There is one idea that’s going to stick to Dick Cheney until the heavens fall. I’ve got no sympathy for the man of any sort, he’s quite frankly the worst human being to ever hold the office of vice president and at judgement day he’ll know exactly where he sits. When Cheney’s political epitaph is written, this statement in one form or another will be included: Dick Cheney, the vice-president of America, shot a 78 year old man in the face.
Oliver, in the first place, you couldn’t even name five Vice – Presidents from the 18th and 19th Century (unless you’re one of those trivia buffs who has them all memorized), so you’re in no position to judge whether or not he’s “the worst human being to ever hold the office of vice president.”
And, of course, given your attitude towards religion, and your woeful lack of knowledge in that area, you have no idea where anybody is going to end up on Judgment Day.
Make it easy on yourself: “I hate Cheney, and, if there’s a hell, I hope he goes there.”
See how easy that was?
give it up Ollie…..
This dog won’t hunt.
I am sure MM is trying to get it’s legions to “stay on point”…..but if there is a god, I highly doubt a hunting accident is going to cause St. Peter (or Muhammed, or the FSM) to cross his name off the list.
You just sound ridiculous when you say stuff like this.
While I’m sure that the Usual Suspects will want to believe that
unless modern medicine has an unexpected failure and Mr Whittington (who has already asked what all the fuss is about, something that Miss Kopechne never asked) dies, what you hope will be part pf Mr Cheney’s biography will not be mentioned with any significance given to it.
St. Pete is usually refered to as the guy guarding the Pearly Gates of Heaven, at least for those of us who went to Catholic School.
And as far as that hunting dog goes, Oliver’s tactics here will be effictive in at least one regard. The strategy seems to be for dems appearing on tv, or writers, or blogger, basically anyone looking to capitalize on this to use the phrase “Shot him in the face” as much as possible. Its a statement that provides no context, yet carries a harsh image that Oliver hopes will further tarnish the image of Cheney and republicans in general. Its a “talking point” in other words. Its just more “politics as usual”, and its ridiculous
I discover the american blogs with a grat pleasure. And I can see that you are very involved in politics maters. Wouhaoooo… In France we couldn’t say such violent things, true or not… Freedom of expression is badly threatened these days in Europe. This Dick Cheney story is really incredible…
“and at judgement day he ll know exactly where he sits.”
Sorry Cracker, I thought you were an educated, religious man. According to christian theology, St. Peter sits at the pearly gates when someone shows up, and Ollie was referring to judgement day.
I know, it was a somewhat abstract reference, I won’t forget who I am dealing with in the future and will drop the rhetoric down a notch so you can understand it….
Sorry, won’t happen again.
Whuh?
St. Peter? What are you yammering about, peed’?
Uh … Laura Bush killed a man!
“….he s quite frankly the worst human being to ever hold the office of vice president and at judgement day he ll know exactly where he sits.”
Peculiar, coming from an atheist. Who will judge him Oliver? That intelligent designer person?
I’m flabberghasted. I used to think you were pretty smart Oliver. But posts like this make me wonder.
Don’t get me wrong- you’re a guru at coming up with talking points (or at least parroting the Democratic line) but do you really want to compare this incident and Chappaquiddick? Point by point?
I know you’re young and may not know much about Senator Kennedy’s “situation” but you might want to do some scholarly reading on the subject. (And it doesn’t have to be from right wing sources.)
By the way- your hate is showing. (And you say WE’RE hateful.Comedy!)
It’s not the “quiddick’s” that bother me… it all those lost souls held in self-admittedly outside-the-law detention facilities and tar-baby-filled briar patch that is Iraq and its attended casualties…
Oh wait, you yahoos think I believe Cheney is going to be eternally condemned for shooting his friend in the face? No, that’ll probably get him a laugh in the hereafter, but Cheney is going to damnation for the much other worse things he’s done.
That’s different from what I read earlier.
Link?
Well, since you brought it up: the Sheriff’s report indicates that the Sheriff’s department was notified within an hour of the accident.
How did the timeline go for Teddy again?
Why bother investigating the story when Quaker already seems to have it wrapped up? Let the Impeachment Proceedings Begin!!!
PS: In your little tale, you left out how this is just Step 2 in Karl Rove’s sinsister plot to make Condi Prez.
Oh, yeah, I forgot:
First there was “no alcohol” involved.
