But I’m not going to lie to you…I think liberals in general are light years ahead of conservatives in understanding the problems we’re facing with regard to race, poverty, health care, and so on. Light years.

So, yes, Jay, us liberals, who happen to live mostly in blue states, do have more “insight” into these issues. We do consistently demonstrate more empathy. It’s real. It’s been that way since I’ve been alive and I don’t see it changing any time soon.

Empathy takes you only so far, however. The problem with liberals these days is that they’re not providing any solutions that don’t somehow return to the notion that big government is primarily the answer.

Jay, could you do me a huge favor? When you put something in quotes, could you please clarify the source of the quotes? Based on what you posted above, I could probably find a competent lawyer and sue your ass because in this particular thread, the following words did not come from me:

Your language JK, drips with pity and condescension. Oh those poor black folks. They just can t get ahead. And I m partly to blame because I m caucasian. I automatically got a step up.

This thread is *about* race, specifically, and not class. So, that is why I am talking about race, although I know that they are closely related. Once again, you as a conservative prove my point that conservatives are numb to race. I will summarize my point below:

by virtue of the color of one’s skin, people are treated differently. People make judements based on the pigmentation of a persons skin. THAT is reality. Conservatives are LOATHE to accept that notiion.

As far as the personal stuff…no big deal. I understand now that you were making social commentary.

JK

Right, and you breaking it down to either blue states or red states is one of those supposed complex arguments? Give me a break. Your example was absurd on its face because of the implication that those who reside in those blue states are the ones who have the most insight into arguments about race. When one considers the legions of racists that can be found in the northeast, it’s ridiculous to break it down to blue states and red states.

So many people such as yourself are under this delusion that everybody who votes for a Democrat is a wonderful little liberal that loves all and hates none. I got news for you pal. There’s a lot of people who pull the levers for Democrats because of the whole “working people vs the rich” issue, but are vile racists as well. Wake up and smell the coffee.

You want to take it to this kind of personal level Jay? You sure about this? You ve got some dusty old skeletons in your internet past, son. My suggestion to you, is that you not mess with the one guy who knows about it.

Bring it on. I’ve got NOTHING to hide.

As far as the loathing part& .I m a proud American, of Irish/Italian heritage. I don t hate myself because I m white. So I m not quite sure where you re coming from. On a personal and professional level, things are going fairly well. So, frankly& your comment lacks comprehension.

Nobody’s saying you hate yourself because you’re white. Rather, you take the view that your success comes at the expense of a minority in this country – because you’re white.

Your language JK, drips with pity and condescension. “Oh those poor black folks. They just can’t get ahead. And I’m partly to blame because I’m caucasian. I automatically got a step up.” Every single day there are people coming from poor minority neighborhoods and being successful. The language you use, suggests it’s nothing more than dumb luck when it does happen.

I invite you to visit the south. Visit some of the areas where poor white kids grow up. Kids that have to deal with broken homes, drugs, the lack of discipline. The lack of healthcare. Go an tell those kids not to worry because they have a leg up. After all, they’re white! Maybe then you’ll realize that so many of these problems you talk about have more to do with class than race.

I didn’t rip Jay for providing anecdotal evidence–I don’t necesssarilly think that one should casually dismiss anecdotal evidence if it has some weight, credibility and validity behind it. People should share their experiences, after all. Particularly if they are valuable. (Please keep in mind, nitwit, that I’ve got a much larger “data set” of anecdotal evidence with which to make my point, being an actual resident of the State in question. )

I have noticed, however, that it is most often conservatives that like to point out specific, simplistic instances to prove or disprove complex arguments when it comes to race, specifically. For example…they point to Colin Powell, or Condi Rice, or Michael Jordan as examples of success in the African-American community. While it’s true that they are admired, accomplished people and great Americans in the eyes of many, you simply can’t make the argument that everyone else in their racial group can sucessfully follow the same path. It discounts so many variables such as the quality of parenting, access to affordable health care, proper nutrition, relationships with teachers, community, pressure from peers, family income and so on. You probably like to call them excuses. I call it reality.

I personally think that if kids are taught to be responsible people by their parents, or guardians, that’s half the battle. There are a lot of lousy parents out there, regardless of race.

However, if you happen to reside in a community that doesn’t present viable options to children, it’s not suprising that many of them look at the world and think that there’s nothing out there for them, so why bother? If you give them a chance to give a shit about the world and see their part in it, then you’ve gone a long way towards making them decent people that have something to offer.

JK

But to blame it all on that is just asshattery.

Did I claim ALL poverty was due to single-parent families? Who’s the “dumbass” who can’t read for comprehension?

Additionally, are you trying to argue that single motherhood is not a major risk factor for poverty? YES or NO? If your answer is no (which is the correct answer), then why are you calling me a dumbass?

Of course there are other factors…the comment I was addressing linked poverty to capitalism. So I would like to know how single parenthood is related to capitalism, since the majority of those in poverty are in single parent homes.

Have you considered why most of America s poor are indeed poor? Single parenthood. I m not sure why this is the fault of capitalism.

Are you really that much of a dumbass, or do you just like to look like one? Yes, of course, single parenthood is the only reason why there’s so many poor in America. That really explains everything, doesn’t it? Except, most of the poor families I knew growing up (and I knew a lot, because mine was one of them) were two-parent households. That was in the late 80s through the late 90s, when I got out of there (thanks to government-funded Pell grants and state grants).

