Comments on: Hillary & The DLC http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/ Like Kryptonite To Stupid Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:59:42 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.2 By: tiponeill http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3074 tiponeill Thu, 28 Jul 2005 19:07:05 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3074 The problem is that Hillary isn't only a polarizing figure to the right - she is turning herself into a polarizing figure to the left, too, evidently to appeal to the "middle". If I had to I MIGHT be able to hold my nose and vote for her, but it would be difficult and there certainly won't be any enthusiam. That's the problem with the middle - they don't get very enthusiastic. The problem is that Hillary isn’t only a polarizing figure to the right - she is turning herself into a polarizing figure to the left, too, evidently to appeal to the “middle”.

If I had to I MIGHT be able to hold my nose and vote for her, but it would be difficult and there certainly won’t be any enthusiam.

That’s the problem with the middle - they don’t get very enthusiastic.

]]> By: BinkyBoy http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3073 BinkyBoy Wed, 27 Jul 2005 15:07:13 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3073 If she can't garner the votes, the primaries will leave her behind. I understand the Red State thing, I live in one myself. I believe we need a centrist president, but given the right-wing level of hatred for anything Clintoon, Hillary would be forced further and further leftward by those that seek her destruction. But hey, I'm not against a Hillary presidency if the American people make it happen, which polls show they are leaning towards it. And my favorite curse: May you live in exciting times. If she can’t garner the votes, the primaries will leave her behind. I understand the Red State thing, I live in one myself.

I believe we need a centrist president, but given the right-wing level of hatred for anything Clintoon, Hillary would be forced further and further leftward by those that seek her destruction.

But hey, I’m not against a Hillary presidency if the American people make it happen, which polls show they are leaning towards it.

And my favorite curse: May you live in exciting times.

]]> By: FLJerseyBoy http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3072 FLJerseyBoy Wed, 27 Jul 2005 03:07:55 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3072 Bink, no, my antipathy towards her is NOT personal and has nothing to do with whether or not she's "very well liked" here or elsewhere. (Just as I'm "with" Jane Fonda philosophically and politically.) It has everything to do with the likely political bloodbath in the event of her candidacy. I don't know what poll(s) you're referring to, but would be very surprised if the curve is at all bell-shaped. I believe she (much more than Bill) is a polarizer, whether or not she's viewed as "more centrist than polarized"; you and I may agree that the reasons for her negatives don't make sense on any scale of decency and common sense, but you and I don't need convincing. I think the Dems can do a hell of a lot better for the country -- and for the party, and for the future of lefty causes -- than to choose someone whom even (or especially) good lefties sometimes find difficult to embrace. Who knows? Maybe it's just that I live in a Red state, where the bloodhounds are always eager for new Clinton blood. Bink, no, my antipathy towards her is NOT personal and has nothing to do with whether or not she’s “very well liked” here or elsewhere. (Just as I’m “with” Jane Fonda philosophically and politically.) It has everything to do with the likely political bloodbath in the event of her candidacy. I don’t know what poll(s) you’re referring to, but would be very surprised if the curve is at all bell-shaped. I believe she (much more than Bill) is a polarizer, whether or not she’s viewed as “more centrist than polarized”; you and I may agree that the reasons for her negatives don’t make sense on any scale of decency and common sense, but you and I don’t need convincing. I think the Dems can do a hell of a lot better for the country — and for the party, and for the future of lefty causes — than to choose someone whom even (or especially) good lefties sometimes find difficult to embrace.

Who knows? Maybe it’s just that I live in a Red state, where the bloodhounds are always eager for new Clinton blood.

]]> By: BinkyBoy http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3071 BinkyBoy Tue, 26 Jul 2005 21:07:37 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3071 Sounds like someone believes that their personal feelings towards HC is the same as the rest of the country. You need to realize that HC polls incredibly well, the Clintons are very well liked not only in America but worldwide, and are seen as people that are more centrist than polarized. Gosh, what a bitch that Hillary must be. Sounds like someone believes that their personal feelings towards HC is the same as the rest of the country. You need to realize that HC polls incredibly well, the Clintons are very well liked not only in America but worldwide, and are seen as people that are more centrist than polarized.

Gosh, what a bitch that Hillary must be.

]]> By: FLJerseyBoy http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3070 FLJerseyBoy Tue, 26 Jul 2005 18:07:12 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3070 There are times when I seriously wish HC would just be content as a Senator For Life. <a href="http://whereleftisright.blogspot.com/2005/07/stars-in-our-eyes.html" rel="nofollow">In my opinion</a>, this ties into what you (OW) said earlier about Jane Fonda's intentions to Go Public/Go Big on behalf of the anti(Iraq)war campaign: Sometimes these people seem to have no realistic recognition of how they are perceived publicly (outside their natural base of allies that is). It's like they can see themselves riding in on white stallions and rescuing the republic. Which might actually happen if it weren't for the surly folks manning the gates and readying fistfuls of eggs and tomatoes. There are times when I seriously wish HC would just be content as a Senator For Life. In my opinion, this ties into what you (OW) said earlier about Jane Fonda’s intentions to Go Public/Go Big on behalf of the anti(Iraq)war campaign: Sometimes these people seem to have no realistic recognition of how they are perceived publicly (outside their natural base of allies that is). It’s like they can see themselves riding in on white stallions and rescuing the republic. Which might actually happen if it weren’t for the surly folks manning the gates and readying fistfuls of eggs and tomatoes.

