Novak has written that he called the CIA to confirm Wilson’s identity.
Harlow testified that Novak called him looking for information on Wilson. These are the facts. So Harlow was speaking in an official capacity for the CIA. He told Novak in the strongest possible language not to use Wilson’s name and he used it anyway. Harlow was definitely speaking for the CIA in an official capacity.

You are once again playing not devil’s advocate but devil’s braindead toady if you are entertaining the idea that Harlow called Novak to voice his personal opinion about how to handle publishing information about Valerie Wilson.

I think they have been sloppy with “authorized”. Clearly Val couldn’t and didn’t authorize her own husband to do anything. Everybody involved knows how elementary bureaucracy works.

“But wait, now you re also arguing that as a  CIA spokesman Harlow was some how not speaking for the CIA????”

Add “necesarily” and thats exactly what I am saying (neither one us are really privy to what was said, where and when) . Abso-frappin-lutely. Perhaps you are not familair with government “spokesmen” or information officers. They are not action officers, work no programs or missions. They are passer-throughs of information imparted to them by others – in the real know in the agency. So if he’s talking privately with Novak, its his own nickle. Not the CIAs. We have not heard from the real CIA on this (not Larry Johnson, not Val’s old boss, not Harlow). When we do, we’ll know more.

Dugger

“Rove apparently told Cooper that it was “Wilson’s wife, who apparently works at the agency on [weapons of mass destruction] issues who authorized the trip,” according to a story in Newsweek’s July 18 issue.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/10/AR2005071001000.html

I suppose you’ll take the Hedley defense here that Cooper may have mistakenly replaced “suggested” with “authorized.” Please. The Republicans have repeated the same charge over and over again.

But wait, now you’re also arguing that as a “CIA spokesman” Harlow was some how not speaking for the CIA???? WTF???

And BTW it doesn’t matter that Harlow didn’t talk to Rove. What matters is that Rove never contacted him or apparently anyone else at the agency before he passed Wilson’s identity on to Cooper. Which, even if a negligent leak, is still an illegal leak of classified information.

The meme that Wilson was not an undercover, covert operative is dead. She was. Plain and simple. And plain and simply, you’re an idiot.

And quit using that bad language, young man.

Dugger , These Kids These Days

Novak published Wilson’s name even after the CIA told him he shouldn’t.

Wilson was most assuredly undercover.

As the article states: “Harlow said that after Novak s call, he checked Plame s status and confirmed that she was an undercover operative.”

All of your bullshit about we don’t know Wilson was undercover is now just that: total bullshit. Now that we know definitively that Wilson was undercover it only confirms that Rove should have checked with the CIA before he said anything about her to Novak or Cooper. And let’s also note that Rove’s cover story of “I was just trying to set the record straight” is also, according the CIA itself, total bullshit.

Now we know that in passing off inacurate information about Wilson’s role in her husband’s Niger trip, Rove also revealed the identity of an undercover CIA agent in the process. Indeed, revealing the identity of an undercover CIA agent was essential to convince Cooper that his bullshit story had any validity whatsoever.

As far as I’m concerned it’s game set match for Rove. Either he negligently revealed the id of an undercover officer or he did it knowingly. Either way he’s violated one of two laws and endangered American security.

As to this line:
‘No one has argued as Harlow states that Plame  authorized her husband s trip. Suggested it, maybe augued for it – but not, I m sorry for you and Harlow,  authorized .’

You have got to be kidding me.
http://mediamatters.org/items/200507140001

But he did not tell Novak directly that she was undercover because that was classified.

Did Rove tell Novak that she was undercover? Did the memo say that she was undercover?

Haven’t spun anything yet. But be careful about spin. Spin might be something like the Clintonian manuever of denying a false related/similar charge to make it look like your denying the real charge. Thats spin. No one has argued as Harlow states that Plame “authorized” her husband’s trip. Suggested it, maybe augued for it – but not, I’m sorry for you and Harlow, “authorized”.

Also, none of us knows what Rove did. Evidently Harlow didn’t speak to him at all. Harlow, was the CIA public affairs guy. Not an agent, not an insider – he was their face to the press. He says, unofficially (meaning he wasn’t speaking for the CIA) that she was an undercover operative. But what he says doesn’t matter. What does the CIA say? Fitzgerald? Instead of the Harlow, the MSNBC commentator? Sorry to extinguish your little campfire, but I am ‘authorized’ to do so.

