Through bipartisan majorities in both the House and the Senate, funding for life-saving stem cell research has been approved. The president, a slave to the regressive religious right, is going to kill it.
The Senate today approved legislation that would expand federal funding of embryonic stem cell research, a measure President Bush has vowed to veto as soon as it reaches his desk.
The veto, expected tomorrow, would be the first of Bush’s 5 1/2-year presidency.
There are two uses for these cells:
1. Throw them away down the drain
2. Use them to save possibly hundreds of thousands of human lives
The president and the con movement has chosen the latter, simply to boost their own inflated egos.
We must have a government that respects the will of the people and infuses scientist with the funds they need to save human lives.
Claire McCaskill supports stem cell research. Jim Talent does not.
Ben Cardin supports stem cell research, as does Kweisi Mfume. Michael Steele refuses to reveal his position.
Nick Lampson supports stem cell research. His opponents do not.
Jon Tester supports stem cell research. Conrad Burns supports a party that does not.
The Democratic Party supports the progressive life-saving process of stem cell research. The Republican party would prefer for those afflicted with maladies that could be cured by stem cell research to suffer and die.
This bears repeating:
“Bush is not preventing a single researcher from doing a single thing. All that is being done here is saying whether or not federal funds will be spent on it. There are no restrictions on privately-funded research.
Oliver, maybe you should look up “ignorance” in the dictionary some time.
As for “death”, anyone who is a card-carrying member of a political party that has been in bed with groups who urge the abortion of as many healthy babies as possible should be ashamed to accuse the other side of promoting “death.”
Think about it.
First of all, let me say that I disagree with Bush on this. I think (partly for selfish reasons) that stem cell research is ethical and needed.
That being said, Bush is not preventing a single researcher from doing a single thing. All that is being done here is saying whether or not federal funds will be spent on it. There are no restrictions on privately-funded research.
There are people who have sincere moral objections to this research, and as such this is an important debate to be having. The argument I find most respectable is when they draw a parallel to Christian Scientists who refuse blood transfusions, seeing a too-close resemblance to cannibalism (living through the “consuming” of another human being).
As I said, I reject those arguments. But I not disparage the sincerity of the other side.
J.
Senate Poised To Pass Stem Cell Bill…
A bill that would authorize federal funding for embryonic stem cell research was headed toward passa…
Mike,
I wouldn’t go there. It is Tom Delay who condones forced abortions in Saipan.
The Republican culture of ignorance? Wow…like shooting fish in a barrell.
Jay Tea’s mental masturbation:
>> Bush is not preventing a single researcher from doing a single thing. All that is being done here is saying whether or not federal funds will be spent on it. There are no restrictions on privately-funded research.
Uh…gee, Jay Pea Brain? If private industry is only funding about 20% of all of the basic research going on at our Universities and Colleges these days, who else is going to fund basic biomedical research?
Here’s a URL that has a small chance of making those synapses between your flatulent brain cells fire:
http://www.aaas.org/spp/rd/guiuniv.htm
Nobody gets hurt?
Oh..to hell with those 80 or so Nobel Prize Winners that were federally funded in the past.
Man, you people have not the slightest concept of what’s real. Dumb as the day is long.
JK
The president and the con movement has chosen the latter, simply to boost their own inflated egos.
I think you meant “former”. Otherwise, you would have no problem.
Thus explaining AirAmerica’s “success”.
Funny. Whenever a Conservative says that about Flag Burning, Gay Marriage, School Choice, the Pledge of Allegiance, or Parental Notification, Dems pooh-pooh “the will of the people”.
JayTea: Like many other things where there is no immediate profit motive, it requires federal funds to find the upside (there was no profit in going to the moon, for instance). The religious extremists can object to it all they want, but their narrow idealogical zeal is not a substitute for democracy.
Mike: there’s no party urging that straw man so sell it elsewhere.
Unfortunately, due to the ban on federally funded research, scientists cannot mix privately funded experiments with those funded by governmental grants; therefore, if a scientist wants to use privately funded resources on stem cell research, they have to get an entirely different workstation down to the electricity and other utilities. Many times that is not feasible to do.
NPR had a great piece (short one) on the restrictions of stem cell research the other day which is a good listen. I know I learned a bit more about the subject then I had known before I listened.
OW, doesn’t happen too often, but I agree with you on this one.
“The argument I find most respectable is when they draw a parallel to Christian Scientists who refuse blood transfusions, seeing a too-close resemblance to cannibalism.”
Um, are you sure it’s Christian Scientists you’re talking about Jay? They pretty much restrict all medical procedures so it’s hard to see why they’d need a specific reason to abhor blood transfusions. You may be thinking of the Jehovah’s Witnesses
Ya, I totally respect that. I mean how could you not? They’re so sincere.
I agree we should have stem cell research, embryonic or not. But just to call bullshit on your yellow journalism…wasn’t it the eviiiillllll republican congress that just passed this little bit of law onto the president?
Yea, I thought so.
So basically, SaveFarris, you’re saying that politicians of all varieties vote against popular ideas. Who woulda thunk it?
