BOND, one of the right wing operations run by rich white guys with black guys up front, has declared war on Kwanzaa! All across America, black Americans were ready and waiting to celebrate Kwanzaa, but now, a black sock puppet is telling them not to, so they better listen.
Or something. You wish those guys would put their money and energy into more important causes, but that would be expecting them to grow brains.
“We pledge allegiance to the red, black and green, our flag, the symbol of our eternal struggle, and to the land we must obtain; one nation of black people, with one God of us all, totally united in the struggle, for black love, black freedom and black self- determination.”
Is this an accurate description of the “Kwanzaa pledge of allegiance” and if so, do you find nothing repulsive or racist about it? Would you find it repulsive or offensive if the word “black” were replaced by the word “white”?
I don’t know and I don’t care and that’s the point. Nobody gives a crap about Kwanzaa but these guys need something to make noise about so the big boss man writes them another fat check.
I’d love to hear more about the “white guys” who write the checks, or is that something else ‘everybody knows’?
Guys, Guys… don’t get all “factual” with Oliver… he’s on a holy terror to defend a made-up nationalist socialist holiday and attack some black preachers and nothing will change his mind.
Happy Holidays Everyone!
So, basically, Ollie, you’re not defending Kwanzaa, but attacking the attack? You don’t give a rat’s ass about the holiday per se, but are seizing on this as an excuse to kick them around…
I don’t have any problems with that; I’ve done it myself on occasion. But I usually don’t get as worked up about it. Just trying to figure it out…
J.
Has anyone ever met anyone celebrating Kwanzaa? I like its values of community and I’d prefer to celebrate that instead of Christmas (and I’m white), but does the holiday actually exist except in theory?
I think this is what Oliver is saying. It’s like an attack on one of the Catholic Church’s moveable feasts, holidays that pretty much exist in a book and nowhere else. We might as well be up in arms about a holiday celebrated on a small planet in the vicinity of Betelgeuse.
I celebrated kwanzaa at my unitarian church because we celebrate everything. Also I had a black english teacher in highschool who did a big kwanzaa party. In either case I have never heard of the kwanzaa pledge. Its either total BS or its something that was technically part of kwanzaa but is now obsolete.
I d love to hear more about the white guys who write the checks, or is that something else everybody knows ?
With pleasure, Frankie.
Here’s an oldie, but goodie about Project 21:
JayTea it is a reason for Oliver to post about how much black conservatives are traitors to their race.
Yes, it’s likely that Kwanzaa as it’s celebrated today does not reflect its nationalist / socialist roots as intended by Karenga. That’s a plus, but it still doesn’t eliminate the fact that Kwanzaa is the product of Karenga in 1966…
I really wish Oliver wouldn’t delete my comments….
Be definition, anyone who is black that doesn’t agree with the Left’s positions must be bankrolled by some rich white guy
Stop guessing, boys. Check it out.
BTW, just what in BOND’s description of the origin of Kwanzaa is incorrect? It was my understanding that it was invented, out of whole cloth, in 1966; that the founder is indeed a Marxist and convicted torturer (real torture, that is, including beating with clubs, whipping with electrical cords, soldering irons and detergents put in women’s mouths, toes crushed in vices).
Yeah, I can see why people might have a problem with that baggage.
J.
Note to self: apparently only blacks are allowed to be concerned about the fate of black people. Non-blacks are allowed to give money to liberal black causes, or STFU and be called racist.
I hate it when I miss these memos…
J.
Yeah, Quaker, right there next to the names of the guys we’re sure are white guys — all two of them — are photostats of those fat checks they wrote.
Jay Tea – we probably shouldn’t get all factual with Oliver…
Stop guessing, boys. Check it out. Take Two.
OT, Eugene McCarthy and Richard Pryor have died
Interesting info. Oliver probably wonders how you right-wingers muster up so much faux outrage. I know that the conservatives on this page are upset that thier party is walking around with the proverbial black eye, but Christmas and Kwanzaa? Merry Christmas AND Happy Holidays to you all:)
Check that, Bond does link to the Official Kwanzaa site but for some reason the pledge stuff only comes from The Kwanzaa Information Center.
Isn’t it kind of odd that all the right wingers are getting their information about Kwanzaa from a site that has no apparent affiliation with the Official Kwanzaa website? Again, the Kwanzaa pledge may be in Karenga’s book “Kwanzaa: A Celebration of Family, Community and Culture” but it doesn’t appear to be on his webpage.
