there seems to be differences between personal accounts, not so much actual lies… um… is that it? That all the proof that he lied? Honestly here, what am I missing?

]]> By: Quaker in a Basement http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42709 Quaker in a Basement Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:58:09 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42709 <em>what exactly is the SCSI report? Ive been looking through google trying to find it but no real luck finding someone linking to it. whats it stand for?</em> That's <a href="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22senate+select+committee+on+intelligence%22" rel="nofollow">Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.</a> Condescension loses a little of its bite when you mangle your facts. what exactly is the SCSI report? Ive been looking through google trying to find it but no real luck finding someone linking to it. whats it stand for?

That’s Senate Select Committee on Intelligence. Condescension loses a little of its bite when you mangle your facts.

]]> By: SaveFarris http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42708 SaveFarris Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:29:20 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42708 <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_C._Wilson#The_Senate_Intelligence_Committee_Report" rel="nofollow">Select Committe on Senate Intelligence</a> Sorry. Hang around <a href="http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/" rel="nofollow">Tom Maguire</a>'s place too much and you assume that people are up-to-date on the Plame story. Given that most folks get their info from the MSM, that's a perrilous assumption, I know. Select Committe on Senate Intelligence

Sorry. Hang around Tom Maguire‘s place too much and you assume that people are up-to-date on the Plame story. Given that most folks get their info from the MSM, that’s a perrilous assumption, I know.

]]> By: Rex Mundane http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42707 Rex Mundane Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:11:41 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42707 ...yeah, dickweed, she was working undercover to investigate the CIA office pool, certainly not as a private energy expert working on nuclear proliferation, and certainly not for years before, and the revealation of her true position doesnt compromise current, future, and past work of hers. Jesus Halibut Christ do you have to go to a special school to get that ignorant? Is it like a special skill youve honed after ages of practice passed down from master to teacher since time immemorial? But yeah though, Plame was just some office schmuck, a little receptionist who has no importance except playint the pivotal role of malicious co-conspirator in suggesting the true fact that Saddam wasnt really getting any Uranium from Niger, and so was practically asking to be exposed and have her covert career ended, meaning that nothing important happened which absolutely warranted the secrecy about it, and sure Libby perjured himself over a non issue, ending his career too. And the fact that all this happened is proof that nothing happened at all. Holy living fsck its brilliant! ...and speaking of words that are also acronyms for computer terms, what exactly is the SCSI report? Ive been looking through google trying to find it but no real luck finding someone linking to it. whats it stand for? …yeah, dickweed, she was working undercover to investigate the CIA office pool, certainly not as a private energy expert working on nuclear proliferation, and certainly not for years before, and the revealation of her true position doesnt compromise current, future, and past work of hers. Jesus Halibut Christ do you have to go to a special school to get that ignorant? Is it like a special skill youve honed after ages of practice passed down from master to teacher since time immemorial?
But yeah though, Plame was just some office schmuck, a little receptionist who has no importance except playint the pivotal role of malicious co-conspirator in suggesting the true fact that Saddam wasnt really getting any Uranium from Niger, and so was practically asking to be exposed and have her covert career ended, meaning that nothing important happened which absolutely warranted the secrecy about it, and sure Libby perjured himself over a non issue, ending his career too. And the fact that all this happened is proof that nothing happened at all. Holy living fsck its brilliant!
…and speaking of words that are also acronyms for computer terms, what exactly is the SCSI report? Ive been looking through google trying to find it but no real luck finding someone linking to it. whats it stand for?

]]> By: Duros62 http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42706 Duros62 Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:00:03 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42706 <i>He didn't have any political bones to pick. </i> Then why leak it? Unless maybe he was asked to? <i>The fact that Plame worked at a desk for the previous 5 years negated her status as a "covert" operative.</i> How does that work, exactly? If I don't drive my car for 5 years, does that negate my license (obviously, yes if it expires. Let's assume for the moment it doesn't expire)? He didn’t have any political bones to pick.

Then why leak it? Unless maybe he was asked to?

The fact that Plame worked at a desk for the previous 5 years negated her status as a “covert” operative.
How does that work, exactly? If I don’t drive my car for 5 years, does that negate my license (obviously, yes if it expires. Let’s assume for the moment it doesn’t expire)?

]]> By: SaveFarris http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42705 SaveFarris Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:38:03 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42705 If Plame was on an "undercover operation", then she had the worst possible cover story: desk jockey at the CIA! As for Mr. Wilson's truthiness, the SCSI report pretty much put an end to that. If Plame was on an “undercover operation”, then she had the worst possible cover story: desk jockey at the CIA!

As for Mr. Wilson’s truthiness, the SCSI report pretty much put an end to that.

]]> By: Oliver Willis http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42704 Oliver Willis Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:28:49 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42704 And yet, Scooter Libby still chose to lie under oath. And yet, Scooter Libby still chose to lie under oath.

