A world in which Pat Robertson can tell women what to do with their bodies; where the President can eavesdrop on Americans without a warrant; in which science that conflicts with policy is suppressed; in which individuals have less rights than corporations; in which the free market determines who gets health care and who doesn’t, who eats and who doesn’t, who is entitled to an education and who isn’t; in which workplace safety laws don’t exist …

All this and more because you’re afraid of brown people and terrorists. Can’t wait.

Yeah, yeah, I know. Fisking Cousin Oliver is not exactly a big challenge, but everytime I go over there I find myself writing so much in rebuttal to his commenters and to his…. (try not to be insulting…be nice…think of something that won’t belit…

So your statement should mean bupkus to me. But, unlike you, I don’t pretend to know what is really on your mind. If you say it’s true, I must at least admit that you believe it to be true.

But my belief is that liberals seek an ordered, rational world, and fear a disordered, irrational world. A world of freedom, such as conservatives envision, would naturally frighten you.

it s always immigration that so many conservatives choose to separate out to lay all the blame of when ever the pace of change freaks them out too much.

I find it interesting that both frame and our esteemed host thought that this was about conservatives, when the highest profile politicians who have raised this issue are Governor Bill Richardson (D-NM), Governor Jean (?) Nepolitano (D-AZ) and Senatrix Hillary Clinton (D-NY). It seems that the highest profile Republican who had addressed this issue is President George Bush, and his proposals are to stabilize the situation with guest worker administration, rather than the “they’re all illegal, deport ‘em all” reaction.

How about one that didn’t expose your deep-seeded abject fear of people different from you?

Let’s face it Frank, the American Way is constantly changing. Indeed, one could argue that the American Way IS change. Change driven by capitalist markets that constantly push technology and culture forward. Immigration plays it’s part too but it’s only one piece of a much larger process. And yet it’s always immigration that so many conservatives choose to separate out to lay all the blame of when ever the pace of change freaks them out too much.

I’ve always been fascinated by how much anxiety the free market actually produces in supposed free market cheerleaders. I think bashing immigrants is born of repression and subsitution. Unable to face the facts that capitalism itself is a threat to tradition, conservatives direct their fear and angst on anyone who looks different or sounds different. I think you’re posts are ample evidence of this.

‘The  problem is not with Hispanics& ‘ but then you describe a scenario in which you posititon Hispanics as the source of the problem:

“Perhaps it s the impression one gets that it is getting worse instead of better   For English, dial  12   Para Espanol, marca numero  dos  I hear it in my therapy classes:  For example, if your client(s) is Spanish&  It s as if we as a people are not really supposed to expect assimilation, but rather a  living side – by – side that is totally incompatible with the American Way.”

Further up the post you argue that this “refusal” to assimilate has nothing to do with the way Hispanics are treated by this culture or the fact that whole Hispanic communities are looked at as interlopers or criminals, no matter how many generations have been born and died here as Americans. No, their “refusal” to assimilate is entirely the result of who Hispanics are as a race and a people:

“Every immigrant who comes here isn t the same. Hispanics come from an Indian tradition laminated between a Spanish language and culture, and Catholic religion. It won t break down easy.”

You even feel the need to point out that Hispanics are radically different from those good immigrants — the Irish, the Germans, the Italians — who assimilated so easily and readily into American culture without any problem at all. Yup, it’s just the Hispanics who are causing all the trouble because they’re different.

Just tell us, what are you afraid all this Hispanic immigration will lead to?

conservatives direct their fear and angst on anyone who looks different or sounds different.
And liberals direct their fear and angst on anyone who acts differently or thinks differently from them.

I think you re posts are ample evidence of this.

fastcheck, laws don’t determine how I feel. I’m not a liberal. If you think they do, maybe you’ll be my patient one day — but I’ll charge you double because of the extra effort.
Incidentally, for the record, neither racism nor xenophobia is a pathology.

Wow, living side by side with Latinos and Spanish speakers is incompatible with the American way.
Because the American way is the official language is English- oops, it’s not now is it?

But you’re not racist or xenophobic at all, right? In those therapy sessions, are you sure you’re the therapist?

Nor does it require some basis that you would find rational for other people to believe that illegal immigration presents a threat to our American culture. You can argue about people’s beliefs and perceptions not being rational all that you want, but unless you actually persuade them to change their minds, they will hold whatever beliefs they wish. In a representative republic, those beliefs carry weight, whether you believe they should or not.

As I see it, the biggest single problem is language. If the immigrants were making a major effort to learn English and assimilate quickly, much of the perception of problems would disappear.

I hear it in my therapy classes: “For example, if your client(s) is Spanish…”

It’s as if we as a people are not really supposed to expect assimilation, but rather a “living side – by – side” that is totally incompatible with the American Way.
As usual, you on the Left will say, “Then the American Way must change.” And the average American (like the average human, conventionally conservative) will say, “Oh yeah? Sez you!” And then the ‘fun’ begins.

And Dana, why on earth should we should we lay down when politicians blatantly pander to reactionary, racist idiots? What rational basis is there to believe that illegal immigratation represents an existential threat to this country’s way of life?

I can see having a reasonable disagreement about jobs on this issue but anyone who s afraid that immigration will destroy our way of life is a reactionary, racist idiot.

Perhaps you see that as a way to simply dismiss people’s concerns, but you need to face facts: those concerns do exist, and “a reactionary, racist idiot” has just as much of a vote as you do.

Further, if you look at our immigration laws, and the quotae that are legally allowed, you will see that they have always been based on trying to maintain some sort of ethnic and cultural balance.

I don’t think American values are under attack at all. What do you imagine I am, some Neanderthal – browed numbskull in a “wife – beater” watching Wheel of Fortune every night? What a shallow tool you are. You know what bothers me about assimilation, clown? I wonder why I’m assimilating like I’ve moved into a foreign country, when I graduated from the Elementary School across the street 45 years ago. I have nothing to fear, stupid.

Once again you have raised a point I was not trying to make, made what you consider to be a sound argument against it, and derived (I presume) some pleasure from it.

Where did I mention anything about “being concerned for (your) culture or (your) way of life because people come to this country looking for work?”

If there is one I’m sure of frame, it’s that you couldn’t give two shits about your country, your culture, or your way of life.

But I’m asking you where Imentioned being afraid. You only have to go back about six or seven posts. If it’s there, you’ll find it.
But I know what you’ll do: You’ll find some statement that (for you) fills the bill, and then hit me with a liberal “either / or”: Either you were saying that snails hve jet engines or you were saying you were afraid — which is it?

I’m telling you, frame, your game is old. Get a clue, or revamp your act.

BTW, I live on the third floor in an apartment building, not in a comfy little house like you La La Land sissies.

Of what, Frank, would you have attempted to convince me? Am I supposed to be concerned for my culture or my way of life because people come to this country looking for work? Am I supposed to look at every bodega,botanica or store front church in my city as evidence that American values are under attack? In other words, do you think I should live in fear like you?