Dugger of the BD, Dugger of the BD, Dugger of the BDAaaaa

Harlow, the former CIA spokesman, said in an interview yesterday that he testified last year before a grand jury about conversations he had with Novak at least three days before the column was published. He said he warned Novak, in the strongest terms he was permitted to use without revealing classified information, that Wilson’s wife had not authorized the mission and that if he did write about it, her name should not be revealed.

Harlow said that after Novak’s call, he checked Plame’s status and confirmed that she was an undercover operative. He said he called Novak back to repeat that the story Novak had related to him was wrong and that Plame’s name should not be used. But he did not tell Novak directly that she was undercover because that was classified.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/26/AR2005072602069_2.html

Nice previous post, huh.

Dugger

Nice language.

“Bill Clinton never sent any soldiers into battle that didn t return. ”

tch tch tch

I ahve no desire to show you up. Ask others – even on the left. I have no deisre to

“No, I guess I don t understand some military people.”

I agree.

Dugger,

Bill Clinton never sent any soldiers into battle that didn’t return.

No, I guess I don’t understand some military people. I don’t understand how some of you can get fucked up the ass again and again and still think the Republicans are great for the military. Educate me, what makes Republicans great for the military? Is it the meaningless wars? Is it the lack of equipment? What is it?

Neo, Neo.

We don’t know if she was covert. Haven’t you been paying attention.

” I don t remember any troops sent into battle under Clinton, you know, dying.”

And because I’m a nice guy, I won’t even point out the silliness of this statement- which I guess is technically correct because you are only stating ‘you don’t remember’ .

Finally, you don’t understand miltary people if you think our value system devolves down to who gives us the most (and of course, Democrats actually ‘give’ nothing – they merely seize it from other producers).

Dugger, Chief of the Sanity Police

If you think the Democrats are “suddenly” pro-military, maybe you should pay attention to who is cutting your military benefits, and eliminating scores of stateside bases, compromising our homeland security. I don’t remember any troops sent into battle under Clinton, you know, dying.

Whatever the reasons for war, Democrats also attack the correct country-

Beirut, Lebanon embassy attacked? Invade Grenada
OBL (Afghanistan) attacked? Invade Iraq

Dugger, All in Good Humor Mr R. Sir.

Nevertheless, the deadender backed you into the corner of admitting your schtick on the Rove thing is all about politics and not at all about national security.

What you here Deadend Dugger. “I’m unpleasant to look at, and my name’s agin me, but I ain’t as bad as I seem.”

Dugger, you’re a deadender. You’ve hit the wall with nothing left but to drag yourself from the wreckage. I think the direction of the last nine posts speaks for itself:

Dugger: Plame/Wilson
frameone: Plame/Wilson
jadegold: Plame/Wilson
frameone: Plame/Wilson
dugger: Plame/Wilson
frameone: Plame/Wilson
dugger:Berger
frameone: uh?
dugger: Berger/Liberals hate the military.

Interesting.

“Am I concerned with the generic problem of secuirty violations or Republicans in power? I am concerned that the actions of some people in power, who happen to be Republicans…”

A simple “yes, I am concerned about all security lapses…” would have sufficed. And then you said Republicans are free to open hearings on Berger. A funny way to put it. Why wouldn’t ALL concerned with national security, including you, want Berger hearings? See, we paranoid right wingers suspect this is all political – part and parcel of the standard “do anything to get Bush and Rs” effort. The investigation is underway and the left is in the media every day talking it up. A fair question is: if national security is the issue and its not a cheap political hit, where were you all on Sandyberger, Sen Leahy etc. Having said that, if Rove committed a crime, he should pay the price. Likewise Berger, Leahy etc. – but please spare the moral outrage. This, for you guys, like the left’s pre-election new-found respect for the military, is all partisan politics.

Defer! Defer to Dugger.

You’re hopeless. That’s not what I said at all. Focussing attention on the issues and facts of the Wilson episode is utterly irrelevent to my opinion on Berger et al. I note that Berger was fined $10,000 and that the Republicans are free to open congressional hearings (with subpeona powers) anytime they want into any allegation they want. They, afterall, are the ones running the show.

What’s clear, however, is that you’ve reached the dead end of your own arguments about the matter at hand in this thread and so have attempted the old GOP tactic of, what else, changing the subject by attacking my motives. Interestingly enough, precisely the maneuver that, it would seem, lead to the scandal now unfolding around Rove.