Wasn’t somebody around here yesterday claiming that “liberals” are too lazy to google to back up their own arguments?
You said you wanted to know more about the white guys. I showed you where to find the names of the board of directors and the advisory board.
Have at it.
Jesus, here’s an article in Front Page Mag from 2004 by Reverend Jesse Lee Peterson:
“To provide a symbol of his seven principles, Karenga used the menorah from Judaism with Kwanzaa s colors (red, black, and green), and re-named it the “kinara.” Karenga also created a Kwanzaa flag that consists of black, green, and red. The Kwanzaa Information Center states the color red represents blood: We lost our land through blood; and we cannot gain it except through blood. We must redeem our lives through the blood. Without the shedding of blood there can be no redemption of this race. ‘
Similarities are one thing, but these guys seem to be straight cutting and pasting on this. Has anyone of these writers bothered to look beyond feedback loop they all appear to be stuck in?
I’ve looked around the official Kwanzaa website. I didn’t find the so-called Kwanzaa pledge anywhere. It may be there or in the book sold on the site but maybe one of you right-wing truth seekers could give us a link to it. Google “the Kwanzaa pledge” and all you get are right-wing sites. It’s odd actually. Here’s a paragraph from an article by William Norman Grigg entitled “The True Spirit of Kwanzaa”:
“To provide a tangible symbol of his seven principles, “Karenga” appropriated the menorah from Judaism, adorning it in Kwanzaa s seasonal colors (red, black, and green) and re-christening it the “kinara.” No Kwanzaa celebration is complete without the recitation of the Kwanzaa pledge: “We pledge allegiance to the red, black, and green, our flag, the symbol of our eternal struggle, and to the land we must obtain; one nation of black people, with one God of us all, totally united in the struggle, for black love, black freedom, and black self-determination.”
Here’s a paragraph from an article titled “Kwanzaa the Unqualified Holiday” by Michael Hint:
“To provide a symbol of these new found principles, Everett borrowed the menorah from Judaism, bastardized it with black power colors, and renamed it the kinara. In addition, every Kwanzaa celebration would not be complete without the Kwanzaa pledge: We pledge allegiance to the red, black, and green, our flag, the symbol of our eternal struggle, and to the land we must obtain; one nation of black people, with one God of us all, totally united in the struggle, for black love, black freedom, and black self-determination. ‘
Interesting. It’s kind of viral. All of the information that Bond cites on his website, including this pledge, seems to come from something called “The Kwanzaa Information Center.” Is this center associated with The Official Kwanzaa site? Is what it says and accurate reflection of the official creators intent? (And let’s remember that this guys is quite open about the fact that he created Kwanzaa whole cloth)
But utlimately, Bond seems to be arguing that blacks who celebrate Kwanzaa are doing so as an alternative to Christmas, a situation which he seems to find horrifying for some reason. But is this the case? Is Kwanzaa intended as a substitute for Christmas? Is it intended to replace Christmas in black homes? Apparently not.
“10. Can people celebrate Kwanzaa and Christmas?
Is Kwanzaa an alternative to Christmas?
Kwanzaa was not created to give people an alternative to their own religion or religious holiday. And it is not an alternative to people’s religion or faith but a common ground of African culture.”
http://www.officialkwanzaawebsite.org/faq.html#10
Here’s how the official kwanzaa website describes the Kwanzaa flag and its colors:
“Bendera (The Flag) The colors of the Kwanzaa flag are the colors of the Organization Us, black, red and green; black for the people, red for their struggle, and green for the future and hope that comes from their struggle. It is based on the colors given by the Hon. Marcus Garvey as national colors for African people throughout the world.”
I’m confused. I referred to Bond as a “he.” I meant “it.”
Sure, Jademold, whenever I want reliable information, I always check with American Prospect. Aside from the McCarthyesque, “This guy knows this guy who sat on the same bus as this guy, on the way to a football game in 1982″, where is the E – V – I – D – E – N – C – E that rich white guys write the checks.
Memories, Jademold?
Jademold: Memories?
Posted by: shark at April 29, 2004
Frankie, you’re drifting OT once again. Well, at least you’re not challenging people to fistfights, so I imagine that’s an improvement.
You should concede the fact that all black conservative groups are front groups for the GOP.
Well, Frankie, do you deny the incident took place on C-SPAN? Or is C-SPAN just another liberal outlet?
The fact is Project 21 has one paid employee and he’s a white guy with extensive ties to the GOP. The fact is his salary is paid for by another GOP front group that seems to be run completely by white Repugs.