]]> By: Jay http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42703 Jay Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:24:55 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42703 <i>But I really find it amazing that perjury has gone from a deep threat to the very foundation of our judiciary meriting impeachment (when Clinton lied about a private consensual sexual affair), to a "ridiculous" nothing that ought to be dismissed out of hand when used to mislead the investigation of the leaking of a covert CIA operative.</i> Who dismissed it out of hand? The fact is, there was accusation after accusation after accusation that Dick Cheney, Karl Rove and others purposely blew the cover of a covert CIA operative in order to settle a political score. The words 'treason' and 'traitor' were being tossed around. And what comes of it? A perjury charge against Libby about what he told the media? <i>What exactly did Wilson lie about?</i> Oh please. Wilson lied to the Washington Post and he flat out lied about what he wrote in his report regarding Iraq attempting to purchase uranium in Africa. And he lied about his wife having nothing to do with sending him when she repeatedly lobbied for him to go. Try and do a little reading. It was in all the papers. <i>Not to be a stickler or anything, but isn't revealing the identity of a CIA agent still illegal in this country?</i> In order for somebody to have violated the law, they had to know that Plame's status was covert. All evidence suggests that Armitage didn't know. He didn't have any political bones to pick. The fact that Plame worked at a desk for the previous 5 years negated her status as a "covert" operative. Why can't all of you just admit that this was much ado about nothing and that all of the frothing and drum beating about treason and such was overblow. But I really find it amazing that perjury has gone from a deep threat to the very foundation of our judiciary meriting impeachment (when Clinton lied about a private consensual sexual affair), to a “ridiculous” nothing that ought to be dismissed out of hand when used to mislead the investigation of the leaking of a covert CIA operative.

Who dismissed it out of hand? The fact is, there was accusation after accusation after accusation that Dick Cheney, Karl Rove and others purposely blew the cover of a covert CIA operative in order to settle a political score. The words ‘treason’ and ‘traitor’ were being tossed around. And what comes of it? A perjury charge against Libby about what he told the media?

What exactly did Wilson lie about?

Oh please. Wilson lied to the Washington Post and he flat out lied about what he wrote in his report regarding Iraq attempting to purchase uranium in Africa. And he lied about his wife having nothing to do with sending him when she repeatedly lobbied for him to go. Try and do a little reading. It was in all the papers.

Not to be a stickler or anything, but isn’t revealing the identity of a CIA agent still illegal in this country?

In order for somebody to have violated the law, they had to know that Plame’s status was covert. All evidence suggests that Armitage didn’t know. He didn’t have any political bones to pick. The fact that Plame worked at a desk for the previous 5 years negated her status as a “covert” operative.

Why can’t all of you just admit that this was much ado about nothing and that all of the frothing and drum beating about treason and such was overblow.

]]> By: Duros62 http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42702 Duros62 Wed, 30 Aug 2006 18:39:09 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42702 <i>Duros, depends on the agent. Is it a crime to reveal that Michael Hayden works at the CIA?</i> Depends on the agent. Ok, so Valerie Plame/Wilson was working in an undercover operation in the Middle East. That's what I'm talking about and you know it. <i> What exactly did Wilson lie about? Well, about what he found in Africa, for one.</i> Wait, was he lying about what he found? I.e., no truth to the rumors of Saddam buying Yellowcake? Or was he telling the truth aobut what he <b>didn't</b> find? I.e., evidence to support US claims that Saddam was buying Yellowcake? I'm confused now. Duros,
depends on the agent. Is it a crime to reveal that Michael Hayden works at the CIA?

Depends on the agent. Ok, so Valerie Plame/Wilson was working in an undercover operation in the Middle East. That’s what I’m talking about and you know it.

What exactly did Wilson lie about?

Well, about what he found in Africa, for one.

Wait, was he lying about what he found? I.e., no truth to the rumors of Saddam buying Yellowcake? Or was he telling the truth aobut what he didn’t find? I.e., evidence to support US claims that Saddam was buying Yellowcake?
I’m confused now.

]]> By: Rex Mundane http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42701 Rex Mundane Wed, 30 Aug 2006 18:20:47 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42701 christlikepullingteethwiththisnimrod... And what, oh wise and venerable Farris, did he lie about finding? As I understand it the Senate Prewar Intel Report found that Wilson found nothing to bolster the claim that the CIA found shaky at the time, namely that Saddam was seeking Uranium from Niger, which even if true they werent in much of a position to provide, he may as well have sought it from a box of Fruit Loops. Anyway, CIA thought the yellow cake claim was shaky, wilson went, CIA says he provided no new information to change their opinion on the matter. Where exactly is the lie? And if this was "For one..." please let us know what "For two" might be. Thank you. christlikepullingteethwiththisnimrod… And what, oh wise and venerable Farris, did he lie about finding? As I understand it the Senate Prewar Intel Report found that Wilson found nothing to bolster the claim that the CIA found shaky at the time, namely that Saddam was seeking Uranium from Niger, which even if true they werent in much of a position to provide, he may as well have sought it from a box of Fruit Loops. Anyway, CIA thought the yellow cake claim was shaky, wilson went, CIA says he provided no new information to change their opinion on the matter. Where exactly is the lie? And if this was “For one…” please let us know what “For two” might be. Thank you.

