In regard to family members, I meant a way to entice illegal immigrants here on their own to turn themselves in.

Illegal immigrant nannies enable women to work even while raising young children. Illegal immigrants serve us food when we’re too busy/lazy to cook, and they make suburban yards look really nice. Whose quality of life is increasing?

“Americans are currently doing the jobs that Americans allegedly don t want, at least in areas where labor arbitrage has not driven them out of the marketplace.”

Again, point me to the displaced, now-unemployed Americans. Where are they? Why are they not part of an exploding unemployed sector?

“This is not a civil rights issue, where noble people went to prison furthering the fight for freedom.”

It was illegal for black people in Alabama to refuse to give up front bus seats to white people. They were arrested for violating criminal laws. They were criminals. Today, we see them as heroes.

Wait, wha..? You make money off of this? Dude, nice gig.

I have an answer. It would solve at least 2 problems at once. Hear me out.
Problem: We have an immigration problem of people crossing the mexican border in record numbers every day.
Problem: We don’t have enough border guards to stop them form crossing.
How about this?
Instead of deporting the illegal aliens we catch, we give them jobs as border guards? Who better to know where illegals will cross the border?
They can work off the fine for entering the country illegally, apply for a green card, and contribute to Social Security at the same time!
It’s kind of like giving thieves jobs as security consultants (re: Catch Me If You Can).

Our inability to stop illegal immigration, at least on the massive scale we see today, is not a given. A lack of desire to stop is a given, but they are not the same thing.

Oliver’s view is one that I share. And the “labor need” argument is simply a way to dodge the question. Americans are currently doing the jobs that Americans allegedly don’t want, at least in areas where labor arbitrage has not driven them out of the marketplace. But the bottom line is that illegal immigration is illegal. This is not a civil rights issue, where noble people went to prison furthering the fight for freedom. This is about people wanting better jobs than they can get at home.

I sympathize with their position, but I see no need for us to move out of the way to enhance their quality of life. Let them stay home and reform their own country, not mine.

“Right  do nothing until we solve the unsolvable  problem of the 11 million. Maybe they ll get homesick and go home. Maybe they ll decide to do the right thing and go home, OR, maybe the government will begin the unpleasant, but necessary, process of deporting them, one person, one family, one case at a time.

That s how crime has been dealt with in this country for some time now  not by bemoaning the fact that some people don t get caught, or that criminals may have to leave their families to go to jail  or be deported.
”

Incidentally, that followed this post:

“Bottom line: Illegal immigrants are here illegally. Except for (extremely) special circumstances. they should be asked to leave.

They should not be allowed to enter or stay. Period.

Illegal immigration has many negative circumstances, and should not continue.

It doesn t get any simpler than that, accusations of xenophobia be damned. ”

While technically accurate about not being “wholesale” this phrase makes it pretty close “Except for (extremely) special circumstances. they should be asked to leave.”

Sounds sort of like the right’s abortion plan. Maybe you could deport women who get abortions! Hot damn. Two birds with one stone.

And just, what would be and example of an extremely special circumstance that wouldn’t require them to be deported?

Re: Step 2: The law already does this, and has since 1952. See here and here.

Re: Step 3: all currently existing paths to green card/citizenship require either “intent to abandon former residence” or continuous physical presence in the US.

Re: Step 4: McCain/Kennedy does require English ability.

“Let s start tomorrow with the first person who sneaks in. Send him / her home. Let s start checking expired visas  oldest first. Find him / her and send him / her home.

Repeat until done.”

The only action item listed is sending them home. So what part of “repeat until done” doesn’t imply “let’s kick ‘em all out” (albeit, one by one). Maybe I missed something there.

But, I happen to agree with step 1 listed above. Step 2 is a good thought as well. I don’t know about #3 as the people that do this are most probably doing seasonal work. I suppose the argument can be made that they broke the law more times or something, but people that come and stay illegally are just as guilty of breaking the law as someone that does it many times. And, once again, how would you know how many times he’s been here?

“number” 4 I agree with as well. There are various tests for this already to gain citizenship.

The people that are here illegally ought to be required to pay some sort of fine to help pay for health care they receive for ‘free’ or other social services that are used. Not sure how much that really ought to be.

Then, I think we ought to seriously consider opening our borders to those who have an understanding and desire to be citizens of the states. I don’t see a reason not to. I don’t think overpopulation would be an issue at this point, but perhaps that is just blind ignorance. Either way, it ought to at least be an option on the table. We ought to take pride in the fact that so many people want to be a part of the country. Not that I particularly like ‘pride’, but really, it’s pretty cool that so many people want to immigrate here, IMHO.

Hopefully they don’t get the same people to verify the English that verify that NYC taxi drivers are English speaking, lol.

Running two threads is really a pain.

From the other thread:

Incidentally, none of you have seemed to notice that I mentioned deporting illegal immigrants  on a case by case basis. I m a firm opponent of wholesale, non – selective law enforcement  like mandatory sentences for marijuana posession, and  three time loser laws.

If someone has a real plan for determing how to divide up illegals into categories, I d like to hear it. So far all I ve heard from you is that rightwingers are racists, and  we can t just deport 11 million people.

Put your thinking caps on.

Step 1: Provide an incentive for illegal immigrants to turn themselves in.

Step 2: Favor families over singles (meaning would they be willing to be naturalized if their whole family could join them, with priority given to their parents, and extended families later. {That s extremely important to Hispanics})

Step 3: Favor people who have been good citizens and stuck around, as opposed to people who flit back and forth across the border.

Just a few things off the top of my right wing head.

Number 4: English speaking preferred.

I’m not as crazed as you make me out to be…

I get your point, you don’t think invading Mexico would be a good idea. But it would certainly solve illegal immigration, now wouldn’t it? I think it would be much more effective than rounding up all the illegals and transporting them out of the country. If you did so, not only would it cost an enormous sum of money, but it would not solve anything as it is highly probable 1/2 of them would find their way back within two years along with the other million you cite, so, actually after a few years you’d be pretty close to where you started. I’m not saying it’s a good idea, I’m saying there are alternative methods to solve the problem besides “get rid of ‘em”. If you take offense to my comment about my hoping that you would ‘bite’ I apologize. You don’t think it in good fun for me to insinuate that that would be something you’d be into with the discussion from “V” the other day?

Like I have stated previously though, the problem isn’t the illegals, it’s the people who hire them.

Oliver, besides the fact that choice was involved in actually coming to the states, how is this situation any different than millions of slaves being freed and given citizenship? The issue isn’t how they got here, the issue is now that they are here, what do we do? After abolition would you rather they would have taken all the slaves back to Africa? The situation is nearly the same in that both groups of people are being exploited to make an extra buck.

I guess it would beat getting a job, right?

OTOH
Or this (might be more up your alley)
2) Take over Mexico.

* * *

I was really hoping Frank would bite on option (2) though&

I’ll let you be the judge — not that I give a crap…

Weren’t you just talking about how you never attack someone personally unless you are attacked first?

Mike, don’t pretend that, for one moment that either you or I might consider an invasion of Mexico. You were being a wiseass, and you and I both know it.

I was really hoping Frank would bite on option (2) though&

“Bite?”

As to “let’s kick them all out”, you might want to read my comment in the other post, before you suggest invading Mexico in the future.

And if you can stop being a wiseass, I will stop calling you one.

Not that you give a rats ass about my opinion Ezra… But I have to agree with Oliver on this one. Try moving to Costa Rica. I am married to a Costa Rican, have three half Costa Rican children, am…