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(By the way… all you assholes attacking Cindy Sheehan should go eat shit, die, and rot in hell.)

Twice as many people ARE against the war as for it, if you count 1) those who think the whole thing was an illegal premeditated con-job & a disguised oil war, 2) those who think that even if removing Saddam was a good thing, it wasn’t worth the blood and treasure to have gone in, and 3) those who buy Bush’s justifications, but think the administration has bungled the effort in a disgraceful fashion, and shouldn’t have gone in with so little international support. I maintain that around 2/3 of Americans are represented in the three groups above, and about 1/3 are all for it, no questions asked, as is.

You gutless retards arguing for Bush should grow a spine and maybe a brain on top to match. I have both, and I understand what’s going on just fine.

So, JD, here’s your one last chance:

GO AHEAD AND DEFEND BUSH FOR MAKING JOKES ABOUT LOOKING FOR WMD’S, GRINNING WHILE SEARCHING UNDER HIS DESK FOR THEM, WHILE MEN LIKE CASEY SHEEHAN WERE DYING LOOKING FOR THEM.

Either specifically and convincingly defend your pathetically unfit leader, or don’t bother responding to me again.

PS: I write the high points in all-cap because many people skim the posts, and I want the main ideas to catch their eyes. But thanks for mistaking them for emphatic closing arguments; guess that means they’d have weight even without the caps!

Olliver, you are a smart guy don’t sully that with this bullshit stuff. Where is your kryptonite?

30 years ago we had a fubared war, today no different. OP truth puts an ad in the paper and garners 1.5 billion.

That is a protest. Granted its straight to the point. But the only reason I know about it is because I have signed more petitions and joined more email lists than normal humans do.

Most of america have no idea bout the ad. I stick to my original point.

If kery knew the value of a soldier protesting the war, then don’t you think Cindy Sheehan knows the value of a mother of a falen soldier protesting the war?

Go find that green rock dude, you need it now more than ever.

How come “I Am a Man” is not a slogan but “Social Justice” is?

Social Justice is what got you as a black person to be able to drink from the same water fountains as white people.

Thats what social justice is.

Yes the Media matters but it is one prong in the approach to achieving social justice. Protesting is the other.

The reason our approach is getting beaten down is because Cindy Sheehan and her supporters are in Crawford instead of on the Nationa Mall.

You forget that in the 60’s John Kerry and a bunch soldiers did what Cindy Sheehan is doing excpet they did it in front of the capitol building and the White House.

That is where Cindy should go next and all kinds of soldiers should follow.

I think it would he hard for reporters leacing daily press gaggles in the white house to pass by all those anti-war people and not be compelled to cover it.

So Oliver, for god’s sake you are totally fucking crazily wrong on this. You need a multi-pronged approach and just fixing the message alone will not do it.

By Garnering a reporter to ask these folks questions you get a variety of messages each with a potential to hit home with a variety of people.

So protesting is not only a way of getting the message out its a way of garnering attention to various messages on a grander scale than say focus grouping.

Your specific and idea driven complaints sound like the laundry list of complaints (read : Republicans and President Bush are evile) that are trotted out daily by the folks at Kos, Atrios, Moore, etc …

Sigh. Even you have resorted to nastiness.

” You actually believe that a peaceful assembly of like-minded folks to air their views is  anti-democratic ?”

Well, no – not particularly – especially since that is not what I said. You, not me, characterized a protest only as a peaceful assembly of folks airing their views. Is that all it is? Just a little congregation singing hymns out in the lonely pasture. There’s no attempt to gain a doisproportionate (sic – saved you the trouble) voice by being loud and provocative? To have the media treat the screamed views of a small vocal cadre on par with the views of the majority of the country? I argue it could be anti-democratic at its core (in theory) because in doing so a minority is seeking via the tactic of protest, as it is in reality, to gain a dispropriotnate (see the above sic) share of influence.

Dugger, I Reject Thoreau’s Philosophy and Thoreau Rejects Mine

Oh. My. God.

Please tell me you don’t really believe this. You actually believe that a peaceful assembly of like-minded folks to air their views is “anti-democratic”? You, sir, are a dumbass.

You guys are saying that, after Cindy Sheehan’s son got his guts blown out looking for WMD’s, and then saw smirk-meister Bush on tape joking around about the search for them, at one point looking under his desk… that she’s not supposed to protest? THAT, AS YOUR PROPAGANDA OUTLETS PUT IT, SHE’S A “LEFT-WING MEDIA WHORE?” THAT SHE’S (to quote Limbaugh) “MAKING THE WHOLE THING UP?”

When you’re protesting, only one thing counts: that you have a point. Bush’s war is a mistake in search of a rationale, and kids are dying for it. THAT’S A FACT. Compare that to the protest at Terry Shiavo’s location… The zealots protesting there were die-hard life-at-all-costs morons, saying a judicial murder of a conscious woman was taking place, and the neo-cons made political hay out of it and got bit on the ass. Why? BECAUSE THEY WERE WRONG. Had Terry been found to have hearing, vision, and cognition centers left in her brain, ther would have been hell to pay. But no. Just right-wing lies again.

Iraq is an unjustifiable war, and will be remembered as a war crime; Bush a war criminal. Thousands of innocent Iraqi women and children were burned, shot, blown apart because of a war Bush shoved down the throats of Congress, the public, the world under false (and still-changing) pretenses… AND WE SHOULDN’T PROTEST IT?

Kiss my ass.

“Republicans have to defend against the truth; Democrats have to defend against lies.”
That’s more true today than when it was first written.

It’s just that simple. And it can be proven by their rhetoric: our commentary is specific and idea-driven complaints about real, concrete words and actions by our ‘leaders’, and the right-wing response is all ad hominem smears and attacks, but rarely a refutation of the charge itself. That’s why we make signs: to counter the right’s lie machine (see also Fox News).

I’ll hate Bush, Cheney, Rove, Ashcroft and their pals ’til the day I die, AND I HAVE A CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FEEL THAT WAY, AND TO SAY SO IN PUBLIC.

Oh, and one more thing: TWICE AS MANY AMERICANS ARE AGAINST THE WAR AS FOR IT, so you can knock off the subtext implying that war protesters are some tiny lunatic fringe. Pretty soon the only tiny lunatic fringe will be those still supporting Emperor George & his slimy fellow criminals.