In reality, that’s a lot of evidence.
I concede nothing to Jademold, the King of the Trolls. Especially without evidence.
Just to pile on Frankie a bit more, some more evidence.
Consider the African American Republican Leadership Council (AARLC). It’s stated mission is to “break the liberal democrat stranglehold over Black America.”
But if one peruses their leadership, one finds that 13 out of the 15 senior leaders are white guys like Sean Hannity, Grover Norquist, Lou Sheldon, Gary Bauer, etc.
To add to the hilarity, the AARLC also claimed Edward Brooke III, a former US Senator and black GOPer from MA was a senior leader of the group. But Brooke has denied knowing anything about the group.
I’m a little confused about something here:
Is the point of Oliver’s comment — not the BS that followed it about Project 21 — that BOND shouldn’t be concerned about Kwanzaa replacing Christmas?
Because it seems like everyone is talking about whether black conservative organizations receive money from white Republicans.
Doesn’t the NAACP receive money from white Democrats? So?
So, let’s get this straight. It is alright, and even a moral imperative, for whites to donate to or participate in liberal organizations that work for what they perceive to be the benefit of black people. However, it is an outright travesty when whites donate to or participate in organizations that do not share the liberal doctrine. Convenient, that.
Maybe they’re just piggy – backing on the “War on Christmas.”
The Kwanzaa page might be saying that they don’t intend to replace Christmas, now, but it seems they were giving that impression a few years ago. Of course, that could have been coming from people who just plain opposed the concept of Kwanzaa, but I don’t think so.
Also, note that the Kwanzaa web page points to “two of the most frequent reasons Christian celebrants of Kwanzaa give for turning to Kwanzaa. The first reason is that it provides them with cultural grounding and reaffirmation as African Americans. The other reason is that it gives them a spiritual alternative to the commercialization of Christmas [emphasis added] and the resultant move away from its original spiritual values and message.
It does say “turning to Kwanzaa” and “spiritual alternative to the commercialization of Christmas”.
Doesn t the NAACP receive money from white Democrats? So?
Absolutely, Frankie. And the NAACP has had whites in positions of leadership since the NAACP’s inception. There’s a profound difference difference, however.
The NAACP’s leadership has been predominantly black and the black grassroots is a major source of its funding.
Contrast that with the so-called black conservative groups where the leadership is almost exclusively white and the funding comes not from black grassroots but from GOP groups who hold agenda antithetical to the black community.
that BOND shouldn t be concerned about Kwanzaa replacing Christmas?
Nobody has argued that Kwanzaa replace Xmas. And even if someone did–who cares? How is it that rightwingnuts aren’t worried about Channukah replacing Xmas? And let’s face it–Xmas is celebrated about a thousand different ways from those who believe it to be nothing but Xmas trees and Santa to those reject Xmas trees and Santa in favor of going to Mass about 30 times.
The fact is that bashing Kwanzaa appeals to white bigots in the GOP; that’s the aim of BOND: to attract white bigot cash.
Frank,
I think a bigger concern for black conservatives is how to improve the Republican vote from 11 percent. It’s very hard to find any significant ethnic or religious so unanimously associated with one party. For example, while 88 percent of African Americans voted for Kerry (a guy who did not have the charisma of Bill “First Black President” Clinton), only about 72 percent of self-described white, born again Christians voted for Bush – a partisan ratio more in line with, say, Jews and the Democratic Party. Most black people will agree with Peterson that the Democratic party takes black voters for granted. But that doesn’t mean they are going to vote Republican. Perhaps folks like Rev. Peterson are trying to figure this out, but somehow waging a war on Kwanzaa seems like a strange strategy to create black conservatives and black Republicans.
What Jadegold says.
I’ve celebrated Christmas my whole life and even been to my share of Midnight masses but I’m no more a believer in Christ than I was when I was 2. Why would anyone think that celebrating Kwanzaa automatically translates into a militant, white-hating separatism?
Just like the “War on Christmas” galvanizes a fringe population prone to paranoia and fear, so to does the “war on Kwanzaa.” Arguably they are the same population: White Far-Right Christians.
We might as well be up in arms about a holiday celebrated on a small planet in the vicinity of Betelgeuse.
Damn! There goes my planned celebrations for Eccentrica Gallumbits Day…
Okay, briefly… and in no particular order:
Diamond – yes, alot of people do. I and my friends have done it for the last 30+ years. We focus on the positive, practical aspects, the sense of community and love – the marxism, etc. has never been a part of our celebrations. Specifically the pledge (yes everyone, it’s real)
Frank_D – a cursory check of their board of directors, and major contributors to Peterson’s organization BOND, as well as to his other efforts will answer your question.
