What will white supremicists do when their race becomes a minority? I expect they’ll continue being asshats, like they have been for decades now. The differences will be they will get even shriller and desperate. Does it make them more dangerous? No, desperate people will take more chances, but I really don’t see a Klansman turning into a suicide bomber because he lost majority status in the census.

Frank, and if that culture changes due to forces different than the slave holding exclusively christian white men who founded this place, why is that a bad thing? unless you are merely interested in maintaining a status quo that wasn’t morally earned.

I certainly said no such thing, and by no means did I mean such a thing.

I realize that I have opened a huge can of worms by actually admitting that there are races on earth, and that Americans have a culture (two different items, by the way). But I have no problem with that.

In my view, to acknowledge that there are races on this planet — there have been for quite a while, you know — is not even racism, let alone a crime.

And I AM NOT SAYING, nor did I EVER SAY that non – whites are “so dumb that we ve got to keep white people in the majority to preserve the natural order of things” [notice that I did not repeat the absurd usage "we brownies", first because it is so repulsive, and second, I sometimes wonder if a "real" person of color would want you included in the "we").

Actually, I was saying two OTHER things. You missed them both. People like Louis Farrakhan, Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson already make quite a comfortable living demonizing whitey. Can you imagine their rhetoric when "the devil" is in the minority?

And, two, there are white racists and white supremacists out there. Many of them are armed, and pas themselves off as militias. What do you think their reaction will be to being in the minority? Do you even care? And, if you even care -- and I suspect you don't -- have you even given it a thought? I suspect you haven't.

And, if your reading skills in any way matched your skill at hyperbole, you might have noticed that I said, "When will it [the debate] be centered on the disappearance of white power?” This means, for the reading impaired, that I was asking about when it occurs, not suggesting that it should be prevented.

I repeat, talking about race is neither racism, nor a crime.

You’re seriously saying this? You’re SERIOUSLY saying that us brownies are so dumb that we’ve got to keep white people in the majority to preserve the natural order of things?

Oh my God.

However, if you think about slave rebellions, the Civil War, the fight against “Jim Crow,” and the Civil Rights Movement from the end of World War II to 1965, you might want to ask yourself, “Would it be a good thing to see that all re – enacted?”

Hint: The answer is not “Yes” or “No.”

– Oliver, non-white American for 28 years and counting

Thomas Sowell once asked the question, “How did the occupants of a small northwestern corner of the Eurasian landmass come to control the entire world?”

One day, historians will ask, “How did they come to lose that control?”

The debate now seems to be centered on the presence of 11 million illegal immigrants.

When it will be centered on the disappearance of white power?
Will it even matter?

How will white people handle being a minority?

What if English becomes a second language, as it did in Quebec?

These questions will, at some time, require answers.

Calling conservatives racists is neither a question nor an answer.

Pretending that there is no American culture to protect is hiding your head in the sand.

Yes, Frank, what is at stake?
This sounds like something out of stormfront.org, seriously.

There is more at stake here than who is going to bus tables at Denny s, and who is going to trim rich people s hedges.”

Apparently.

If that took you nearly 2 hours, think what you could write by 8:18 PM…

Let’s ignore for a moment the fact that you have the English coming over 200 years early, and address the issue you raised.

Years ago, I read a book about the Presidencies of Adams and Jackson, where it was pointed out that the colonization and settlement of America was more like an invasion, where we simply pushed the Indian aside, and took over their country.

I’ve also read that by 2050, Hispanics will be the largest “minority” in the country.

Shortly thereafter, white people may be in a minority, if there is not enough intermarriage to eliminate them altogether. There is more at stake here than who is going to bus tables at Denny’s, and who is going to trim rich people’s hedges.

______________ has proposed a new temporary worker program to match willing foreign workers with willing U.S. employers when no Americans can be found to fill the jobs. The program would be open to new foreign workers, and to the undocumented men and women currently employed in the U.S. This new program would allow workers who currently hold jobs to come out of hiding and participate legally in America’s economy while not encouraging further illegal behavior.

______________ also asked Congress to work with him to achieve significant immigration reform that:

* Protects the homeland by controlling the borders.
* Serves America’s economy by matching a willing worker with a willing employer.
* Promotes compassion for unprotected workers.
* Provides incentives for temporary workers to return to their home countries and families.
* Protects the rights of legal immigrants while not unfairly rewarding those who came here unlawfully or hope to do so.

This legislation must also meet the Nation s economic needs and live up to the promise and values of America.

Give it a shot. What do you have to lose?

If someone has a real plan for determing how to divide up illegals into categories, I’d like to hear it. So far all I’ve heard from you is that rightwingers are racists, and “we can’t just deport 11 million people.”

Put your thinking caps on.

Step 1: Provide an incentive for illegal immigrants to turn themselves in.

Step 2: Favor families over singles (meaning would they be willing to be naturalized if their whole family could join them, with priority given to their parents, and extended families later. {That’s extremely important to Hispanics})

Step 3: Favor people who have been good citizens and stuck around, as opposed to people who flit back and forth across the border.

Just a few things off the top of my right wing head.

Got anything better?

And take a wild guess as to where that money will come from? (Hint: They will either cut back on profits, lower their own salaries, or raise prices. I can’t imagine which option they might choose)

Take a wild guess who will end up really paying the fines? (Hint: everybody)

Take a wild guess as to who will end up unemployed? (Hint: they’re not citizens, but they won’t be going home)

Of course, from the liberal, “adult” standpoint making employers pay fines is a good thing, right, factcheck?

Adults want to make it so that the illegals go back home on their own. We do that by penalizing employers, and increasing quotas. This is a less expensive solution. We also help alleviate the conditions that make them leave in the first place.

But we enforce the laws we have with differential dilligence and severity. How many people drive the speed limit on the interstate? We let it slide for the most part. When I first came to Texas in the early ’70s, it was not uncommon to hear of someone sentenced to 30 years for possessing an amount of marijuana that would earn a misdemeanor conviction today. Because of practical concerns (manpower for catching all violators) or changing mores, speeders are often allowed a free pass and pot smoking is treated a lot more leniently. I’m not saying that’s good or bad.

The law says all illegal immigrants should be deported. Is there an immigration lawyer or other professional who could detail what that would involve? Is counsel mandated for someone facing a deportation hearing? How long does the typical hearing last and what are the administrative and other costs involved in a hearing. Who actually picks up the tab for returning someone to their country of origin? At a cost of $1000 per case, deporting eleven million illegal immigrants would cost eleven billion dollars. And as noted elsewhere, the children of illegal immigrant parents are legal US citizens if those children are born here.

A while back, there was a thread discussing whether, moral considerations aside, there was such a thing as a material benefit to slavery. In that slave labor largely built the antebellum south, it could be argued that there was. But that was not justification enough for slavery. Today’s dirty not so little secret is that there is a material benefit to illeagal immigration, for the immigrant and for the persons who hire them. Many are coming to the conclusion that that is not justification enough.

I don’t think total deportation is practical. I don’t think a complete amnesty is fair. I agree with many of the proposed solutions posted here and elsewhere.

Reminds me of a joke: Two social workers come across a woman in a park, raped and beaten unconscious. They turn and walk way, and one says to the other, “Whoever did this is going to need a lot of help.”

Thanks for the insight, fastcheck…

I guess it s just easier to blame the workers, hmm.

Actually, no. It’s easier to deport the workers, hmm.