I do agree with you to some extent, people in general still aren’t in favor of expanding marriage to same-sex partners. I still think they are wrong, and if that puts me in the minority, so be it. I’ve been on the unpopular side of issues before.
Nope.
The original House bill was carried by Diana DeGette (D-Colo). Republicans split on the bill, with a sufficient number showing the good sense to join up with the Dems who brought this to the floor.
Thought what – that members of your party are opposed to the will of the majority of Americans or would rather pander to the so-called religious right?
To protect what?
Meanwhile the rest of the world watches in utter amazement at the apparent ignorance of the American people who appear incapable of preventing such idiocy in their own government. Bush, while apparently wringing his hands over the fate of cells in a petre dish, appears complacent to the deaths of hundreds of children from his own military actions in Iraq, dismissing them as, while regrettable, mere collateral damage. War is hell you know.
This only proves that, as someone once said, the Flat Earth Society is still alive and well in Washington DC.
“& wasn t it the eviiiillllll republican congress that just passed this little bit of law onto the president?”
The eviiillllll republican congress does one thing right and Bush uses his first veto to kill it. Ya, pedro. Awesome.
Dang… I hate it when frame’s right. Thank heavens it’s so damned rare.
As an agnostic, I tend to blur the distinctions between the various Christian denominations. The Christian Scientists have their own issues with medical science, as I recall, but it’s the Jehovah’s Witnesses that are the ones who eschew blood transfusions.
J.
Two words: Ralph Reed.
Two more words: Abramoff casualty.
Three more words: More to come.
Four words:
Jihad Cynthia McKinney RunOff!!!!
If private industry is only funding about 20% of all of the basic research going on at our Universities and Colleges these days, who else is going to fund basic biomedical research?
What does that have to do with anything? What JT said still stands. There are no restrictions on privately funded research.
I disagree with Bush on this issue as well, but once again we get a look into the mindset of liberals who live under the delusion that unless the government is involved and doling out the cash, we’re all doomed.
While I totally disagree with the beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses, I do not have a problem with them sacrificing their own lives for their beliefs. But I do have a problem with those who would turn their personal religious beliefs into governmental policy and force it down the throats of everyone else.
“Dang& I hate it when frame s right. Thank heavens it s so damned rare.”
Are you fucking kidding me? Jay, you’re wrong almost everytime you throw up a post. Jury rigged? Christian’s don’t commit female genital mutilation? The Geneva Conventions authorize summary executions? Any of this ring a bell? What an ass.
Jay (JayC..the smarter one),
You’re missing the point.
Reality: A lot of the major breakthroughs that happen in biomedical research, BEGIN, in Universities, Colleges and Hospitals that run experiments, and clincial trials.
While private industry *does* work with Universities, for example, it would be highly unreasonable to expect that in the abscence of *additional* federal funding, they’d pick up the slack. In fact, that may not even be advisable, since we don’t want our Universities and hospitals to be mini-corporations beholden to private industry.
That was my point. Nothing more. I know of what I speak on this particular topic.
JK
Typical neocon response, blame liberals when dear leader does something stupid, unpopular or that they don’t agree with.
Finally, something I can agree with most of the lunatics around here: Ralph Reed taking another step towards his well-deserved oblivion.
J.
JK, I understand where you’re coming from. But the fact remains is that people like Oliver are framing this in a way that makes it appear as though Bush’s veto would put an end to funding of stem cell research, when all it would is keep the limits where it is currently. That’s a far cry from Oliver’s idiotic title regarding the embrace of ignorance and death.
Typical neocon response, blame liberals when dear leader does something stupid, unpopular or that they don t agree with.
Huh? Who blamed liberals for anything? I was just commenting on their penchant for thinking that unless the feds are handing out checks, doom and gloom is on the horizon. Oliver says the following:
We must have a government that respects the will of the people and infuses scientist with the funds they need to save human lives.
If he’s so concerned about saving lives, why doesn’t he and everybody else in here so concerned about it, get off their asses and look for ways to raise more money in the private sector for this research? That won’t happen. Why? Because it’s easier to hope that Uncle Sam will suck it out of the paychecks of everybody so they can sit back and congratulate themselves on how wonderful they are because of the position they have on the issue. Or in the case of a veto, lament how much Bush embraces “the culture of ignorance and death.” You see, Oliver cares. He must care. He supports that expansion of federal funding. Those opposed just want to see people suffer and die. They must. Because they’re opposed to the expanded federal funding.
Oliver and his ilk are also not as interested in doing the hard work necessary to “save human lives”. Tell you what OW….you matriculate in a nice molecular biology Phd, and then apply to George Soros for a big,fat research grant. Soros, by himself, could fund a tremendous lab just for embryonic stem cell research and be a big hero!
Sounds crazy you say? Can never happen…?
Uh, not exactly….
http://foundationcenter.org/pnd/news/story.jhtml;jsessionid=XIVDWHLW40C3DTQRSI4CGXD5AAAACI2F?id=150200016
PS Quote from pedro’s link
Should be:
“Now if you want to try to explain why it s morally okay to spend STATE money on stem cell research but immoral to spend federal money, well, have at it.”