And then, “OK, but just one beer before the shooting.”
And then, “Oh yeah, a jolt after the shooting, too.”
At each and every step, you rubes can’t understand why some people suspect we’re not hearing the whole story.
Could it be because we’ve heard “the whole story” three different ways?
OK, so the vice president shoots his hunting partner–yes, it was an accident–and then sits down for dinner and a refreshing beverage.
That’s normal, isn’t it?
And then he thinks, “Gosh, if I tell those awful Washington reporters about this, they might make it look bad.” So he gets the mistress of the “hunting preserve” to call it in to a reporter at the local paper.
That’s normal too, right?
Of course, nobody actually calls local law enforcement. They find out because there’s an emergency medical call. And then the VP makes an appointment to talk to the cops the next day.
S.O.P.?
And naturally, anyone who asks any questions about this is just trying to gin up a scandal.
Do I have that right?
You know, I’m okay with letting this matter rest. Cheney had an accident, and he took responsibility for the accident. He in fact took full and total responsibility: “I’m the one that pulled the trigger.” The statement was contrite, and considering that the man he shot was a friend, I’m willing to believe it was sincere. That satisfies me. I doubt I’d ever want to be anywhere near him on a hunting trip (Justice Scalia, were you paying attention?) and I still find his canned hunts to be the mark of bloodthirtsy cowardice…but on this particular incident, it’s not worth hammering the point home.
So my question is: what about all the people who were not-so-subtly implying that it was all Whittington’s fault? Where’s their regret and apology?
Oliver is not saying that Dick Cheney’s careless shooting of a guy in the face is why he will go to hell. He is saying that Cheney was already a vile nasty hell-bound person, and that his recent negligent shooting of a guy in the face will hence forth be a big part of the Cheney legacy. The first part is more of a disclaimer: I hate Dick Cheney, but even without that bias I think Dick Cheney irresponsibly shooting a guy in the face will be remembered historically.
Quaker…
And then the VP makes an appointment to talk to the cops the next day.
The Sheriff wrote: “After hearing the same information from eyewitnesses…I decided to send my chief deputy first thing Sunday morning to interview the Vice President.”
Oliver…
If you are reduced to claiming that Cheney will suffer eternal damnation for his deeds, then somebody on my side is doing something right!
Thanks for the laugh, Nawoods.
So goes the axiom: Get into a fight with a pig and the pig has fun while you get dirty. It’s even funnier when the dirty pig starts complaining that mud’s being thrown around.
It reminds of me of that great SNL skit with the punchline: Great! Before we were people burning in hell. Now, we’re monkeys burning in hell. That’s a step down.
Mr Willis asks:
No one has denied that Mr Cheney accidentally shot someone in ahunting accident, Mr Willis. Rather, we have been saying that an accident is exactly what it was, that reasonable response procedures were followed, and that, in the end, this is not going to be a significant incident historically.
We understand that our friends on the left are always looking for something, anything, that they can use to attack the Administration politically. But this incident is simply another straw at which y’all have grasped, fruitlessly, helplessly, pathetically.
Today is February 16th; I’m going to postdate a post on my site for May 16th, on this very subject, suggesting that readers look around, and see if this is even the faintest of issues at that time.
Of course, we all know that it won’t be!
Oliver…
If these threads had been nothing more than a bunch of people saying, “The VP shot someone,” then I wouldn’t even bother posting.
Instead, we hear that the VP was drunk. That the incident was not properly reported. That there was a coverup.
Then you brazenly compare the incident to Chappaquiddick. Maybe if Cheney had killed the man and left him laying in that field until the next morning, while consulting with his family, that would be a valid comparison. You invite response with your rhetoric, and you got it.
Quaker…
That s different from what I read earlier. Link?
Read the Sheriff’s report.
Quaker…
Of course, nobody actually calls local law enforcement.
The Sheriff’s report indicates that they knew within minutes…including a call from the Secret Service directly to the Sheriff himself within perhaps 15 minutes, depending on how you interpret the timeline.
Oh, how is this stupid? Let me count the ways.
1) Cheneyquiddick: as scratch so ably pointed out, at the original Chappaquiddick, the politician in question fled the injured party to die a horrible, lingering death, did everything he could to avoid responsibility for his actions, then reported it to the authorities well over a day later. Said politician is one of the lions of the Democratic party. Cheney, on the other hand, did not get one of his buddies to take the blame, nor did he deny Mr. Whittington immediate medical attention.