]]> By: SonnyDR http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3069 SonnyDR Tue, 26 Jul 2005 16:07:38 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3069 DLC is just another problem facing America. Another group claiming to work for the people of the US but really are just focused on corporations. DLC should be called Democrats Like Corporations. Yeah I love what they stand for also, except that isn't what they stand for, just what they put on their website - they are the republican wing of the Democratic party. The only reason they should even be heard is because we lost the republicans to crazy right-wing hypocrits. Just look at what they champion - CAFTA is a scam for America and every third world country involved. That law only benefits treasonous unloyal corporations that find any way to avoid paying taxes while screwing the labor force with minimal wages and poor compensation. Or we have myopia on what Nafta has done, especially in Ohio?? And what I mostly dislike about the DLC is how they are focused on what I call "let's ignore the real issue" issues like "corrosive popular culture". The ridiculous violence in the games ok, drug cartels and kidnappings in games ok, terrorist in games ok, but a thong "OH MY GOD!!" how can they let a thong out in a game, kids are going to be corrupt - what a joke. You want to help our kids, improve our fledgling education system so kids know the difference between a game and real life, improve our health system (what happened to the health care Hillary????) get rid of guns so that our kids with little education won't get confused with reality. And give out some freaking condoms - holy moly teens have had sex since the beginning of time - Jesus hasn't changed that and no one else will!! DLC is just another problem facing America. Another group claiming to work for the people of the US but really are just focused on corporations. DLC should be called Democrats Like Corporations.

Yeah I love what they stand for also, except that isn’t what they stand for, just what they put on their website - they are the republican wing of the Democratic party. The only reason they should even be heard is because we lost the republicans to crazy right-wing hypocrits.

Just look at what they champion - CAFTA is a scam for America and every third world country involved. That law only benefits treasonous unloyal corporations that find any way to avoid paying taxes while screwing the labor force with minimal wages and poor compensation. Or we have myopia on what Nafta has done, especially in Ohio??

And what I mostly dislike about the DLC is how they are focused on what I call “let’s ignore the real issue” issues like “corrosive popular culture”. The ridiculous violence in the games ok, drug cartels and kidnappings in games ok, terrorist in games ok, but a thong “OH MY GOD!!” how can they let a thong out in a game, kids are going to be corrupt - what a joke.

You want to help our kids, improve our fledgling education system so kids know the difference between a game and real life, improve our health system (what happened to the health care Hillary????) get rid of guns so that our kids with little education won’t get confused with reality. And give out some freaking condoms - holy moly teens have had sex since the beginning of time - Jesus hasn’t changed that and no one else will!!

]]> By: tiponeill http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3068 tiponeill Tue, 26 Jul 2005 16:07:33 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3068 Well we may be in a middle east quagmire and outsourcing our jobs and having a bankruptcy bill and right wing supreme court and the gays are safely back in the closet or jail - but at least the kids will be protected from Grand Theft Auto. Well we may be in a middle east quagmire and outsourcing our jobs and having a bankruptcy bill and right wing supreme court and the gays are safely back in the closet or jail - but at least the kids will be protected from Grand Theft Auto.

]]> By: Dugger http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3067 Dugger Tue, 26 Jul 2005 15:07:25 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3067 Hillary says she'll vote yea for Roberts; talks strong on defense, moderatety on abortions. Your party's real standard bearer has good instincts and wants to be president. She aligns with the DLC. I think she wll be president and that as with the transiton from Bubba to W, there will be very little real difference in our day to day lives (from W) - under a moderately governing Hillary. The real story is how long the political left of the Democratic Party has been out in the cold, not only from national elective office, but within the Democratic Party, where Bill Clinton led the DLC half to ascendancy. Dugger Hillary says she’ll vote yea for Roberts; talks strong on defense, moderatety on abortions. Your party’s real standard bearer has good instincts and wants to be president. She aligns with the DLC. I think she wll be president and that as with the transiton from Bubba to W, there will be very little real difference in our day to day lives (from W) - under a moderately governing Hillary. The real story is how long the political left of the Democratic Party has been out in the cold, not only from national elective office, but within the Democratic Party, where Bill Clinton led the DLC half to ascendancy.

Dugger

]]> By: neoconsrloopy http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3066 neoconsrloopy Tue, 26 Jul 2005 13:07:44 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3066 DLC views are not moderate, they are conservative on corporate issues. As such, they offer nothing to the Democratic electorate. DLC views are not moderate, they are conservative on corporate issues. As such, they offer nothing to the Democratic electorate.

]]> By: maaku http://www.oliverwillis.com/2005/07/26/hillary-the-dlc/#comment-3065 maaku Tue, 26 Jul 2005 06:07:43 +0000 http://improveman.com/ow2008/?p=213#comment-3065 I think Matthew Yglesias probably got it right that triangulation is a great strategy when a charismatic leader like Clinton does it, but it requires a solid base to triangulate off, so when the whole Democratic party does it, it's not triangulation any more, it's just wimpiness. I think Matthew Yglesias probably got it right that triangulation is a great strategy when a charismatic leader like Clinton does it, but it requires a solid base to triangulate off, so when the whole Democratic party does it, it’s not triangulation any more, it’s just wimpiness.

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