You guys just get stupider everyday:
Prop 71 creates a $3 billion fund in California to support research into stem cells. That’s government money being used to stimulate research. But not just research, also private investment in stem cell technology. Do you think that Gross would have donated the $8 million if it was just his money alone? $8 million does not a medical facility build. I’ll bet dollars to donuts that the gift was prompted, in part, because Gross knew his money would be matched by state funds. That’s the value of federal funding of scientific research. It encourages more private contributions in addition to advancing research directly.
wait a second…..
State money isn’t federal is it Paulie?
Bush Vetoes Cancer…
As he promised he would do, President Bush vetoed a bill that would have lifted restrictions on federally funded human embryonic stem cell research: “This bill would support the taking of innocent human life in the hope of finding medical……
Nice out, pedro. The point is that whether the money is coming from a state government of the federal government it’s important seed money to stimulare other, private contributions. Now if you want to try to explain why it’s morally okay to spend money on stem cell research but immoral to spend federal money, well, have at it.
“America is going to be a much better place the day the liberals have as much respect for their fellow citizens opinions as they do for say, the muslims in the middle east, or terrorists anywhere& .”
Oh and once again, nice out. Whenever you get backed into a corner by your idiocy it’s always “liberals love terrorists” exit stage right. What a clown.
I don’t think either are immoral…but some of your countrymen do. So, as a good republican I say …”yeah, states rights”, if the people of california want to fund it…great! The people of north dakota may not want to, ok?
America is going to be a much better place the day the liberals have as much respect for their fellow citizens opinions as they do for say, the muslims in the middle east, or terrorists anywhere….
“The people of north dakota may not want to, ok?”
Pedro, it passed both the House and the Senate. Is that not enough representative democracy for you?
Too bad they could not scrape up four more votes to override.
I disagree with it too paul.
but what difference does it matter whether the research money comes from the feds or from the states? My point is that I am glad that the state came through with some sheckels for the research, since it appears that the feds won’t. You seem to think it is some sort of a crime?
sorry, I was backed into what corner?
You know paul, you screech that the consitution is being befouled everytime the president uses his constitutional authority. Do you believe in the constitution or not?
The president has the right to veto. The president isn’t elected by popular vote. It’s just the way it is.
You don’t like it?
I hear the “Saskatchewan Plains Reader” is looking for someone to do movies reviews of the 14 Beta tapes they have at the local Quick-E-Mart…why not scurry on up their and get a visa…..
You know there’s no difference between state and federal funding when it comes to encouraging private investment in the form of matching funds so you shifted your argument to the “state’s rights” thing. Of course, that might work if there was some kind of court order — ala abortion — but it kind of loses it’s punch when both houses of Congress approved the bill. But since you alos knew that was a non-starter you threw i the “liberals love terrorists”gambit. Nice. Now you’re latest fit of idiocy is a suggestion that I was attacking the president’s right to veto a bill. Far from it. I simply disagree with his use of it in this instance, especially since a majority of Americans support federal funding of stem cell research.
Keep dancing pedro, keep dancing.
“My point is that I am glad that the state came through with some sheckels for the research, since it appears that the feds won t.”
You were glad the sate came through? The state? Could you explain this nonsesense then:
“Tell you what OW& .you matriculate in a nice molecular biology Phd, and then apply to George Soros for a big,fat research grant. Soros, by himself, could fund a tremendous lab just for embryonic stem cell research and be a big hero!”
I just noticed…Pedro apparently does not know the difference between a “gift,” and a “grant.”
He’s yappin that OW should go to Soros and “apply for a grant,” and then points to a press release on a $10M “gift” to Irvine, as “evidence” that it “can happen.”
Hey..cupcake…do a Google on “Gift vs. Grant.”
LOL. Good stuff.
JK
To Jay C: I believe Bush’s veto also prohibits research on additional cell lines. So this isn’t just about additional federal dollars.
To Pedro: For a supposed “Dr.,” you have a profoundly incorrect, if not ignorant, view of how biomedical research is done in this country.
Do you know what’s absolutely disingenous, Pedro, about your argument? Non-Academic, Non-Profit sources account for about 3% of total U.S. R&D, yet you boast that researchers could run right out to their local philanthropist, and fund their labs!! Problem solved!
The below links are for people that actually want to learn a bit about this issue, and probably won’t benefit the Bush Butt-Humping Crowd:
http://www.rdmag.com/default.aspx
(The archives of R&D magazine make for some interesting reading.)
For the big picture on *federal* funding of R&D, go here:
http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/infbrief/nsf06300/
JK
holy crap….I guess when your ears get pinned back the liberals start picking nits…
Do any of you actually have a valid point?
OOOh..only 3% is private? Maybe that needs to change if the research is so valid?
I have had grants for my research, I have written and used them. They work. But if embryonic stem cells are going to be such a big deal, why don’t we see people investing in their research like we did with other biotech?