2) “Worst vice president in history.” Other have challenged you to name others who might qualify. Let me help you out with a couple you might consider bad: Dan Quayle, Spiro Agnew, Richard Nixon, Aaron Burr. Them’s some pretty big shoes to stuff Dick into, Ollie.
3) Your epitaph seemed very well written. That bothered me until I recalled the Daily Show’s Monday night coverage, when nearly that exact phrase was repeated over and over. Gonna give Jon Stewart any royalties for that one?
J.
“Dick Cheney, the vice-president of America, shot a 78 year old man in the face.”
“Wait, are you all denying that the vice president of the united states, Dick Cheney, shot a 78 year old man in the face?”
“Oh wait, you yahoos think I believe Cheney is going to be eternally condemned for shooting his friend in the face?”
You just can’t bring this up without that whole “shot it the face” thing can you? When you use that phrase separated from its context, the hunting accident, you are wallowing in the gutter. You are practicing the very same vile tactics you so rightly deride the cons for. Its disgusting. And now queue the non-sequitors regarding how awful a man Cheney is….
Wait, are you all denying that the vice president of the united states, Dick Cheney, shot a 78 year old man in the face? Because he did. It’s not one of those things you can shrug your shoulders and say “maybe” about. It’s a fact. Are you guys so deep into the cult you can’t admit that? ALSO: I’m an atheist? That’s news to… me.
Why would it be an issue? Unlike so much the Republicans have done, Dick Cheney actually took responsibility for something. I mean, the vice president shot a 78 year old man in the face, but at least he owned up to it for a change.
Welcome to the neighborhood.
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/POLITICS/FOSTER_COVERUP/foster.html
http://www.capitolhillblue.com/Feb1999/022599/clintonwomen022599.htm
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/CRASH/BROWN/brown.html
Here’s the company you guys looking to have your “questions answered” are joining.
I was flabbergasted during the Peoples Republic of China style interview,
Britt Hume asked without a hint of irony or sarcasm;
“I assume you missed the bird?”
Farris, I’ll correct you in the same way I corrected another commentor:
I’m not speculating on the answers to any of these questions. I just want to know what those answers are.
So far, the answers from the usual foot soldiers to authority here seem to suggest that it’s wrong to ask the questions. Why is that?
Oh come on, so its ok to shoot someone if it was during a hunting trip? What kinda bull is this? I’m not saying h’s going to hell for this (for THIS, mind you) but the fact remains. HE SHOT SOMEONE. I don’t care, where, when or why. The idiot shot a man. Ain’t no way to deny it. Drunk, sober, blind, with night vision, I don’t give a flying hunk of monkey chow. The 2nd most powerful person in the world shot a man. Jesus…
Oh and the worst VP was Rufus Devane King. Viva la reference obscura!
scratch:
From today’s NYT:
Jay T… be realistic. Both Chappaquidick and The hunting incident share this in common:
“did everything he could to avoid responsibility for his actions, then reported it to the authorities well over a day later.”
Dana – “reasonable response procedures were followed” (see above).
Scratch – read the paper more often… the NYT article, as well as several other papers have covered the discrepancy between what the Secret Service has said, what the Sherrif has said and what a Sherrif’s deputy has said.
Tell me (cheney defenders), why the vociferous attack and attempt to downplay the seriousness of the incident?
Bad, bad Leroy Brown wrote:
Can I vote for Aaron Burr on this one?
The statement was contrite, and considering that the man he shot was a friend, I m willing to believe it was sincere.
That’s right! Good friend! Sincere! Sincere! Read the transcript of the interview!
Q How did you feel when you heard about that?
THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, it’s a great relief. But I won’t be, obviously, totally at ease until he’s home. He’s going to be in the hospital, apparently, for a few more days, and the problem, obviously, is that there’s always the possibility of complications in somebody who is 78-79 years old. But he’s a great man, he’s in great shape, good friend, and our thoughts and prayers go out to he and his family.
No — no wait — acquaintance! I barely know the guy!
Q How long have you known him?
THE VICE PRESIDENT: I first met him in Vail, Colorado, when I worked for Gerry Ford about 30 years ago, and it was the first time I’d ever hunted with him.
