Just as World War II led to a fundamental reorganization of our national defense structure and to the creation of the National Security Council, so has September 11th made possible sweeping changes in the ways we protect our homeland.

Dr. Condoleezza Rice’s Opening Remarks to Commission on Terrorist Attacks

“It seems to me that a massive world conflagration caused by one country invading or bombing another is less likely than one caused by; a complex system of competing alliances, a combination of hubris and stupidity, and one ill-timed assassination.”

But I say: Great War. Mobilization means war. Russia mobilized first. Therefore..

Dugger, Established Answers the Kriegschuldfrage

OK, what the heck? Roll the dice.

http://tinyurl.com/rmkhx

I was referring to the “ill – timed” assassination of Ngo Dinh Diem, who was such a fervent anti – communist — and a Catholic, to boot — that he frightened the eggheads in the Kennedy administration. They gave the go – ahead to his assassination a week or so before Kennedy’s assassination in Nov 1963.

Unlike you, I don’t need to be a condescending jerk about it.

Funny, Colorado, that pretty much describes 1963, but it didn t end up in a World War.

hmmmm. I wonder what would history be like if Oswald had managed to shoot Kennedy in October of 62 and not November of ’63?

Perhaps you missed the meaning of the adjective ill-timed.

I was of course, as anyone with brains knows, refering to June 28, 1914.

Look it up why don’t you? It’s a date that changed the world.

The mistake was electing the guy who put us in Iraq.

Oh..wait, that’s right…he wasn’t elected.

Or, is that two mistakes?

I don’t know.

JK

The United States was never a normal country you dolt! Perhaps you forget that this country has been in an almost perpetual state of war since it s founding.

William I hate to break it to you but humanity has been in what you would describe as a perpetual state of warfare since the dawn of history.

Sadly the US, even taking into account the genocide of the natives and the enslavement of Africans, has been one of the lesser militaristic nations over the course of of its life. I am neither excusing nor disavowing our own sins I’m just saying their is as bad or worse out there.

If only we had intervened in the Rhinleand (sic) in the thirties.

I find it interesting that so many people can claim to have learned the “lessons of WWII” without acknowledging the lessons of WWI.

It seems to me that a massive world conflagration caused by one country invading or bombing another is less likely than one caused by; a complex system of competing alliances, a combination of hubris and stupidity, and one ill-timed assassination.

I don’t now, nor then believe the war was an absolute necessity and thus I probably would not have done it. But I acknowledge that the war supporters can and did have good motivations and that they yet may be proven right or wrong. Right now, they are looking alittle better. I want to see if Iraqi forces can take over and maintain relative stability.

If you are able to see beyond the name calling on this type of thing, do you think a president should never put troops in harms way unless there is a direct threat to our physical territory – say to repel an invasion? I don’t believe that – but some believe in no prevention. If only we had intervened in the Rhinleand in the thirties.

Dugger

Yes.

Dugger (dammit)

Talk to frame. Maybe he can get you a two for one deal in that reading comprehension.

Or better yet, go take some target practice, since you just tried to shoot fish in barrell and missed.

Wait a minute. How do you know that? Could that be because you’re observing my words and actions and making a calculated guess as to how I see the world?

LOL. Like shooting fish in a barrell.

JK

While Harding was corrupt and Tea Pot dome scandalous it doesn’t resonate through the decades. Hell by the ’30s it didn’t matter.

Bush’s deficit we will be paying off for generations. And it will take at least as long to regain our reputation in the international community if we ever do.

55,000 dead Americans for no reason in Southeast Asia likewise beats a scandal.

Reagan’s funding and training of Bin Laden and support of fundametalist islam in Afghanistan is obviously something we are paying for now.

Nixon set the example of the imperial presidency.

Had Eisenhower not overthrown the Shah and had we not supported a bloodthirsty dictator for 25 years there would not be an Islamic Republic in Iran today. The entire, “any enemy of the Soviet Union, no matter how bloodthirsty, is our ally” mindset has backfired on us now that there is no Soviet Union. I probably should move Ike in front of Dick for that reason alone.

And the Depression and WWII are the two crucibles which defined America for the rest of the 20th Century.

But such a “theory” is about all that its supporters have left. Some of us who opposed this war from the beginning, including many conservatives, feel that this uneccessary action, that has resulted in the death of over 2400 Americans and thousands of Iraqi civilians cannot be remotely justified, except in our own defense or one of our allies, period. Unless one believes in trying to overthrow every dictator or government in the world, that does not agree with us, regardless of whether or not the present an actual threat, (i.e. “nation building”).