Single parenthood should not be a reason for poverty in America. Many families were raised comfortably in single-income homes. My parents were. Problem is, that can’t be done anymore. Whose fault is that? Who knows. But to blame it all on that is just asshattery.

Ah yes, the same Howard Dean that had absolutely no blacks in any important positions on his primary campaign until Al Sharpton shamed him into hiring a few (I ll give him a pass on the fact that he had no blacks working for him in Vermont because that s not exactly a hotspot for young, black talent).

I’ll give you that. I wouldn’t say Sharpton shamed him into it, but certainly he needed a more diverse primary staff.

This is also the same Howard Dean that thinks only black people do menial hotel jobs, making him the Vicente Fox of American politics.

I don’t remember him ever saying that. He never said only blacks do menial hotel jobs. What he said was that the only blacks who would be at a Republican fund-raising dinner would be the waitstaff, which is pretty true.

This kind of talk drives me batty. Boston had a bad, deserved reputation in the 60′s and 70′s because we did have serious race issues–busing, namely. South Boston, in particular, was not at all a friendly place for blacks and other minorities in those days.

But…uh…Oliver. That was 30 years ago? Minorty population is increasing rapidly in Boston, and while we don’t see as much minority participation in local government as we’d like, the environment is much, much improved from the days when young black children were stoned by the rednecks who lived in Southie.

I never lived in Boston, but worked in the city for almost a decade, and spent a *lot* of my social time in the city (translation…in bars…guilty). I honestly can’t recall a single “racial” event such as the one Jay’s brother was a witness to. Perhaps it’s the social “circle” I hang out with, or the kind of places we were attracted to….but many of those places that I hung out in Boston, Allston, Brighton and Cambridge you would NOT take your Mother to.

Jay’s trying to paint this picture that Boston is currently full of these kind of goons. It’s just not true.

And your broad brush Oliver, isn’t helping Boston shed that label either. Are there still pockets of racism in the city? Sure. But 1.) Things are much better than they were 2.) Those kinds of attitudes aren’t at all representative of the vast majority of the people of Boston, and MOST certainly, the state of Massachusetts or New England in general.

JK

This is also the same Howard Dean that thinks only black people do menial hotel jobs, making him the Vicente Fox of American politics.

And really, Oliver, your whole thing about Boston being a racist town but not the rest of these liberal, northeastern bastions, you must live in a pretty small world.

Philly’s in the Northeast and this city is racist as hell too. You think all those white union members who vote Democratic because their union boss tells them to would like it if you walked into the bar they hang in?

And of course, racism is a two-way street here, as indicated by the fact that our mayor, Mr John “THE BROTHERS AND SISTERS ARE RUNNING THIS CITY, THE BROTHERS AND SISTERS ARE IN CHARGE” Street paid no political price whatsoever for that stupid comment. In fact, the group he made it in front of cheered emphatically cheered him for making it.

And, you also have a North Philly “Community Group” fighting a condo development in Brewerytown because, God forbid, some white people might buy those condos and as the leader of the group said “THIS IS A BLACK COMMUNITY”.

I mean, hell, I understand the concerns of many about gentrification and whatnot, and property taxes skyrocketing, but that doesn’t seem to be a big concern for this guy and his group. He’s just worried that some crackers might move in.

Successful capitalism depends on this under-class to encourage the others.

Have you considered why most of America’s poor are indeed poor? Single parenthood. I’m not sure why this is the fault of capitalism.

LA and MS sure as heck could have used every last man, woman, and helicopter recently.

There are approximately 12,000 LA Guard personnel with about 8,000 still in LA. The LA governor called up about half of that (3,500) to assist after the hurricane. Obviously, the governor disagreed with you.

The National Guard belongs at home guarding the nation.

The Guard has a dual purpose…your opinion is that it should have only one purpose…so change the law.

It s a lot more likely in the red state south

I heard many more racist comments during the 5 years I lived in Chicago than I have ever heard anywhere while living in the south. Maybe southerners are more polite and hide their racism among other whites?

Out of curiousity, however…..I just now did a Google on “Self-Hating White Man.” What’s the CURRENT thinking on this “Self-Hating White Man.” Inquiring minds want to know.

What was the first hit in my Google search? A rant about Michael Moore on the official website of one David Duke.

One again, Jay Caruso finds himself in great company.

Old habits die hard, my friend.

JK

So& tell me again, JWG, how there are twice as many whites living in poverty?

The original post was about Republicans and black people. Additionally, New Orleans is racially 95% black and white combined. Hispanics made up less than 3%.

However, you are correct that if you add the Hispanic poor to the African-American poor across the country, then there are no longer twice as many “white” poor as everyone else. But why do we primarily associate “poor” with ethnic minorities? And why do we forget that the overwhelming majority of ethnic minorities are not poor?

Additionally, why do you think the Hispanic number is even higher than the number for African-Americans? I’ll give you a hint…it starts with an “i”.

(Immigrants from Latin countries don’t usually start off with much money.)

You get an A+ in my book. However, Bill Clinton allowed over 500,000 Rwandans to be needlessly slaughtered in a massive genocide he knew was brewing and he lifted not one finger to stop. He also dropped the ball on providing generic AIDS medications to the hardest hit sub Saharan African countries. Bush, Cheney, Rove, Rice, Rumsfeld and Powell are not blameless either for their lapses that have caused millions of lives to be sacrificed and democratic governments to be overthrown (Haiti), but let us not forget the feckless political expedience that caused an atrocity like Rwanda to occur without interference while our military forces were finally deployed to Bosnia to stop the same thing from occurring to white people.