Q Would you describe him as a close friend, friendly acquaintance, what –
THE VICE PRESIDENT: No, an acquaintance.
Cheney literally couldn’t keep his story straight for two minutes.
Crap. Sorry about that, in the preview it showed my citations italicized, but it didn’t come through somehow.
In my contrition I’ll share some inside info from the hospital: apparently Monica Lewinsky called Whittington to offer her sympathies — she, too, knows what it’s like to take a load in the face from the guy who runs the country and have him try to cover it up.
You probably shouldn’t have typed that after you published this:
You’re subscribing motive to someone other than yourself. Sounds like speculation to me!
It’s not that it was wrong to ask questions: it’s that those questions were SO over the top because the White House Press Corp had their knickers in a twist over getting scooped by the Corp. Christ. Daily Times.
And now that the investigation is closed and no charges will be filed, the Clinton/Kennedy/Clinton/Berger/Gore/Cisneros Rule goes into effect and we should all just “MoveOn.org”.
Golly, Farris. Maybe you’re right. What was Cheney’s explanation for having the ranch owner release the story to a third-tier news outlet? As I recall, it had something to do with “getting the story right.”
The Corpus Christi Bazoo is more likely to “get it right” than the WaPo?
Okey-dokey.
The reason that Oliver ends every post this way “…he shot a dude in the face!” is two-fold.
1) It is the only way to counter the right-wing’s “but bush won!” diatribe with like-minded logic and
2) it’s fucking hilarious.
What party did Aaron Burr belong to? Just curious.
Worse than Chappaquiddick; Ted K. got punished and the case did go before a Grand Jury.
Yet, Cheney—a man with a history of alcohol problems, a man who is very likely on a number of medications, and someone who has a track record of lying—is allowed to wait 14 hours before granting the police an interview?
And with those facts, Cheney and his handlers still have an ever-evolving story.
Rainlion…
Tell you what…you can stick with the NYT and I will stick with what the Sheriff wrote in his official report on the case.
Scratch… seriously – why would multiple media outlets be reporting the discrepancy, if there was nothing there?
Okay… fine, you believe the Sherrif’s report. But tell me… does that mean you also respect and except the David Kay’s report(s) re: WMDs? The 9/11 commissions findings on ties between Saddam and 9/11? Just to name a few…
I think Burr would have been a Democratic-Republican under Jefferson.
Quote from Lucy – “This is all just goofy. Why was the VP hunting in the first place? Shouldn’t he have been doing something important considering how screwed up things are? Isn’t he supposed to be serving the public? And hunting is dumb. And who mistakes a grown man for a little bird? They all need to be put in a big white room with no windows or doors.” – Okay that was from the little one on her way to bed, although I do find an interesting point from the small child – why is it that every time one of these two (B&C) take a vacation in any form some type of disaster strikes? Has anyone else noticed this trend? Seriously. I am an athiest and I think if I were one of these two after this I might even think there’s a divine signal going up in flaming red to stop taking vacations.
Honestly though. Is it big news? You bet. It’s not every day (or every fifty years for that matter) that the VP of the USA shoots someone. That in itself should be worth a footnote.
Is it worthy of a massive conspiracy theory about how there must have been something sinister going on other than an idiot having a hunting accident? Not really. Hunting accidents are relatively common. That part is an example of the left fishing and the press being uppity.
Did he handle it poorly from a PR standpoint? Yes. Without a doubt.
This is the only time I’ll probably defend this creep so mark it on your calendars. Oliver, he DIDN’T shoot him “in the face”. He shot him off-center of his upper chest area and the shot, being spread shot, spread all the way to his face, neck, chest, and arm. In all fairness, it’s not as if Dicky-Boy purposely walked up to his hunting partner and unloaded a round in his face. That’s about as fair as I can get though, because I concur with my daughter that he’s a loon.
And for the theorists – did anyone notice in the interview that Cheney said both he and the shoot-ee were wearing hunting glasses? Generally they are polarized, slightly shaded, and reduce/eliminate glare – so how could he not have seen him? The “lost him in the sun” part does sound slightly fishy – like a cover for “I was a moron”.
Exactly…why should this Cheney character expect his constitutional rights to be honored? Who does he think he is…an American citizen?
Ted K. got punished
Yes, justice was definitely served when Black Sheep Teddy was given a summons for leaving the scene of an accident.