StWendeler, JayTea, et al – Peterson is a preacher alright… but he preaches hate, mixed with a healthy dose of “send me money”.
ps – the so called “War on Christmas” (which is so ridiculous it doesn’t merit serious consideration) is a fairly recent phenomena. Kwanzaa’s been around way too long to be “part of it”. And no one I know who celebrates kwanzaa includes Karengas marxist leanings… most pick and choose, and create their own meanings and traditions. And yes, it is a nice alternative to the commercialization of the holiday – handmade gifts, etc.
“The Harry and Jeanette Weinberg Foundation has offered to match every dollar BOND raises up to $75,000 toward reducing the mortgage debt on our Home for Boys. Our ultimate goal is to completely pay off the mortgage so that we can purchase a second Home for Boys to meet the great demand for this critical program.”
http://www.bondinfo.org/donations/building_fund/weinberg/thank_you.htm
As you can imagine, the Weinbergs are white.
http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=46440
“About five years ago, in a debate before the National Association of Black Journalists, I stated that if whites were to just leave the United States and let blacks run the country, they would turn America into a ghetto within 10 years. The audience, shall we say, disagreed with me strongly. Now I have to disagree with me. I gave blacks too much credit. It took a mere three days for blacks to turn the Superdome and the convention center into ghettos, rampant with theft, rape and murder.”
Wow. That is just about the most racist thing I have ever read.
rainlion: Since you feel compelled to answer for Oliver — after all, I asked him how he knew white people were “writing checks” for BOND, not you — perhaps you might tell me where I can make a “cursory check” of major contributors to Peterson’s organization BOND.
Do cons like Sean Hannity and Dennis Prager, who sit on BOND’s board of advisors, share these repugnant racist views? What steps have they taken to distance themselves from these comments?
Those appear to be quite racist remarks. However, they come from a black man, and I have seen it argued repeatedly at other sites that blacks cannot be racist. Now, I think that position is a pile of cow dung, but it is not an uncommon argument.
The principles of Kwanzaa are really quite simple and read like a right-wing pull yourself up by your bootstraps mantra. Rather than focus on inflammatory rhetoric. Focus on the founder’s website of Kwanzaa for his intentions in creating the holiday.
Kwanzaa consists of seven principles:
Umoja (Unity)
To strive for and maintain unity in the family, community, nation and race.
Kujichagulia (Self-Determination)
To define ourselves, name ourselves, create for ourselves and speak for ourselves.
Ujima (Collective Work and Responsibility)
To build and maintain our community together and make our brother’s and sister’s problems our problems and to solve them together.
Ujamaa (Cooperative Economics)
To build and maintain our own stores, shops and other businesses and to profit from them together.
Nia (Purpose)
To make our collective vocation the building and developing of our community in order to restore our people to their traditional greatness.
Kuumba (Creativity)
To do always as much as we can, in the way we can, in order to leave our community more beautiful and beneficial than we inherited it.
Imani (Faith)
To believe with all our heart in our people, our parents, our teachers, our leaders and the righteousness and victory of our struggle.
From the official Kwanzaa website of founder Maulana Karenga.
I would submit that if these universal principles of collective responsibility and uplift bother you, You might be what Jeff Foxworthy calls a “redneck.”
Boyoboy, is factcheck a misnomer for you!
Harry and Jeanette Weinberg are dead.
What a stretch!
Frank, were they white or not? Are their directors white?
rainlion – Is that pledge accurate the way it was presented here previously?
Fastcheck, stop being a clown. The money was donated as a matching pledge by a foundation. That’s like saying the Red Cross is “white.”
That means that it was not given by the dead Weinbergs, because they are, um, dead.
Second, foundations aren’t white — they are philanthropic organizations.
Third, since it was a matching pledge, BOND had to go out and get $75,000 on their own. That’s hardly having “Fat checks written by white folks.”
You picked a bad example. Keep trying.
Frank, I’m not going to indulge your mental illnesses anymore. All you do is insult people here when they catch you in a lie or untruth. It is unfortunate that you communicate in this way, and I refuse to indulge it anymore. Get help.
Oh, my, aren’t we special?
What lie did you catch me in?
I said you picked a bad example — you did.
Again, what lie did I tell?
Why don’t stop feigning superiority, get off your high horse, and stop trying to attack me with no reason.
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