]]> By: SaveFarris http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42700 SaveFarris Wed, 30 Aug 2006 18:02:46 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42700 Duros, depends on the agent. Is it a crime to reveal that Michael Hayden works at the CIA? <blockquote>What exactly did Wilson lie about?</blockquote> Well, about what he found in Africa, for one... Duros,
depends on the agent. Is it a crime to reveal that Michael Hayden works at the CIA?

What exactly did Wilson lie about?

Well, about what he found in Africa, for one…

]]> By: factcheck http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42699 factcheck Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:35:57 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42699 There's that pre-9/11 thinking again Duros. How can you expect the president to defend us against terrorists when he doesn't have the tools to retailiate against someone questioning the rush to war? There’s that pre-9/11 thinking again Duros. How can you expect the president to defend us against terrorists when he doesn’t have the tools to retailiate against someone questioning the rush to war?

]]> By: Duros62 http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42698 Duros62 Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:34:21 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42698 Not to be a stickler or anything, but isn't revealing the identity of a CIA agent still illegal in this country? Not to be a stickler or anything, but isn’t revealing the identity of a CIA agent still illegal in this country?

]]> By: factcheck http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42697 factcheck Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:33:22 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42697 "Joe Wilson lied his rear end off." Well, see, Webster's has a problem with that. Do you know he was lying? Or was he just mistaken? How can you possibly know if he was lying until you see into his head at the time? Are you a mind reader? “Joe Wilson lied his rear end off.”

Well, see, Webster’s has a problem with that. Do you know he was lying? Or was he just mistaken? How can you possibly know if he was lying until you see into his head at the time? Are you a mind reader?

]]> By: Rex Mundane http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42696 Rex Mundane Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:28:24 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42696 What exactly did Wilson lie about? He had perfectly good reason to suspect Rove of being behind it, but never said he saw him do it or anything, and Armitage is certainly a high ranking administration official, is he not? And of course youre not dense enough to think the perjury charge is going to be the only one, the case being, as I still understand it, still ongoing given this new information, and Plame herself considering filing a civil suit against Armitage. I mean what exactly makes this a non-issue? Administration official commits blows the cover of an active CIA agent, damaging her effectiveness in her operations. You dont seriously expect me to believe that if the exact same shit happened under Clinton that you wouldnt be frothing at the mouth, do you? Puh-lease yourself, dickweed. What exactly did Wilson lie about? He had perfectly good reason to suspect Rove of being behind it, but never said he saw him do it or anything, and Armitage is certainly a high ranking administration official, is he not? And of course youre not dense enough to think the perjury charge is going to be the only one, the case being, as I still understand it, still ongoing given this new information, and Plame herself considering filing a civil suit against Armitage. I mean what exactly makes this a non-issue? Administration official commits blows the cover of an active CIA agent, damaging her effectiveness in her operations. You dont seriously expect me to believe that if the exact same shit happened under Clinton that you wouldnt be frothing at the mouth, do you? Puh-lease yourself, dickweed.

]]> By: Rheinhard http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42695 Rheinhard Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:21:31 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42695 I think there's more to it that "just" a perjury charge since it's well known that Rove went on about "Wilson's wife" etc. I'm looking forward to what internal memos will be turned out if the civil suit isn't quashed. But I really find it amazing that perjury has gone from a deep threat to the very foundation of our judiciary meriting impeachment (when Clinton lied about a private consensual sexual affair), to a "ridiculous" nothing that ought to be dismissed out of hand when used to mislead the investigation of the leaking of a covert CIA operative. I think there’s more to it that “just” a perjury charge since it’s well known that Rove went on about “Wilson’s wife” etc. I’m looking forward to what internal memos will be turned out if the civil suit isn’t quashed.

But I really find it amazing that perjury has gone from a deep threat to the very foundation of our judiciary meriting impeachment (when Clinton lied about a private consensual sexual affair), to a “ridiculous” nothing that ought to be dismissed out of hand when used to mislead the investigation of the leaking of a covert CIA operative.

]]> By: Jay http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42694 Jay Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:01:57 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42694 Oliver, stop it. You've been beating the drum that Dick Cheney, Karl Rove and others deliberately outed Plame in an effort top 'smear' Joe Wilson. We now that was all a bunch of CRAP. Joe Wilson lied his rear end off. It was Richard Armitage who leaked Plame's name, and now all your left with is a ridiculous perjury charge against Scooter Libby? Puh-lease. Oliver, stop it. You’ve been beating the drum that Dick Cheney, Karl Rove and others deliberately outed Plame in an effort top ‘smear’ Joe Wilson.

We now that was all a bunch of CRAP. Joe Wilson lied his rear end off. It was Richard Armitage who leaked Plame’s name, and now all your left with is a ridiculous perjury charge against Scooter Libby?

Puh-lease.

]]> By: Oliver Willis http://www.oliverwillis.com/2006/08/30/not-to-pat-myself-on-the-back-or-anything/#comment-42693 Oliver Willis Wed, 30 Aug 2006 16:34:00 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=2622#comment-42693 Yeah, unless you spell "nothing" like <a href="http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/10/28/leak.probe/index.html" rel="nofollow">"perjury"</a>. Yeah, unless you spell “nothing” like “perjury”.

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