That’s some ‘punishment.’
Quaker and Rainlion…
Discrepency? The report says that the Sheriff did learn of the shooting from one of his deputies shortly after his accident, presumably as arrangements were being made to transport the injured man to a hospital. He was then called directly by the Secret Service 8 or 10 minutes later. Is the requirement to report the accident (setting aside for a moment that the game warden said there was no requirement to report it) now amended to mean that the highest ranking law enforcement officer in the county must be informed directly before word reaches him through other means? It sounds to me like the Sheriff was informed directly within 20 or 30 minutes of the accident…though his subordinates knew almost immediately, because, yes, the first action was to make arrangements to get the man to a hospital.
Other posters…
Still waiting for your facts about Cheney being “drunk” and Cheney deciding to put off the police interview until the next day. Until you have facts (and on the second point, your facts must contradict what the Sheriff said in his report,) you are, as our host says, just making shit up.
Finally, Rainlion…
does that mean you also respect and accept the David Kay s report(s) re: WMDs? The 9/11 commissions findings on ties between Saddam and 9/11? Just to name a few&
In a word, yes. Interestingly, those two question highlight your complete misunderstanding of the positions taken by a great many “administration apologists,” as we are often called here. Why I say that is left as an exercise for you. And you won’t find the answer in the NYT.
Cheney will be remembered for his not-very-sober shooting more than any other one thing. More than Halliburton, more than false claims of WMD, more than selecting himself as Bush’s runningmate. With Dan Quayle it was the potatoe. With Cheney it will be the shooting.
Rainlion asks:
No one has downplayed the seriousness of the accident. What I have said is that it isn’t a serious incident politically. Mr Whittington is recovering well, doesn’t see it as anything more than an accident himself, and the Vice President has accepted (as he should have) full responsibility for the accident.
A timed article, already written, will appear on my website on May 16th, noting this accident, and asking the question: is anyone paying attention to this anymore? Naturally, it links back to this thread, so I assume our gracious host will see it (WordPress will notify him), even if (since this site doesn’t have a “Recent Responses” feature) no one else will.
Perhaps Mr. Willis would enable pingbacks on this particular thread?
Good readin’ Scratch.
Dugger
Thanks Dugger.
“Never has a witty sig” Scratch
“(H)e had what appeared to be a line of scarring on his upper right eyelid and scrapes on his neck?”
Somehow that doesn’t seem consistent with what our esteemed host has been telling us:
You know, if I were to have gotten all of my information from Oliver Willis, I would have thought that Mr Cheney aimed at Mr Whittington’s face, and he had his face blown away, like we get to see in the movies. But now it appears that he had “what appeared to be a line of scarring on his upper right eyelid and scrapes on his neck.”
Were it someone other than Mr Willis, I’d have thought that he had been engaged in demagoguery. Since it is Mr Willis, I’m sure that there must be some other explanation.
Why would you have thought that?
I don’t recall OW ever writing that Mr. Cheney shot Mr. Whittington intentionally, or that Mr. Whittington’s injuries were cosmetically dramatic.
Kinda hard to accuse someone of exaggerating by, um, exaggerating.
Well, whittington is alive
cheney has taken full responsibility
the authorities were informed appropriately and in a reasonable amount of time
Nothing to see here folks, just a bunch of hyperventilating leftists, praying for SOMETHING that will give them an opportunity to win an election or two…
LOL
C’mon Ollie…do you really think Cheney is that much worse than your own former governor, the bribe taking and mobster governor of Maryland, Spiro ‘Ted” Agnew? Now he golfs with world leaders, the rich and powerful and probably got to keep the money he stole as governor and then as the shockingly criminal vice president to the honorable Richard NIxon.
BOy, the GOP can sure pick quality, cant they?
Oops…sorry. I forgot Agnew was dead…well, I still hate him.
Its long past the time when any tests could have been performed to verify that alcohol was not a factor in the accident and there are no witnesses coming forward contradicting Cheney’s story. Of course, no one came forward to question the “no alcohol” story originally told by the ranch owner either. But if Whittington is happy with the outcome, that’s it. Next story please.
Funny, just switch “Kennedy” with “Cheney” in the above post…kinda funny.
Of course cheney HAD witness, and cheney DID contact the authorities immediately, and of course you actually COULD interview Whittington, whereas MaryJo didn’t even get an autopsy….